Housing for gfs friend outstaying welcome

[persimmon]

My gf (35) lives in a one bed flat in London with her 6yo son (shared contact). Her friend N (40+, EU national) has been living in the flat for over 6 months across the last 2 years. She sleeps on a mattress in the living room, her suitcases in the corner.

N works 20hrs pw as front of house staff and she can only work pt for health reasons. She said she has chronic fatigue but has no diagnosis other than a letter from a doctor for "extreme tiredness". She has contacted local council for housing support and she has said she would need to find a landlord who accepts benefits to be able to move in anywhere. She said she is waiting for the council to help her out but that they will only provide housing if she is on the streets. She is still grieving the loss of her father who lived in Europe and sadly passed away in January and feels comforted living with my gf who is supporting her through a difficult time.

She has given my gf £30 towards bills in 2 years. In this time she has taken a trip to New York for leisure and several trips to Sweden for family matters.

My gf says that she feels invaded and needs space, the situation is impacting her and her son. there is no space for us to hang out in the morning or late evening as N is usually sleeping in the living room. My gf has recently asked her to leave for a couple of weeks but she will be back after that.

I've asked N what her plan is and how she's trying to help herself and she's responded that she has emailed the council and has blamed the doctor and the council. She would seem to think they are responsible and also is deflecting responsibility and diverting the topic when I chat with her.

Any advice?

 

[Thora]

So is N staying elsewhere at the moment? Message N and say unfortunately the situation isn't working anymore and she won't be able to stay again.

 

[persimmon]

She has stayed at my gfs place for the last 2 months.
Previously she had a place to stay with other friends in London where she would go for a few weeks then move between family in Sweden and London. Not sure if she has fallen out with or overstayed welcome with other friends but she to have made my gfs flat her primary residence in London.
My gf had in the past set boundaries and said that you she would not able to stay again before inviting her back..
My gf has some mh issues and I think the best thing for her is to get her space and flat back. She's not responsible for N. I get the feeling N has got comfortable with the situation and is now dependent on my gf.

 

[Throbbing Angel]

Where does N live the rest of the time?

If N has a home somewhere then that's the answer. If N is effectively sofa surfing then N is homeless but not Street homeless imho and someone should be helping them.

Try Shelter, Acorn, local housing associations etc

 

[skyscraper101]

£30 in two years while taking a trip to NY in between sounds like a piss take if you ask me.

 

[persimmon]

Where does N live the rest of the time?

If N has a home somewhere then that's the answer. If N is effectively sofa surfing then N is homeless but not Street homeless imho and someone should be helping them.

Try Shelter, Acorn, local housing associations etc

No fixed abode so yea sofa surfing. she claims she will only be housed if she was on streets ie more dangerous situation. Thanks for the recommendations. Will pass these on.

 

[Throbbing Angel]

No fixed abode so yea sofa surfing. she claims she will only be housed if she was on streets ie more dangerous situation. Thanks for the recommendations. Will pass these on.

Having worked for a local Council for over a decade the line about will only be housed if on streets sounds Sus.

Admittedly there may be a long wait. It may be useful for your gf to put this in writing to N and to let N user that as proof that she is 'homeless'.

As we are all aware, pressure on social housing is immense.

The duty of care is laid out here

Shelter Legal England - Main housing duty - Shelter England

The main housing duty owed by a local authority to someone who is homeless, eligible, has a priority need and is not intentionally homeless.

england.shelter.org.uk

 

[persimmon]

£30 in two years while taking a trip to NY in between sounds like a piss take if you ask me.

Tell me about it. She's been wanting to tell me all about her trip and how beautiful it was. Seems to take it all for granted. My gf is struggling financially atm as she's fully freelance and work has been drying up.

 

[weepiper]

If your girlfriend is living in a one bedroom flat with her child then she is already overcrowded.

 

[persimmon]

Having worked for a local Council for over a decade the line about will only be housed if on streets sounds Sus.

Admittedly there may be a long wait. It may be useful for your gf to put this in writing to N and to let N user that as proof that she is 'homeless'.

As we are all aware, pressure on social housing is immense.

The duty of care is laid out here

Shelter Legal England - Main housing duty - Shelter England

The main housing duty owed by a local authority to someone who is homeless, eligible, has a priority need and is not intentionally homeless.

england.shelter.org.uk

Thanks for this info. Understand about the waiting lists and that it could take years. Have tried explaining as much to N. Will pass this on

 

[Throbbing Angel]

Oh, start charging rent formally too if that's an option? Tenancy agreement, rent book, etc.

 

[Thora]

Your gf has a 6 year old she needs to prioritise. I sympathise with N but she is an adult with a job, friends and presumably family in Sweden - she is not your gf's responsibility.

 

[Thora]

Oh, start charging rent formally too if that's an option? Tenancy agreement, rent book, etc.

She's living in a 1 bed flat with a child, she doesn't have space for a lodger.

 

[Throbbing Angel]

She's living in a 1 bed flat with a child, she doesn't have space for a lodger.

More as a way of moving N on. I know she doesn't have space.

If you stay, you pay. Saying that often focuses the mind. It's the unsaid, friendly arrangements that cause problems.

 

[newme]

So is N staying elsewhere at the moment? Message N and say unfortunately the situation isn't working anymore and she won't be able to stay again.

Then she has proof to show the council she is homeless and will get bumped up the list. Win win, SO did this when living at her mums, her mum put in a letter saying she couldn't stay there and they got temp housing. It's better than a living room and you then progress through the system or find somewhere that takes benefits. Ended up in social housing.
Also she is taking the piss.

 

[Silas Loom]

As everyone else has said, your GF is being exploited. As an aside, though, it’s often very tricky to get a diagnosis for chronic fatigue syndrome and doctors frequently write unhelpful letters, although anyone managing 20hrs per week front of house and overseas jollies would have very mild ME/CFS and her doctor might be right to dismiss her condition as TATT.

 

[persimmon]

Yes I get the sense that the relationship has changed from being one based on trust, love and care for her friend to something becoming exploitative, a bit parasitic. A short term arrangement has turned into something almost of a moral obligation.

To follow that, for someone with CFS, N is very proactive, spends half the week in the library writing literary essays and researching, as a non academic. She's clearly intelligent though does seem tone deaf particularly around my gfs living situation and our feelings about that. Assertive communication is key here and think some big conversation needs to be had.

 

[trashpony]

Whatever her health issues, they’re not your girlfriend‘s problem.
There are a lot of people who take advantage of other people’s kindness. N is one of them. The friendship is over - someone who exploits others like this is no friend.

 

[newme]

Yes I get the sense that the relationship has changed from being one based on trust, love and care for her friend to something becoming exploitative, a bit parasitic. A short term arrangement has turned into something almost of a moral obligation.

To follow that, for someone with CFS, N is very proactive, spends half the week in the library writing literary essays and researching, as a non academic. She's clearly intelligent though does seem tone deaf particularly around my gfs living situation and our feelings about that. Assertive communication is key here and think some big conversation needs to be had.

Tbh it seems like if she just ignores it she can do what she likes so she has done. Not your gfs fault but boundaries like them not being in the house anymore need setting immediately if she is out of the house now

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

More as a way of moving N on. I know she doesn't have space.

If you stay, you pay. Saying that often focuses the mind. It's the unsaid, friendly arrangements that cause problems.

Yeah, I know from my own experience that if you give people an easy life they have no incentive to do anything about their situation.

(Conversely, I've been crashing/sofa surfing a couple of times and even when not paying rent would buy groceries and wine, cook dinner, wash the dishes, etc., contributed and showed my appreciation.)

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

If she's staying or working in East London these might be helpful.

The Greenhouse

The Greenhouse centre provides free health care services and housing and welfare advice for homeless people in Hackney

thamesreach.org.uk

Homeless and need help? | Hackney Night Shelter

Access help or help someone in need

www.hwns.org.uk

 

[persimmon]

Oh, start charging rent formally too if that's an option? Tenancy agreement, rent book, etc.

What would be a fair share of rent? She's having to give up her living space and her son's - he's having to eat his breakfast cereal in bed ffs! The living room is the dining area and is joined to a small kitchen.

 

[persimmon]

Yeah, I know from my own experience that if you give people an easy life they have no incentive to do anything about their situation.

(Conversely, I've been crashing/sofa surfing a couple of times and even when not paying rent would buy groceries and wine, cook dinner, wash the dishes, etc., contributed and showed my appreciation.)

Yeah she's had an easy ride and there has not been enough pressure on her to change things. N washes the dishes occasionally and has cooked once or twice (in many months), sometimes babysits but not buying groceries or offering to help out in a really impactful or substantial way (contributing to bills would be something of a miracle)

 

[TopCat]

I would pack her stuff up and tell her to go and present as homeless to the council and good luck.

 

[Thora]

What would be a fair share of rent? She's having to give up her living space and her son's - he's having to eat his breakfast cereal in bed ffs! The living room is the dining area and is joined to a small kitchen.

Your gf really needs to put a stop this is, it isn't ok for her son. He needs space to eat, play. If she doesn't feel strong enough to challenge N herself could you offer to tell her she can't come back?

 

[TopCat]

Change the Euro cylinder on the door.

 

[persimmon]

Change the Euro cylinder on the door.

 

[persimmon]

If she's staying or working in East London these might be helpful.

The Greenhouse

The Greenhouse centre provides free health care services and housing and welfare advice for homeless people in Hackney

thamesreach.org.uk

Homeless and need help? | Hackney Night Shelter

Access help or help someone in need

www.hwns.org.uk

Thanks
N works in the borough of Westminster so that is the council she's been in touch with. My gf lives in South East London

 

[LDC]

She needs to be firm and tell her to move out now, no negotiation and no discussion. N is totally exploiting your girlfriend financially and for free accommodation. Her being 'ill' is no excuse.

Absolutely no way suggest paying rent or making some kind of agreement re: bills etc., I bet she'll agree and use it as a delaying tactic, and even if it happens makes the situation potentially even worse for your girlfriend.

 

[Elpenor]

Oh, start charging rent formally too if that's an option? Tenancy agreement, rent book, etc.

Not a tenancy this would be a lodger arrangement

But I don’t think formalising it is the solution given it sounds like the space being used is more of an issue than no rent being paid