Egypt anti-government protests grow

[Riklet]

A response like that whilst they pretend this is 'post-revolution' Egypt is surely going to increase the chance of proper violence back, there's plenty of tensions simmering under every surface there, especially with the SCAF delaying any hand over well into next year.

Been speaking to an American guy recently who's lived in Egypt the past few years, and his views are very interesting, although pretty pessimistic in thinking that the violent and angry nature of Egyptian society at the moment means that there will inevitably be proper civil and ethnic conflict in future. If the MB can get the votes from dishing out the food and cash, can they retain that support when they're the ones in charge of the police and the state apparatus, if food prices keep going up and unrest keeps happening. hrmmm.

Man those people back out protesting and in the square are fucking brave...

 

[butchersapron]

A response like that whilst they pretend this is 'post-revolution' Egypt is surely going to increase the chance of proper violence back, there's plenty of tensions simmering under every surface there, especially with the SCAF delaying any hand over well into next year.

Been speaking to an American guy recently who's lived in Egypt the past few years, and his views are very interesting, although pretty pessimistic in thinking that the violent and angry nature of Egyptian society at the moment means that there will inevitably be proper civil and ethnic conflict in future. If the MB can get the votes from dishing out the food and cash, can they retain that support when they're the ones in charge of the police and the state apparatus, if food prices keep going up and unrest keeps happening. hrmmm.

Man those people back out protesting and in the square are fucking brave...

They have to be to make space for everyone else.

 

[dennisr]

They have to be to make space for everyone else.

But like you say earlier - they need to also survive so they continue to hold that space - withdraw and reorganise at some point.

Any word on solidarity action - union action, other cities, the ordinary folk witnessing this in Cairo?

 

[rekil]

In footage as appalling as that, there's always one who seems to be worse than everyone else. How long before there's bombings or choppings in response.

 

[elbows]

Bombings and choppings? I had hoped the Arab spring would do much to diminish such stereotypes, time will tell.

The Guardian does a reasonable job of describing the recent horror:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/dec/18/egypt-violence-day-three

 

[elbows]

This video shows what I was watching live last night. The complete insanity starts shortly after the 11 minute mark, when the security forces move forwards beyond the barricade, only to retreat a few minutes later when the crowd come back with Molotov's flying:

 

[rekil]

Bombings and choppings? I had hoped the Arab spring would do much to diminish such stereotypes, time will tell.

You don't think increased levels of state violence will result in militancy that's a step up from stones and molotovs. Ok.

 

[Fedayn]

More of the Egyptian army'#s 'love' for the people....

 

[xes]

I hope they all fucking die.

 

[elbows]

You don't think increased levels of state violence will result in militancy that's a step up from stones and molotovs. Ok.

No, I don't think thats a given at all, especially as events in Egypt this year have often defied expectations. And the militancy has often taken the form of strikes. And those opposed to the regime have seldom shown any signs of going after strategic targets, e.g. people have often kept attacking on the same tiny front even when a stalemate is obvious, they never seriously attempted to take over the tv station even at the height of the uprising. The state also employs rather bizarre tactics, e.g. not attempting to hold ground, and recently abandoning serious attempts to protect the image of the army.

When it comes to bombing, I believe there have been incidents in Sinai involving the blowing up of gas pipelines, but most of the people protesting in major population centres have shown little tendency to take up arms so far. I suspect that most groups do not think it would be in their interests to wage the struggle in this manner at the moment, or are simply against such tactics and in any case lack the capabilities to wage such a campaign.

 

[rekil]

Ok. And I sounded more narky than I meant to. Thanks for these updates btw.

I read that the woman in the vid was rescued and is alright but wants to stay anonymous.

Pic of one of the troops/cops doing the rounds atm.

 

[xes]

hunt the cunt down and tear him limb from fucking limb

 

[krink]

hunt the cunt down and tear him limb from fucking limb

having watched that video, this response seems fair enough to me. those protesters have got some fucking balls and some have a mighty long throw if the longer video is anything to go by - some of the molotovs were going really far. unless they have some kind of molotov catapults maybe?

 

[elbows]

This is said to be people chucking Molotov's from the roof of parliament building onto protesters:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djgZTOjEQPo

The regime have been upping the rhetoric against protesters in recent days, with the recently installed PM in particular blaming protesters for everything, and including an amplification of the usual stuff about unnamed 'outside forces' plotting against Egypt.

However it seems some people in the state-censored media are getting unhappy with the way events are portrayed and certain voices silenced:

http://www.thedailynewsegypt.com/media/murmurs-of-dissent-in-maspero-turn-loud.html

Also some in the Muslim Brotherhood appear to have criticised the crackdown by the military:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...-on-protests/2011/12/18/gIQA9ERE3O_story.html

 

[butchersapron]

On that last suggestion:

The Democratic Alliance, a political bloc in which the Muslim Brotherhood's Freedom and Justice Party is the biggest player, has released a statement throwing its support firmly behind the protesters.

Confirming its intention to participate in the sit-in at the supreme judiciary court until violence against protesters is halted and executive powers are handed over to the new parliament, it says:

Scaf (Supreme Council of Armed Forces) has failed in the management of the transitional period up to this critical moment, and it bears full responsibility for immediate cessation of violence, abuse of the citizens, assault of female demonstrators, the targeting of the revolutionaries who stood in the face of heavy-handed attacks, and for the immediate release of all protesters detained for no legal reason.

The conferees insist on bringing to justice and accountability military leaders and security officials responsible for ordering and carrying out violent attacks on the protesters, sitters and demonstrators, and on the formation of a special independent judicial commission of inquiry to take the necessary measures for the afore-mentioned purpose with full authority to initiate an investigation with the military and the security forces in charge of the area at the time. The conferees also condemn attempts to tarnish the image of the revolution and the revolutionaries who were always determined to maintain the peaceful nature of their protest and sit-in, which lasted nearly three weeks without any attack on a single institution.

 

[elbows]

Ta for the info.

The treatment of women lead to protests today:

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2011/12/20111220132113595450.html

"The reason for the protest is the picture and the video that was published by news services around the world, and it showed us to what extent the military council has no qualms about trampling on the women of Egypt and the girls of Egypt, and has no qualms about beating them up and stripping them naked," Islama Thabet told the Reuters news agency.

General Adel Emara, a member of Egypt's army council that took over after Mubarak was overthrown in February, said on Monday the attack on the woman protester was an isolated incident that was under investigation.

But there was outrage amongst the women who marched through Tahrir square and downtown Cairo on Tuesday, with the protesters chanting that Egypt's head of the military, Field Marshall Tantawi, was a coward, and that the women of Egypt would not be humiliated.

Clinton said something stronger than normal:

"Women are being beaten and humiliated in the same streets where they risked their lives for the revolution only a few short months ago," America's top diplomat said in a speech at Washington's Georgetown University on Monday.

"Women protesters have been rounded up and subjected to horrific abuse. Journalists have been sexually assaulted. And now, women are being attacked, stripped, and beaten in the streets," she added.

"This systematic degradation of Egyptian women dishonours the revolution, disgraces the state and its uniform and is not worthy of a great people."

And just in case we needed anything to make us even angrier at the regime:

"What is your feeling when you see Egypt and its history burn in front of you?" retired general Abdel Moneim Kato, an army adviser, told al-Shorouk daily, referring to a government archive building set alight during clashes.

"Yet you worry about a vagrant who should be burnt in Hitler's incinerators."


Presidential hopeful and former UN nuclear watchdog chief Mohamed ElBaradei said such statements showed "a deranged and criminal state of mind".

The Arabic Network for Human Rights Information denounced Kato's comments, saying they "incite hatred and justify violence against citizens".

 

[elbows]

SCAF have issued a shitty apology for the treatment of women, some back-pedalling going on as they realise that their attempts to take advantage of a perceived marginalisation of street protesters may have backfired bigtime.

Lashing out at the media probably won't help these swine either, what a bunch of fuckwits:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/21/w...-egyptian-general-blames-protesters.html?_r=1

“Before you open the newspaper, fold it; I know what I’m talking about,” General Emara said. “Yes, this scene took place, and we’re investigating it. But let’s look at the whole picture and see the circumstances the picture was taken in, and we will announce the complete truth.”
The general dropped the warm, avuncular approach he and others in the council had taken toward the news media, chastising journalists as though they were naughty schoolchildren. “When you want to speak, tell me to stop talking!” he said sarcastically. “I didn’t allow for talking,” he said at another point. “If you talk, I’ll kick you out.”
He continued, without explaining, “Don’t take only this shot, you or any other, and cite it to prove that violence was used.”
Though General Emara boasted briefly of the military’s success in delivering a transition to democracy, he made no reference to the military’s recently formed, and almost immediately disbanded, civilian advisory council. The council suspended its activities until the military stopped the violence and apologized; about a third of its roughly 30 members have quit.

The rest of that article is pretty interesting too, going on about most Egyptians not having noticed that they have been living under martial law for months, and deadlines given by politicians including ones from the MB for a deadline of January 25 for handing power to parliament and Feb 11 for election of a new president.

 

[elbows]

A long and fascinating blog post by Sandmonkey:

http://www.sandmonkey.org/2011/12/20/underneath/

 

[teqniq]

And just in case we needed anything to make us even angrier at the regime:

What a cunt that guy is.

That Sandmonkey post is indeed fascinating, thanks.

 

[teqniq]

At a conference organized by the Canada Egypt Business Council on Wednesday, Lieutenant General Ahmed Shafiq, who is running in the upcoming presidential elections, said he is on very good terms with the Supreme Council of the Armed Forces (SCAF).

“The SCAF does not support me,” he said. “But we have good relations.”

“I am a fighter, and I like to beat difficulties,” Shafiq said. “But I support dialogue between the political forces and the military council.”

Shafiq claimed the recent violence near the cabinet and the burning down of the Egyptian Scientific Institute were the work of infiltrators who want to destroy the state and drive a wedge between the people, on the one hand, and the army and police, on the other.

“The Egyptian people deserve to eat fish and chips, not foul and tameya,” he said, hinting that he would work on improving living standards if he became president.

Shafiq also said he would turn Sinai into a free industrial zone in order to encourage foreign investment.

Translated from Al-Masry Al-Youm

Fish and chips??? WTF?

http://www.almasryalyoum.com/en/node/564081[/QUOTE]

 

[elbows]

A video covering 4 of the recent days of violence. Includes people talking with english subtitles so its well worth a look even though we've seen some of the footage before.

 

[elbows]

A protest was held in Tahrir square today, and some other locations in Egypt:

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2011/12/2011122374830994443.html

I was having some trouble finding out what the numbers were like, but it seems there are some images on AlJazeeras liveblog if you scroll down a bit. The numbers look to be fair, but nothing amazing, and the MB didn't join in.

http://blogs.aljazeera.net/liveblog/Egypt

 

[butchersapron]

Over the xmas weekend:

Members of the Muslim Brotherhood (MB) who were playing a leading role in the orchestrated campaign against the Revolutionary Socialists (RS) dramatically changed their position on Sunday.

Gamal Tag-al-Din, a leading MB lawyer, publicly withdrew his official complaint to the public prosecutor. This complaint had accused three RS members of planning to overthrow the state.

I'll need to dig further to see if this report is the SWP putting a gloss on the MBs actions, but they're pretty clearly right to point out the conflicts that the pressure from the continuing protest and from worker based action is producing within the MB. Personally, i think these disagreements are unlikely to appear outside of the group - they will keep their cohesion and discipline whilst integrating leading youth members more favorable to the protests to the 2nd tier of leadership.Of course, the might go barmy and order them into line and risk provoking a response but given they kept their nerve when they were being locked up and killed i can't see them acting so ineptly now they're so close to many of their medium term goals.

 

[elbows]

This revolution produces some powerful propaganda.

 

[elbows]

The prosecutor in the Mubarak trial has gotten on to the heavy stuff:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/05/w...y-forces-of-interfering-in-mubarak-trial.html

In addressing the court, Mr. Suleiman asserted for the first time that Mr. Mabarak and his top internal security officials had made an explicit decision to use live ammunition against peaceful demonstrations on January 27 — two days after the protests broke out, and the day before they reached a bloody climax known as “Friday of Rage” that ended in the collapse of the police.
As evidence, the prosecution offered video images obtained from private television networks, showing security police officers loading weapons, government vehicles running over demonstrators, and police gunmen firing down from rooftops. In one video, an officer is seen killing a demonstrator with a bullet to the head.
“The defendants before you in the cage are the actual instigators, and are the ones who gave police officers the order to shoot,” Mr. Suleiman told the court, according to news agencies. “The protesters were peaceful, and it was the police that started firing on them.”

Also a Guardian story with very similar content: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jan/04/hosni-mubarak-shoot-to-kill-policy

 

[butchersapron]

Worrying picture painted here, not sure if its deliberate or just an unfortunate result of ad-hoc responses to November but there's clear potential here for separating workers/self-employed off from those still protesting and getting them behind the next crackdown.

Walls divide Cairo as revolt anniversary nears

 

[teqniq]

Fair play to him I reckon:

(CNN) -- Former International Atomic Energy Agency Director Mohamed ElBaradei has withdrawn his candidacy for Egypt's presidency, his campaign announced Saturday.
He withdrew because "his conscience does not allow him to run or for any other official position unless there is a real democratic system not just a symbolic one," according to a statement from his campaign.
"He believes people who will build the country are the youth and that he will continue working with them in the coming phase and they are the one's who will fulfill the nation's hopes of freedom, human dignity and social justice," the statement said.
ElBaradei was considered a frontrunner in the race to succeed that military government that took over after the fall of former President Hosni Mubarak.
According to his campaign, ElBaradei sees chaos and mismanagement in the interim military government, which "pushes the nation away from the goals of the revolution.".....

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/01/14/world/africa/egypt-elbaradei/index.html

 

[butchersapron]

Reluctant to put numbers on this - seen massively varying figures:

Egyptian women sweeping through central Cairo, chanting 'The people want the downfall of Tantawi'

 

[scooter]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-16665748

Egypt's Islamist parties win elections to parliament

The final results in Egypt's first post-Mubarak parliamentary elections confirm an overwhelming victory for Islamist parties.
The Muslim Brotherhood's Freedom and Justice Party (FJP) won the largest number of seats under Egypt's complex electoral system.

The hardline Salafist Nour party came second.

The liberal New Wafd and the secular Egyptian Bloc coalition are some way behind them.

...

The overall results mean that Islamist parties control around two-thirds of the seats in the assembly.

The FJP alone secured 127 seats via the party lists, and 108 from constituency votes, meaning it has almost half of all MPs.

The ultra-conservative Nour party won nearly a quarter of the seats.

Great

 

[butchersapron]

Doesn't mean that they form the govt - and it doesn't mean the parliament runs things.