George IV/Music Bar at 144 Brixton Hill closing as another Tesco comes to Brixton
- Thread starter quimcunx
- Start date
Brixton Hatter
Home is south London mate
The council/planning committee fucked up on Tuesday night and ended up discussing the old plans, instead of the new ones. So the decision has been deferred until a later date. The agent for Tesco was apoplectic 
I understand some locals are now trying to get the pub listed.
Also, Tesco don't own it - a developer does. So it could still be bought from under Tesco's noses. Anyone know any rich Brixtonites?!
I understand some locals are now trying to get the pub listed.
Also, Tesco don't own it - a developer does. So it could still be bought from under Tesco's noses. Anyone know any rich Brixtonites?!
quimcunx
imprimeo, lamino, distribuo
Cheers, I was wondering what had happened. I think the deadline on the planning permission re railings I mentioned (that were separate from the mtg ones for some reason) is 27th April. So still time to be awkward over that.
On the assumption that Tesco were looking for a bit of speedy processing because of Chuka et al looking at community listing (?) I imagine they were a little annoyed. Did they actually turn up or were they leaving it to the council to plead their case again?
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
The council/planning committee fucked up on Tuesday night and ended up discussing the old plans, instead of the new ones. So the decision has been deferred until a later date. The agent for Tesco was apoplectic
I understand some locals are now trying to get the pub listed.
Also, Tesco don't own it - a developer does. So it could still be bought from under Tesco's noses. Anyone know any rich Brixtonites?!
I understand Tesco has bought the lease from the Birmingham-based developer. So, in practice, and for a certain number of years, it owns the pub.
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
The corner shop nearest the George IV is having its alcohol licence reviewed after a council team discovered it had sold booze to a child, stocked non duty-paid alcohol and employed a visa overstayer.
It was closed yesterday.
It was closed yesterday.
The council/planning committee fucked up on Tuesday night and ended up discussing the old plans, instead of the new ones. So the decision has been deferred until a later date. The agent for Tesco was apoplectic
I understand some locals are now trying to get the pub listed.
Also, Tesco don't own it - a developer does. So it could still be bought from under Tesco's noses. Anyone know any rich Brixtonites?!
What was on the agenda for discussion on Tuesday night!? The letter I got about making an area for carparking said the deadline for objections is the 24th.
Tricky Skills
Well-Known Member
The listing is part of the Community Right to Bid under the Localism Act. Essentially it allows any community group to apply to have an 'asset of community value' placed on the local authority's asset list. If the asset then becomes available on the private market, the group has a six month moratorium ahead of the private sector to try and source a bid at the market value. This is the model that was successful for the Ivy House in Southwark.
Save George IV has been working with Locality and myself at The Place Station to try and get Lambeth Council to place the George on the list of community assets. The required 21 signatures have been sourced, including Chuka Umunna and Brixton Hill Cllr Alex Holland. The Counicl has six weeks now to make a decision.
This won't alter the current ambitions of Tesco. The company is still free to press ahead and purchase the lease / apply for planning permission. It does mean however that if Tesco gets cold feet or increasingly pissed off with the planning process and decides to sell, Save George IV campaign gets first dibs to try and put in a serious offer.
This is where the real fun starts
Grants and funding support is available...
Anyone following the uncertainty over Dulwich Hamlet's ground might like to know that Right to Bid is also a possibility here.
Save George IV has been working with Locality and myself at The Place Station to try and get Lambeth Council to place the George on the list of community assets. The required 21 signatures have been sourced, including Chuka Umunna and Brixton Hill Cllr Alex Holland. The Counicl has six weeks now to make a decision.
This won't alter the current ambitions of Tesco. The company is still free to press ahead and purchase the lease / apply for planning permission. It does mean however that if Tesco gets cold feet or increasingly pissed off with the planning process and decides to sell, Save George IV campaign gets first dibs to try and put in a serious offer.
This is where the real fun starts
Grants and funding support is available...Anyone following the uncertainty over Dulwich Hamlet's ground might like to know that Right to Bid is also a possibility here.
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
So, Tesco does not own the lease? The George IV tweeter said it did
BBTim
Seasider
As far as I understand it, Tesco haven't yet signed the lease. I spoke to the landlord, a guy named Bebir, in January and he said he would be prepared to lease it to a community group, as long as it matched Tesco's offer and there were certain guarantees about income. That was a few month ago now, though.
Rushy
basically a scrotum
Any idea how much that was? I can't imagine any business could afford to rent it at what it will be worth to Tesco. If you're a landlord, Tesco are a wet dream come true.
Minnie_the_Minx
someinenhhanding menbag and me ah bollox
Saw a billboard for the South London Press today mentioning this.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
It'll be the income guarantees that are the killer I'd guess. A community group is incredibly unlikely to be able to promise to match Tesco's money long term, even if they could come up with it for a bit.
DJWrongspeed
radio eros
Reading the planning documents it seems that the planning officers were recommending giving it the go ahead. All objections were disregarded or explained away on a point by point basis, bit grim. 
I got a letter this weekend saying there is an appeal against the original turning down of the Tesco application (removal of existing fencing plus formation of car-parking.. etc) with an objection point some time in the future, not soon enough to act urgently.
But my letter referred to above is a new application which on a re-read, is an application for "removal of PART OF existing fencing plus formation of car-parking.. etc".
Bit flummoxed about what is going on but will rally the neighbours to object to the "new" application, and sort something out for the appeal. As the deadline for the new application objections is 2 day's time - April 24th.
But my letter referred to above is a new application which on a re-read, is an application for "removal of PART OF existing fencing plus formation of car-parking.. etc".
Bit flummoxed about what is going on but will rally the neighbours to object to the "new" application, and sort something out for the appeal. As the deadline for the new application objections is 2 day's time - April 24th.
TheBrixtonBoy
New Member
It would be great if someone could determine the rent ect. We could all look if something is then viable for the community. It looks like it has plenty of floors and could certainly work in my opinion.
Brixton Hill does not need another Supermarket, mini or otherwise. There are two others within a couple of hundred yards and another Tesco on the corner of New Park Road. Other places in London may want to be clones of each other, but Brixton doesn't and shouldn't.
Brixton Hill does not need another Supermarket, mini or otherwise. There are two others within a couple of hundred yards and another Tesco on the corner of New Park Road. Other places in London may want to be clones of each other, but Brixton doesn't and shouldn't.
MillwallShoes
Don't kill the Lion
now that is a fucking shame. talk about destroy a place.View attachment 21347
View attachment 21348
144 Brixton Hill is the address for the Music Bar.
Fuck off, Tesco.
Is there anything can be done re planning permission?
fucking supermarket opening on crown point west norwood soon as well
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
The trick is to prove it would be financially viable when, before it closed, it seemingly wasn't.
It's tough running pubs when booze is so cheap in ... supermarkets.
Unless you do an Antic and run away from your debts
It's tough running pubs when booze is so cheap in ... supermarkets.
Unless you do an Antic and run away from your debts
billythefish
toad licker
I reckon they should make a go of it as a backpacker's hostel / budget hotel. There's clearly call for hotel rooms in Brixton what with the massive hotel planned behind KFC. There are so many venues in Brixton, and bugger all accommodation. They could keep the downstairs as a bar / function room.
Minnie_the_Minx
someinenhhanding menbag and me ah bollox
I was thinking that myself! Can't remember how many bedrooms are upstairs but at least half a dozen (I've stayed in most of them
)Today is the LAST DAY to respond. Takes 5 minutes. Does everyone realise it's necessary to object to this as Tesco may eventually give up if they can't do the alterations they need?
reference is 13/01107/FUL, go to www.lambeth.gov.uk/planningdatabase and click on planning database, then search by reference. Registering takes not long at all. You can view other people's objections and submit your own. You could also try emailing your objection to planning@lambeth.gov.uk with your full name and address details, which isn't a way that the letter says you can object but it worked for me last time.
Relevant parts of mine in case it helps anyone:
I object to the application for the formation of carparking on the hardstanding area in front of the current George IV pub property, and the removal of "part of existing fencing". Similarly, I objected to the almost identical application made last year (12/02757/FUL) which is currently under appeal, where the application is to "remove existing fencing" rather than "part of the existing fencing".
I am a resident in nearby Tudor Close and have lived here for six and a half years. The George IV is within the Rush Common and Brixton Hill Conservation area (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...0D772D2091/0/CA49RushCommonandBrixtonHill.pdf). As I stated in my objections to 12/02757/FUL, I think the addition of the proposed area of car-parking would intrinsically damage the character of the area, making it appear more built-up than it is presently and therefore would fail to protect the area's character in a way which would be a real shame. As noted in the 1997 appraisal of this conservation area, the frontage alongside that part of the hill is of special interest and "exerts a fundamental impact on the character of the 200 year old Rush Common". (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...320FA/0/RushCommonAndBrixtonHillAppraisal.pdf) The special character of the George IV itself is noted in the appraisal as "the splendid George IV public house - a late Victorian extravaganza with charming ironwork, stone balustrades and a jolly copper-clad turret topped by a flying seagull weathervane". Whatever happens to the George IV, the appearance and character needs to be maintained. I feel very strongly that if the application is granted, railings removed and/or carparking is created outside the property, this will amount to intrusion and damage to the area's - and that specific building's - special character, amounting to crude and insensitive alteration, i.e. the kind of adaptation which that report lamented - for example on pages 25 and 26.
Once that building's character is lost, it will be gone forever.
Further, I object on the basis that the proposed works will have an obviously detrimental impact on the flow of traffic around the area and particularly on the bus routes. I am a user of buses down Brixton Hill and the area is already subject to heavy traffic at several times of day. The addition of this car park will cause disruption and delay as cars/delivery vehicles turn into, and move out of, the car park and I have related safety fears.
reference is 13/01107/FUL, go to www.lambeth.gov.uk/planningdatabase and click on planning database, then search by reference. Registering takes not long at all. You can view other people's objections and submit your own. You could also try emailing your objection to planning@lambeth.gov.uk with your full name and address details, which isn't a way that the letter says you can object but it worked for me last time.
Relevant parts of mine in case it helps anyone:
I object to the application for the formation of carparking on the hardstanding area in front of the current George IV pub property, and the removal of "part of existing fencing". Similarly, I objected to the almost identical application made last year (12/02757/FUL) which is currently under appeal, where the application is to "remove existing fencing" rather than "part of the existing fencing".
I am a resident in nearby Tudor Close and have lived here for six and a half years. The George IV is within the Rush Common and Brixton Hill Conservation area (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...0D772D2091/0/CA49RushCommonandBrixtonHill.pdf). As I stated in my objections to 12/02757/FUL, I think the addition of the proposed area of car-parking would intrinsically damage the character of the area, making it appear more built-up than it is presently and therefore would fail to protect the area's character in a way which would be a real shame. As noted in the 1997 appraisal of this conservation area, the frontage alongside that part of the hill is of special interest and "exerts a fundamental impact on the character of the 200 year old Rush Common". (http://www.lambeth.gov.uk/NR/rdonly...320FA/0/RushCommonAndBrixtonHillAppraisal.pdf) The special character of the George IV itself is noted in the appraisal as "the splendid George IV public house - a late Victorian extravaganza with charming ironwork, stone balustrades and a jolly copper-clad turret topped by a flying seagull weathervane". Whatever happens to the George IV, the appearance and character needs to be maintained. I feel very strongly that if the application is granted, railings removed and/or carparking is created outside the property, this will amount to intrusion and damage to the area's - and that specific building's - special character, amounting to crude and insensitive alteration, i.e. the kind of adaptation which that report lamented - for example on pages 25 and 26.
Once that building's character is lost, it will be gone forever.
Further, I object on the basis that the proposed works will have an obviously detrimental impact on the flow of traffic around the area and particularly on the bus routes. I am a user of buses down Brixton Hill and the area is already subject to heavy traffic at several times of day. The addition of this car park will cause disruption and delay as cars/delivery vehicles turn into, and move out of, the car park and I have related safety fears.
Kanda
Diving wanker
Hootenany does hostel rooms doesn't it?
Ergh - this one's coming up, too... the application for Tesco signage, I guess? http://planning.lambeth.gov.uk/onli...tails.do?activeTab=dates&keyVal=MC1ATRBOHV000
billythefish
toad licker
Yup, and as far as I know they're in great demand.
DJWrongspeed
radio eros
Have made a hasty objection , thanks for the text slcr.
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
Apparently it has just been listed as a community asset, whatever that means.
sparkybird
ask the bird...
slcr - thanks for jogging my memory on that - it's been on my list and glad I didn't miss the deadline. Though your comments were very well expressed and hope it's OK but I've used part of them in mine
Fingers crossed
Fingers crossed
DJWrongspeed
radio eros
Any more info ?
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
Think it makes it harder to develop or something.
I am not especially opposed to Tesco. But a hotel or pub would be better.
After all, it was a hotel once.
I am not especially opposed to Tesco. But a hotel or pub would be better.
After all, it was a hotel once.
Tricky Skills
Well-Known Member
The Assessment Panel at Lambeth Council has ruled that the application to list the pub as an Asset of Community Value complies with the criteria for the 2011 Localism Act. The George is now the first Asset of Community Value in Lambeth. It has been added to the Council's Asset List and will be publicised on the Lambeth website.
What this means is that the owner is now not allowed to dispose of the freehold or any lease. The owner has to notify the Council first if there is an intention to sell.
This will then trigger off a six month moritorium period. The Save the George group will then be able to have a free run of trying to put in a market value bid ahead of the private sector. This is the exact same model that led to a local community group buying and managing the Ivy House in Southwark.
What this means is that the owner is now not allowed to dispose of the freehold or any lease. The owner has to notify the Council first if there is an intention to sell.
This will then trigger off a six month moritorium period. The Save the George group will then be able to have a free run of trying to put in a market value bid ahead of the private sector. This is the exact same model that led to a local community group buying and managing the Ivy House in Southwark.
