Hold your nose and vote Labour?

[Rob Ray]

I don't think anyone knows this for sure at this point. I understand he's got a good track record and has earned the benefit of the doubt.

He had a good track record as a lawyer. As an MP he was essentially just another suit until he got his claws on the top job. His stated policies in that role however are flat out right-wing, and I'm not sure what doubt there is to offer.

 

[Signal 11]

I voted for wanky reformism in 17 and 19, but not in 92 the first one I could vote in, nor any of the others. Can't imagine doing it again.

 

[not a trot]

I have tended to vote Labour despite their policies and political history.

I can’t see myself doing so in the next GE nor indeed in the upcoming council elections.

Not sure who will get my vote if any.

What about you?

Rock solid vermin territory here.

 

[Crispy]

Our MP is One Of The Good Ones so actually deserves the vote.
But it is just voting and will make just as much difference as it always has.

 

[Flavour]

My vote, were I to use it, would be in a very safe Labour seat anyway, so no.

 

[furluxor]

He had a good track record as a lawyer. As an MP he was essentially just another suit until he got his claws on the top job. His stated policies in that role however are flat out right-wing, and I'm not sure what doubt there is to offer.

Right, however if he's playing strategy, his stated policies would be flat out right-wing. I'm not the fan of this sort of maneuvering but I can imagine why someone might find it necessary, with this country voting right-wing for the last decade or so. Starmer opposed all that anti-immigrant stuff and said he'd roll back the anti-protest legislation, I think there's hope. But, of course, the proof is in the pudding and it's too early to say at this point. I just don't see what alternative we realistically have?

 

[kebabking]

I wonder how much of each response is coloured by the dynamics of the constituency they live in?

So if folk like in a rock solid lab or Tory seat,do they feel less need to compromise than those who live in much more swing/marginal seats?

 

[ska invita]

unless you live in a lab swing seat there is no excuse for voting labour

 

[JimW]

Our MP is One Of The Good Ones so actually deserves the vote.
But it is just voting and will make just as much difference as it always has.

Used to be same for me but Dave Drew won't be their candidate again IIRC

 

[Sasaferrato]

I will be voting for Labour in the Scottish elections and in the GE. Only two choices in this constituency, and as the other choice is SNP...

 

[marty21]

No local elections this year where I live - so won't have to decide until either the GE or the London Mayoral - (is that due in 2024?) , Will vote Khan because I don't want a Tory Mayor . At the GE, I'm in a super solid Labour seat , Diane Abbott is my MP, so it doesn't matter whether I vote for her or not .

 

[MickiQ]

I wonder how much of each response is coloured by the dynamics of the constituency they live in?

So if folk like in a rock solid lab or Tory seat,do they feel less need to compromise than those who live in much more swing/marginal seats?

I'll still vote even though my vote will make no difference whatsoever. The thought occurs to me that since I have always voted for the party that lost (in my seat) perhaps it's my fault and I'm jinxing them.
I might vote for Wheeler to test this theory and see if it results in her losing.

 

[moochedit]

I'll still vote even though my vote will make no difference whatsoever. The thought occurs to me that since I have always voted for the party that lost (in my seat) perhaps it's my fault and I'm jinxing them.
I might vote for Wheeler to test this theory and see if it results in her losing.

She'll scrape in by 1 vote if you do that

 

[gentlegreen]

In 44 years I have never gone to vote with any enthusiasm.
The best I hope is they won't actually make things worse.

No votes in my part of Bristol.
It is my fervent hope that I will have left the country by the time of the GE.
(Though ideally of course the vermin would somehow fall before that)
Annoyingly my vote will remain trapped for ever in a solid Labour seat ... only 6 miles from Mogg's ...

 

[MickiQ]

She'll scrape in by 1 vote if you do that

there is always that terrible fear that haunts me.

 

[Rob Ray]

I think there's hope.

I think you're kidding yourself. The Labour Party isn't an alternative to anything, it's the same long-term process of transferring power upstairs, clad in a different tie. The "alternative" is direct action and the presentation of a credible threat to business as usual.

 

[Cid]

Very unlikely, safe seat though.

 

[girasol]

Used to vote Labour locally but have voted Green in local elections in recent years. In terms of GE I think I'll end up voting Labour again, because it really is a 2 party system, isn't it? I mean, who else has a real chance of being in power, unless there's a revolution?

 

[maomao]

I'm in a safe conservative seat but will vote Labour if it's the same condidate again because I know them. If its a different candidate I won't. I have held my nose and voted labour several times but Starmer is the stinkiest yet. He seems fundamentally untrustworthy to me and a victory for him could put an end to any left politics at all in the Labour Party for a decade or two. It might be better to swallow the defeat now.

 

[ohmyliver]

I’ll be voting Green in the locals, because Lambeth Council, but we’ve got a good local MP, who is Labour, and I’ll be voting for her.

 

[Pickman's model]

Tribal Labour voter so yeah.

The worst Labour government will always be better than the best Tory government* (even if by a whisker). Unless you are actively working for a revolution and believe you aren’t that far from success ( or you have the Bader Minehoff view that as a good revolutionary you have to provoke the state into making things worse for the working class to precipitate revolution) then it’s difficult to argue practically against it.

But of course I’m just a wanky reformist.

Still not keen on Starmer mind.


* Actual examples to the contrary, rather than sweeping statements, gratefully received.

No it isn't

Maybe you don't remember the 1995 nus conference - doubt you were there. But at that conference a Labour students motion on student financial support passed, moving the nus away from their longstanding position of a return to 1979 level grants and access to benefits, to a let's discuss alternatives position. So it was no surprise to me when the Blair government introduced tuition fees. That's what Labour governments do, they do things the tories won't. Wait and see the first year of the next Labour government and see how quickly they can become worse than the tories

 

[The39thStep]

Right, however if he's playing strategy, his stated policies would be flat out right-wing. I'm not the fan of this sort of maneuvering but I can imagine why someone might find it necessary, with this country voting right-wing for the last decade or so. Starmer opposed all that anti-immigrant stuff and said he'd roll back the anti-protest legislation, I think there's hope. But, of course, the proof is in the pudding and it's too early to say at this point. I just don't see what alternative we realistically have?

Strategy? The price of his three years of positioning , playing it safe , not committing to anything , let the Tories trip themselves up tactics is that most voters don’t know what he stands for ( aside from some vague perception that he thinks Sunak doesn’t want child molesters jailed)

 

[Pickman's model]

Strategy? The price of his three years of positioning , playing it safe , not committing to anything , let the Tories trip themselves up tactics is that most voters don’t know what he stands for ( aside from some vague perception that he thinks Sunak doesn’t want child molesters jailed)

No one knows where he stands as he can't be trusted to keep promises

 

[chilango]

Nopety nope from me.

Reading East is marginal-ish, but I don't care. I cannot, and will not, endorse them at this point.

I broke the habit of lifetime in 2017 and 2019 to vote Labour to encourage their slight leftwards shift. I felt conflicted enough doing that.

Would be madness to provide their hard turn right with a mandate.

 

[mx wcfc]

2 horse race where I am, labour aint one of the horses, so a vote for them would mean holding nose and flushing vote down the pan

Same here.
Stuck with voting LibDem
Anything to get the tory scum out, whilst being well aware that Starmer won't be much different.

 

[Pickman's model]

Same here.
Stuck with voting LibDem
Anything to get the tory scum out, whilst being well aware that Starmer won't be much different.

He'll be more efficient which is worse

 

[Weller]

I dont bother voting usually as its one of the safest seats in the country for Tory however locals are so fed up of our MP Gavin that many are going to vote Green so Ill be voting Green.
As for the general election If labour had any chance in our constituency I would vote labour as even though Im not satisfied with Starmer the thought of witholding my vote to let another 5 years of this Tory bollocks carry on with the majority they have to introduce more stress on our young or underprivileged etc fills me with dread

I really cannot see though how witholding a vote in an area where labour COULD get in with a swing vote would benefit most people I am hoping if once in power again Labour may actually do some good despite how they are pre election.
The though of another 5 years of the same tory shit fills me with dread and Id be ashamed to throw my vote away just because I think labour could select have a better leader but as it happens our local mp Gavin Williamson has been given one of the safest tory seats in the country for a reason hes so shit but labour sadly do not stand a chance here
Next to us as it happens is labour controlled and services roads schools medical centres etc are much better with lots of help for people cost of living , and throughout the pandemic no matter how bad Starmer may be labour are doing much more for less next door despite most saying this its still a Tory core safe seat here and best the angry will do is vote green or not vote it never made much sence to me

Id just be happy to see the likes of Sir Gavin Williamson gone the thought that he may someday get to be pm or have some major power again is scary the Torys still have much shittier evil mps in the wings than Starmer could ever be that they may bring back

 

[prunus]

Yes, Tory v Labour here. Not into face-spiting. Wouldn't if I was in a safe labour seat. Would vote Lib-dem if in a Tory/Lib seat. Would vote pig in a tutu if it was the main challenger to a tory. Got to get the cunts out.

 

[splonkydoo]

If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal

 

[The39thStep]

So how are you going to get what you deserve for the years 2924/ 2030?

Serious question, not arguing for the sake of it, Genuinely what do you see as the way forward?

Big question - small answer .

I think the first thing is to work out where ‘we’ want to go .For some posters on this board rejoining the EU would apparantly be the golden fix. For others in the real world things like decent pay rises , a better funded and more functional NHS , the public control of key utilities where obscene profits have been made , a strategy for affordable houses to buy or rent etc etc .


It’s certainly not an argument about reform v revolution . Tbh wanky reform won’t deliver those issues either . For me it’s about robust and muscular reform and that won’t and can’t be delivered by men and women in suits on the basis of us only getting all worked up about the act of putting a cross on a ballot paper every five years choosing between tweedledum and tweedledee

Imo a robust reform agenda only comes about when the w/ class struggle for it and the employers and politicians are forced to take notice .