"Idiocracy was a documentary/prophecy", and other elitist nonsense

[NoXion]

I'm seeing this kind of sentiment with increasing frequency these days. I'll be upfront and admit that I haven't seen the movie, but I'm in a rotten mood and feel like ripping into something, so I'll say it sounds like a bunch of softcore fascist propaganda. Anti-democratic bullshit that attempts to prime the viewer's mind into accepting eugenics and similar elitist shit. Scratch a Hollywood liberal, find a neo-fascist kinda shit. Fuck that movie right in its smug fucking face.

Another movie that gets quoted a lot is Men In Black, specifically the "people are dumb panicky animals and you know it" line. Apparently people can spend their entire lives consuming media involving contact with aliens, but apparently we're all supposed to lose our shit and revert to base animality the moment such things become real. Which flies right in the face of the tinfoil notion that the general public is being primed for first contact via alien depictions in the media.

George Carlin also gets invoked, especially his quote of "think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." I've never agreed with that sentiment. Intelligence isn't static, even if someone is genuinely lacking in brainpower, I still think that said person can be able to realise their limitations, without degrading themselves in the process.

Am I the only one who is deeply bothered by the seeming growth of this kind of fatalistic and deeply misanthropic shit? Despite my unwavering antipathy towards loonspuddery and other (semi-)organised forms of stupidity, I do believe that people can be better than that. I feel like there'd be no point even paying attention to this kind of thing, if the people involved were all lost causes. But the idea of just giving up doesn't sit right with me, like it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy the moment you do that. It feels better to struggle and potentially fail, than it does to never even bother in the first place, and thus automatically fail by default.

But if the situation is somehow currently intractable, then I still think that it matters how we choose to pick up the pieces afterwards. I don't have a clue how to move forwards on this, but what I am murderously certain of is that giving into lazy, cookie-cutter cynicism doesn't help anyone.

This turned into a bit of rant/ramble, and might be out of place. But I guess I wanted serious replies, so chose this subforum.

 

[DotCommunist]

I'll be upfront and admit that I haven't seen the movie

the bestial poors are outbreeding us.

 

[NoXion]

the bestial poors are outbreeding us.

Wow. That's actually worse than I thought it would be.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

the bestial poors are outbreeding us.

That's some deeply classist shit right there. It's also not at all accurate from my experience. I've always been poor and not only never wanted children but never had any, and there's plenty of others I've encountered over the years who were the same.

I've also not seen this film.

 

[N_igma]

It’s been a good few years since I have seen that movie but isn’t it meant to be a satire of all that way of thinking? I’m pretty sure Mike Judge the director is not a fascist or anything close.

 

[AmateurAgitator]

It’s been a good few years since I have seen that movie but isn’t it meant to be a satire of all that way of thinking? I’m pretty sure Mike Judge the director is not a fascist or anything close.

I've seen Office Space and I enjoyed it. A good film, even though Jennifer Aniston is in it.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I wouldn't say it was growing - it's always been there as far as I can see, and certainly amongst liberals and the left. It's all about social prejudice and that's pretty consistent.

 

[DotCommunist]

It’s been a good few years since I have seen that movie but isn’t it meant to be a satire of all that way of thinking? I’m pretty sure Mike Judge the director is not a fascist or anything close.

There is a self deprecatory note in that the protagonist is just an ordinary joe in the land of the moron future, but really, that's the concept run with iirc. Its been a while also. I don't think he's anything approaching fash either, I rate Hank Hill as intrinsically funnier than Homer Simpson as a character, the show has more heart than simpsons overall. But that's still an ABC of social darwinism done with a wink isn't it

 

[NoXion]

It’s been a good few years since I have seen that movie but isn’t it meant to be a satire of all that way of thinking? I’m pretty sure Mike Judge the director is not a fascist or anything close.

Wouldn't surprise me if a lot of people are taking it the wrong way, in that case. Certainly wouldn't be the first time. Seems to be a perennial risk with satire, a genre I'm starting to dislike because so many people want to do it, but so few people are actually any good at it.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Wouldn't surprise me if a lot of people are taking it the wrong way, in that case. Certainly wouldn't be the first time. Seems to be a perennial risk with satire, a genre I'm starting to dislike because so many people want to do it, but so few people are actually any good at it.

My problem with the 'it's satire' defence is that the film doesn't target malthusians or social darwinists, it targets imaginary people. Precisely the same imaginary subhuman underclass the malthusians warn us about.

It's also not funny.

 

[8ball]

… another movie that gets quoted a lot is Men In Black, specifically the "people are dumb panicky animals and you know it" line.

Bit unfair - you left out the four words immediately preceding that quote - the ones that make it a statement about the behaviour of groups and how variable that can be.

If you want to see a bit of semi-enjoyable misanthropy from people with eye-watering amounts of money, you might want to check out Don’t Look Up.

Take beta blockers beforehand if you have any high blood pressure issues.

 

[8ball]

I've seen Office Space and I enjoyed it. A good film, even though Jennifer Aniston is in it.

She’s fine in it.
And yeah, Office Space is v. enjoyable as well as being gently subversive in many places.

I agree with most of what has been said here about Idiocracy.

 

[danny la rouge]

I’ve not seen the film. Indeed I didn’t understand the thread title when I first read it. I therefore haven’t been aware of references to it in public discourse, but I do of course recognise the liberal elitism the thread discusses.

 

[8ball]

I’ve not seen the film. Indeed I didn’t understand the thread title when I first read it. I therefore haven’t been aware of references to it in public discourse, but I do of course recognise the liberal elitism the thread discusses.

If you’ve looked at DC’s post and the attached vid, you’re already pretty much up to speed.

 

[BigTom]

There's an interview here with Mike Judge where he talks about idiocracy: ‘Idiocracy’ Director Mike Judge: Fox Killed Our Anti-Trump Camacho Ads

It generated such a spirited response that Cohen reached out to longtime collaborator Mike Judge, the director of Idiocracy, and by June the word had spread that the two were cooking up a series of anti-Trump ads featuring the film’s President Camacho (full name: President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Drew Herbert Camacho), an ex-porn star and five-time wrestling champion played by the hilarious Terry Crews.
...
“It kind of fell apart,” Judge tells The Daily Beast. “It was announced that they were anti-Trump, and I would’ve preferred to make them and then have the people decide. Terry Crews had wanted to just make some funny Camacho ads, and Etan [Cohen] and I had written a few that I thought were pretty funny, and it just fell apart. I wanted to put them out a little more quietly and let them go viral, rather than people announcing we’re making anti-Trump ads. Just let them be funny first. Doing something satirical like that is better if you just don’t say, ‘Here we come with the anti-Trump ads!’ Also, when Terry heard that announcement he wasn’t happy about it.

...

“Three or four years ago, I started getting comments about it, people discovering it, and it just keeps building. Now every other Twitter comment I get is about Idiocracy, and how it’s a documentary now,” says Judge. “At first, I was just thinking, yeah, that’s nice to hear, but then very specific things, like Carl’s Jr. announcing that they were going to have a completely robotic, non-employee store—and it’s Carl’s Jr. in the movie. Then there’s this thing called the Fellatio Café in Switzerland where you get blowjobs with coffee, and we had the Starbucks thing in there. And then Donald Trump being in the WWF before, and talking about his penis size. It’s just one specific thing after another!”

“It’s surreal,” he adds, chuckling. “I didn’t want Idiocracy to get popular by the world getting stupider faster. I guess I was 450 years off! But yeah, it’s a tad bit scary!”

Clearly his politics is not fascist but I don't think they were satirising malthusians / classist stuff with the film either. I think he was satirising America and classism came out of that.
The film is full of middle class snobbery about what working class people like when it comes to culture, not just the intro / premise of the film.

 

[danny la rouge]

If you’ve looked at DC’s post and the attached vid, you’re already pretty much up to speed.

Yup, I feel I now know everything I need to on the matter.

 

[MickiQ]

I've seen it, it's a comedy film not an accurate attempt to predict the future, it does have some funny moments but it's hardly a classic. Full of logical inconsistencies though. The average intelligence of humans has fallen to the point where the inability to put a square block into a round hole is considered average and no-one understands that plants need watering. Yet there is still advanced technology around no matter how intermittent it is, so who's running things the robots? so where are they?
If human intelligence had fallen that far then civilisation would have gone with it and natural selection which is a brutal and unsympathetic teacher would be raising it again.

 

[Carl Steele]

I haven't seen the film and have no intention of watching it, but intelligence has very little to do with how our society functions. And whatever intelligence is (and we don't really know) it is not IQ, which is a standardised aptitude test. How do you compare the intelligence of a particle physicist and a concert pianist? Make them take an IQ test? David Beckham, for example, is not an idiot, far from it, but he is inarticulate. And he's working class (or was) and so, because of his accent and lack of vocabulary he's called inferior, which justifies an unjust and brutal social system.

 

[spanglechick]

I’ve seen it. My ex really likes it, in a stoner humour way. I find is really horrible, though. Sneering and snobby.

 

[8ball]

I've seen it, it's a comedy film not an accurate attempt to predict the future, it does have some funny moments but it's hardly a classic. Full of logical inconsistencies though. The average intelligence of humans has fallen to the point where the inability to put a square block into a round hole is considered average and no-one understands that plants need watering. Yet there is still advanced technology around no matter how intermittent it is, so who's running things the robots? so where are they?
If human intelligence had fallen that far then civilisation would have gone with it and natural selection which is a brutal and unsympathetic teacher would be raising it again.

I think different people have a different bar for how many logical inconsistencies they can handle in a comedy etc.

But yeah, what you said.

And what Spanglechick said.

 

[Santino]

I have seen the film but I refuse to contribute to this conversation.

 

[Rob Ray]

The basic premise is pretty dodgy in that mindless bigoted (particularly from media types) way of thinking that "stupid rednecks will outbreed over-intellectual (haha we recognise ourselves) city types," beyond that it's a standard liberal satire of US consumer society with a lot of cartoon aspects which people can lay their prejudices on however they like. Eg. Camacho is nothing like Trump really, but it fits Democrats' sneering to say they're basically the same because Boorish Spectacle and Flag Hugging. Not really worth the hype either for its message or its main conceits, tbh.

 

[discokermit]

i like the film. it may try to have a liberal intellectual sneer but fails by making the future look better than now.
and camacho is a great president.

 

[Raheem]

I have seen the film but I refuse to contribute to this conversation.

I haven't seen the film and I'm working on a 2000-word rebuttal of everything that's been said about it, good and bad.

 

[hitmouse]

...I have to admit I really enjoyed the bit with the electrolytes. It probably is quite problematic overall, but then so are a lot of things. Been ages since I saw it though.

 

[krtek a houby]

Haven't seen the film but am outraged all the same. Also, haven't read Bakunin, Grisham or Rowling.

 

[hitmouse]

Also, haven't read Bakunin, Grisham or Rowling.

The holy trinity?

 

[Reno]

During the Trump presidency the film started to be discussed again for obvious reasons, but Idiocracy has been called out for its classist politics for years:

'Idiocracy' Is Bad, Actually

You know who'd find the movie hilarious? Hitler.

www.vice.com

"Idiocracy's" curdled politics: The beloved dystopian comedy is really a celebration of eugenics

Trump has triggered a wave of nostalgia for the mid-aughts cult classic. Few remember just how noxious it really is

www.salon.com

I don't see a lot of discussion of Men in Black, mostly a harmless sci-fi comedy. If you don't like characters being nihilistic, better not watch any film noir.

 

[Yossarian]

Am I the only one who is deeply bothered by the seeming growth of this kind of fatalistic and deeply misanthropic shit?

I saw this a long time ago, but for some reason I'd been thinking it was a '90s movie - it seems like even lazier satire knowing now that it came out in 2005, five years after Yale-educated aristocratic moron George W. Bush was elected president.

More recently, we've seen the same train of thought from people who, despite mountains of evidence to the contrary, blame climate change and other degradation of the environment on poor people who have numerous children instead of on richer people/countries who use a vastly disproportionate share of the world's resources.

 

[rekil]

Everyone so stoopit except for me and my mate Alex fucking Jones.

Mike Judge invited Alex Jones to his Austin Tx home for a one on one interview. Mike covered the current IRS scandal, Alex's epic interview on Piers Morgan, and The 2nd Amendment Debate. He gave insights into his groundbreaking animation, movies and style of satire that is now proving to be prophetic.

Nein danke.

His backpedalling about that relationship is more sad than amusing.