Electric cars

[Teaboy]

Teaboy have you put something like Zap Map on your phone to see where your local charge points are? I suspect that my next car will be an EV and although it's a long way off and I can most likely have a charge point at home I thought I'd see what the local infrastructure was like at the moment. It's not that good yet.

Not yet but I am aware that there are some useful apps out there (along with the 10 you need just to use charging points). It just really shouldn't be this way. The cost of charging anywhere should be within a few pennies regardless of the brand written on the charging point.

 

[Saul Goodman]

No problem!

Ah, right, so you walk home and pick up your second EV, drive it into town, block the road with it while you charge your first car, drive it back home, walk back to your first car...

 

[MickiQ]

Ah, right, so you walk home and pick up your second EV, drive it into town, block the road with it while you charge your first car, drive it back home, walk back to your first car...

A mate of mine had a Tesla for the weekend and managed to flatten the battery, he rang the hire company and they sent a pickup truck with a generator on the back to charge him up enough to get it back the depot.
Breakdown trucks will just end up with a big ass battery on the back to rescue people who run out of charge, this is a very easy problem to solve.

 

[Teaboy]

No problem!

Also the RAC (and presumably AA as well) are installing chargers in all their vans to get you enough juice to the next charge point).

It certainly will take a change of mindset and more planning. Then again that kind of suits me because I did this anyway to make sure I didn't end up having to buy fuel from a service station and to ensure I got my nectar points. I'm cheap like that.

 

[Saul Goodman]

A mate of mine had a Tesla for the weekend and managed to flatten the battery, he rang the hire company and they sent a pickup truck with a generator on the back to charge him up enough to get it back the depot.
Breakdown trucks will just end up with a big ass battery on the back to rescue people who run out of charge, this is a very easy problem to solve.

Of course that's what's going to happen, but you'll have to wait a few hours for your charger to arrive, and another half an hour plugged into it to get you home, where you won't be able to plug in because you don't have off-street parking with your own charge point, and someone else has taken 'your' lamppost.
Obviously the answer is to plan ahead, but lots of people don't. We've had fossil fuel powered cars for over 100 years, yet loads of people still manage to run out of fuel. I can only see the problem getting worse with EVs. I'm quite looking forward to it, tbh

 

[MickiQ]

Of course that's what's going to happen, but you'll have to wait a few hours for your charger to arrive, and another half an hour plugged into it to get you home, where you won't be able to plug in because you don't have off-street parking with your own charge point, and someone else has taken 'your' lamppost.
Obviously the answer is to plan ahead, but lots of people don't. We've had fossil fuel powered cars for over 100 years, yet loads of people still manage to run out of fuel. I can only see the problem getting worse with EVs. I'm quite looking forward to it, tbh

I also can forsee conflicts between neighbours over 'whose' lamppost it is just as there is over 'whose' parking space it is but look on the bright side. It will give teuchter more ammunition at least

 

[Saul Goodman]

I also can forsee conflicts between neighbours over 'whose' lamppost it is just as there is over 'whose' parking space it is but look on the bright side. It will give teuchter more ammunition at least

That's the bit I'm really looking forward to, fights to the death over charging points. If all goes well it'll become a televised event.
#onestepclosertomadmax

 

[MickiQ]

That's the bit I'm really looking forward to, fights to the death over charging points. If all goes well it'll become a televised event.
#onestepclosertomadmax

My decision to pave the front lawn over and turn it into extra parking space is yet again proving to be the correct one

 

[Teaboy]

One tiny thing I've discovered through my research is that electric cars have a green vertical bar on the number plates. Presumably this is some sort of Government thing but how's that for a virtue signal!

 

[T & P]

One tiny thing I've discovered through my research is that electric cars have a green vertical bar on the number plates. Presumably this is some sort of Government thing but how's that for a virtue signal!

Oh. I had assumed that was the new UK number plate post-Brexit for all cars, replacing the EU flag strip that sat there previously.

 

[Winot]

We are going to Glasgow by train for our summer holiday. Will do some city stuff and day trips out for walking in Trossachs.

Researching car hire and have found this car club (social enterprise). Most of the cars in Glasgow are electric. Job done.

Car Share: Co Wheels Car Club | Co Wheels

With hourly car rental, you can hire a car with ease. The Co Wheels Car Club is a great alternative to owning your own car. Join up, find a car share, and go.

www.co-wheels.org.uk

 

[Saul Goodman]

 

[weltweit]

We will need more budget EVs to tempt people to switch. The deadline is for new sales not used sales. I expect plenty of people to be using petrol and diesel cars for some years yet.

 

[MickiQ]

We will need more budget EVs to tempt people to switch. The deadline is for new sales not used sales. I expect plenty of people to be using petrol and diesel cars for some years yet.

10-15 years past 2030 at least maybe even 20-25. The tipping point will come when EV's have become a large enough percentage to start making it uneconomical for retailers to stock fuel for ICE since it's expensive stuff to transport and store and you can't really (unlike EV''s) have a refuelling infrastructure at home.

 

[Saul Goodman]

There will come a time when a second hand EV will become worthless, as a replacement battery will cost far more than the car is worth, which will be the point when thieves realise that EVs are a great little earner, when they can chop a car and sell the battery alone for a couple of grand.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

There will come a time when a second hand EV will become worthless, as a replacement battery will cost far more than the car is worth, which will be the point when thieves realise that EVs are a great little earner, when they can chop a car and sell the battery alone for a couple of grand.

So, we know fossil fuel cars are crap, and you’re making a strong case for EV’s being equally as bad.

Can we start sensibly discussing the alternatives now?

 

[Saul Goodman]

So, we know fossil fuel cars are crap, and you’re making a strong case for EV’s being equally as bad.

Can we start sensibly discussing the alternatives now?

I don't recall saying either was bad. I was merely pointing out a pitfall for used EVs. I'm sure someone will eventually invent a cheaper, more sustainable battery technology.

 

[UnderOpenSky]

Theoreticaly EC could last a lot longer then IC cars. I think once self driving is cracked and companies like Uber own them on mass we will see the demand for this. For many it could reduce the need for private ownership of the things.

 

[Saul Goodman]

Theoreticaly EC could last a lot longer then IC cars. I think once self driving is cracked and companies like Uber own them on mass we will see the demand for this. For many it could reduce the need for private ownership of the things.

It's a given that electric cars will last orders of magnitude longer than ICE cars.

 

[Dogsauce]

It's a given that electric cars will last orders of magnitude longer than ICE cars.

I wonder if it will go like other electronic devices - when first invented they just build something that works, then over time all the engineering brains go into working out ways to make it cheaper by replacing components with ones that fail just out of warranty, the minimum cost they can get away with, so that newer versions just don’t last.

An example is the massive old brown microwave my parents passed on to me that outlived several of the shitty modern ones I bought, got just over 12 months out of some fancy Panasonic inverter one before it went pop and the brown one came back out of the loft. Capitalism means electric cars will eventually be the same. You’ll also have Mike Ashley-type venture capitalist twats buying up the old ICE brands that don’t adapt fast enough and putting out absolute shit under their badge for as long as they can get away with it.

 

[Saul Goodman]

I wonder if it will go like other electronic devices - when first invented they just build something that works, then over time all the engineering brains go into working out ways to make it cheaper by replacing components with ones that fail just out of warranty, the minimum cost they can get away with, so that newer versions just don’t last.

An example is the massive old brown microwave my parents passed on to me that outlived several of the shitty modern ones I bought, got just over 12 months out of some fancy Panasonic inverter one before it went pop and the brown one came back out of the loft. Capitalism means electric cars will eventually be the same. You’ll also have Mike Ashley-type venture capitalist twats buying up the old ICE brands that don’t adapt fast enough and putting out absolute shit under their badge for as long as they can get away with it.

That's exactly what's going to happen. Ford make over 90% of their revenue through replaceable parts. That's consumerism at at's finest/worst. That isn't going to change.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

One tiny thing I've discovered through my research is that electric cars have a green vertical bar on the number plates. Presumably this is some sort of Government thing but how's that for a virtue signal!

It’s not mandatory but an option to show the world that you vote Lib Dem and wear socks with your sandals.

 

[Looby]

We’ve (almost) bought a hybrid. Honda CRV.
It’s been the plan for a couple of years and the boost in used car prices meant we could do it earlier than planned as the value of my car has increased 2.5k in 7 months. It’s a good time to part ex apparently.

We couldn’t stretch to an electric with the size and range we need for work but next time and hopefully they’ll be cheaper and more accessible then.

We looked at the Kia Sportage but they only had mild diesel hybrid which basically seemed to have almost fuck all benefit and I really wasn’t willing to go back to diesel.
The Mazda’s were all too small.

The Honda is beautiful, I really enjoyed driving it. I didn’t realise they don’t come with you on test drives now so I was a bit freaked out especially as I’d never driven anything that was keyless/no proper gear stick before.

No roof rails though which is a pain.
Anyone else got one?

 

[Teaboy]

We’ve (almost) bought a hybrid. Honda CRV.
It’s been the plan for a couple of years and the boost in used car prices meant we could do it earlier than planned as the value of my car has increased 2.5k in 7 months. It’s a good time to part ex apparently.

We couldn’t stretch to an electric with the size and range we need for work but next time and hopefully they’ll be cheaper and more accessible then.

We looked at the Kia Sportage but they only had mild diesel hybrid which basically seemed to have almost fuck all benefit and I really wasn’t willing to go back to diesel.
The Mazda’s were all too small.

The Honda is beautiful, I really enjoyed driving it. I didn’t realise they don’t come with you on test drives now so I was a bit freaked out especially as I’d never driven anything that was keyless/no proper gear stick before.

No roof rails though which is a pain.
Anyone else got one?

Depends whether you're talking petrol hybrid or plug-in hybrid. If the former then check out Toyota's range as they've been doing these for years and have hybrid versions of most of their cars.

In general though if you are doing a lot of motorway miles you probably won't notice any difference in cost or fuel consumption over a standard petrol / diesel. Hybrids really only come into their own around town.

 

[Looby]

Depends whether you're talking petrol hybrid or plug-in hybrid. If the former then check out Toyota's range as they've been doing these for years and have hybrid versions of most of their cars.

In general though if you are doing a lot of motorway miles you probably won't notice any difference in cost or fuel consumption over a standard petrol / diesel. Hybrids really only come into their own around town.

Petrol not plug in.
Yeah I did look at Toyota but the monthly payment was too high. I liked the RAV 4.
Most of my personal mileage is town with the odd long trip.
Work miles could be more motorway in new job but not sure. I’m reimbursed for that at least.

 

[Teaboy]

I used to have a petrol hybrid or self-charging as they call them. I don't think they can really be considered a electric car as the only source of energy is petrol. Yes they have more batteries and have regenerative breaking but realistically all that actually means is they're a more efficient petrol car. Interestingly I think there a few countries who have actually banned the phrase self-charging hybrid as they think its misleading.

As for actually cars and being on a budget you've already checked out Kia the other manufacturer worth considering may be Hyundai. Skoda are also good in this but might be a bit out of price range.

 

[Teaboy]

So, I'm going for it and have just ordered an VW ID3. I'd like to sit and here and say its all about the polar bears and not poisoning the air children breathe but I'll be honest. Its about tax.

If I was to replace my existing car like for like (though as an auto) I'd be paying somewhere between £270 and £300 per month in company car tax. With the ID3 I'll be paying £7 or £8 per month. Over the 3 or 4 years I'll have it that equates to stupid money just for having to plug the thing in an loiter around for a bit.

The running costs are also so much lower. Even without home charging its going to cost around 7p-8p a mile in 'fuel' and the servicing charges are tiny because there isn't really anything to service.

Something that does occur is the move to electric will necessitate a complete change in the way driving is taxed. Obviously the company car thing won't stay that way for long and that will revert to normal but I'm talking about 'fuel'. The government simply won't be able to tax electricity in the same way it taxes petrol / diesel and that will leave a massive hole in the budget.

Get ready for road pricing, being charged by the mile and as per the roads we use.

 

[Leafster]

I'm not at the point where I need to replace my car yet and when I do it's likely to be second hand. Looking around to see what might be available on the second hand market when I do, then the ID3 seems most likely to fit the bill for me. I don't need anything larger but I'd be interested to hear what you think about the interior Teaboy as the only criticisms I've heard about the ID3 relate to it not being up to normal VW standards.

 

[Teaboy]

I'm not at the point where I need to replace my car yet and when I do it's likely to be second hand. Looking around to see what might be available on the second hand market when I do, then the ID3 seems most likely to fit the bill for me. I don't need anything larger but I'd be interested to hear what you think about the interior Teaboy as the only criticisms I've heard about the ID3 relate to it not being up to normal VW standards.

Yeah, the internal build quality has come up in pretty much every review I've seen on youtube. Seems to be a more wider thing with new vdubs, cost cutting basically. I didn't really notice it when I did a test drive and as I've never had a golf I don't really have anything to benchmark it against. I really like my Mazda but its also hard plastic everywhere which I'd never noticed until I'd seen the complaints about the id3.

The thing that I think will annoy is the lack of knobs and everything having to be done through a touch screen central computer which also appears to be quite buggy. I don't like the way manufacturers are forcing things down this route. Its far too distracting having to look at a screen and I simply don't use voice recognition on any device I own because I hate it. Cars should have knobs which you can use without your eyes ever straying from the road.

The id3 is filling a hole in the electric market. If you don't want a suv and your budget doesn't stretch to a Tesla model 3 options are limited.

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Re the tax thing... EV owners told to send in odometer readings for road tax, and they are not happy

Electric vehicle owners with cars registered in Victoria have been instructed by the state’s road authority to send in a photo of their odometer readings from July 1 to comply with the new electric vehicle road tax that takes effect from the start of the new financial year. And they are not happy.

EV owners in Victoria will be slugged a tax of 2.5 cents per kilometre from July 1, meaning an annual bill of $375 for cars that travel around 15,000kms a year, but around $750 a year for electric cars that travel double that.