TitanSound
Mr Beardy Drummer
Didn't we have a forum member who worked in a cinema and posted an excellent thread on the change over from old school projectors to digital a little while back?
Digital cinema - I don't like it
- Thread starter alsoknownas
- Start date
alsoknownas
some bloke
I was just thinking about 48 fps this morning, and how potentially good it could be. I'd like to see variable speed projection - 24 fps for dialogue, and 48fps for action, pans, etc.
alsoknownas
some bloke
I dunno - Hackney is a new cinema - everything is brand spanking new. Every other aspect of the presentation seemed perfect and well managed (to be fair there is nothing they can do about the image resolution - it is what it is (4k I think???)).
Gramsci
Well-Known Member
I have found that Picturehouse unlike Curzon do not always get it right. Nor understand if u say something is wrong. Even if its new it might not be set up right. The trouble with digital is that cinemas just slot them in and have got rid of the projectionists.Who would see a problem. In one cinema I use the manager sets up most of the projection now.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Reno
The In Kraut
Have you actually seen 48 fps?
It's horrible.
Where have you seen it and could you describe why it's horrible ? I have read various accounts, many negative but I'm intrigued. Could it have as much to do with the viewer having to adjust to a different look and experience ? In theory it sounds interesting.
alsoknownas
some bloke
But fast moving sequences and pans are terrible in the cinema. It would presumably help with that.Have you actually seen 48 fps?
It's horrible.
I shot some 50p footage the other day (as a test) - it was interesting - hyper-real, like a disturbing lucid dream. Could work for something. Problem is I couldn't even edit it, let alone distribute it anywhere.
Eta: 48fps would probably feel quite similar to 50i, I would have thought.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Seen it used for a couple of small films and a mate's music video (not shot on film but recorded on DV with film-like filters added later - 'film on the cheap').
The filters were actually pretty good as it looked much better when every other was frame was removed and the rate cut in half.
It removes the velvety warmth of film - everything looks like Holby City on the BBC HD channel.
I think people might get used to it over time, but there's something about that dreamlike quality of film on the light (and the relative relationship between exposure time and frame rate is part of that) that makes suspending disbelief and getting properly immersed in a film easier rather than harder.
Maybe that's just something Pavlonian that won't matter when people haven't grown up with it, I suppose.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Yes, it can help with pans and fast sequences and that's one of the selling points.
I think you're right about it working for some things - slowed-down nature footage can look fantastic.
I don't want to be lumped with it for all cinema releases in the name of 'progress' (or hiking ticket prices), though.
I think 48 fps would be better than 50i (I hate interlacing).
That is the fella! Couldn't think of the term, but digital banding it is. It can be really bad on some films, if there's a lot of shadow and night scenes. Not so bad that it ruins the film but it can detract from it somewhat.
I meant converted from celluloid to digital.
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
I have thought that fast action sequences in films recently have looked very confusing and jerky, but I'd not considered that that might be down to digital projection. I just thought it was shitty overuse of absurdly zoomy CGI in crap films.
skyscraper101
0891 50 50 50
Prefer digital. Hate scratchy, dusty celluloid making new films look old instantly.
I remember going to the cinema in the eighties as a kid and hating it. Even VHS was a better viewing experience.
I remember going to the cinema in the eighties as a kid and hating it. Even VHS was a better viewing experience.
Reno
The In Kraut
WTF is "absurdly zoomy CGI" ?
Reno
The In Kraut
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
CGI that zooms around between camera angles involving moving objects to such a degree that you just get fucking bored with it. See: Clash Of The Titans, and whatever the second Star Wars remake was called.
Reno
The In Kraut
Maybe you should just try and watch better films then. I wasn't aware they'd remade Star Wars yet, btw.
ska invita
back on the other side
with you all the way on that. the limitations of moving a real camera around bring things down to a human speed. i also dont like fast editing in 'exciting' sequences...its too fast for me. I seem to remember the last James Bond movie had a superfast edited opening sequnece that had me shouting 'slow down' at the screen -old-
ska invita
back on the other side
alsoknownas
some bloke
Skyfall was all shot on one or two cameras, negating the - just cut really fast to anything - style of recent action flicks.
Reno
The In Kraut
with you all the way on that. the limitations of moving a camera around bring things down to a human speed. i also dont like fast editing in 'exciting' sequences...its too fast for me. I seem to remember the last James Bond movie had a superfast edited opening sequnece that had me shouting 'slow down' at the screenld:
This is becoming a general whinge about films now and it has little to do with digital projection. CGI is a term invoked for all sorts of cinematic evils, even though it appears many people often don't know how and when it is used. In most cases CGI has absolutely nothing to do with camera moves. Unless it is an entirely digitally created scene, for most special effects shots an actual camera is used and then the effects get added later in post-production.
Unlike the incoherently shot and edited previous Bond film I thought the action scenes in Skyfall were shot and edited rather well. Maybe it's time to watch a few Merchant Ivory films.
alsoknownas
some bloke
To be fair I think Ska was on about QoS.Unlike the incoherently shot and edited previous Bond film I thought the action scenes in Skyfall were shot and edited rather well. Maybe it's time to watch a few Merchant Ivory films.
alsoknownas
some bloke
When I get a mo (which might not be for a while) I'm gonna do some research into pixel pitch and optimal viewing angles and such, and report back.
I bet you all can't wait.
I bet you all can't wait.
Reno
The In Kraut
That has the worst edited action scenes I have ever seen. Just had a whinge about it on the Skyfall thread the other day. Still doesn't have anything to do with either CGI or digital projection. It looked just as shit and headache inducing on conventional celluloid.
ska invita
back on the other side
yes i was - thanks
but CGI movement (such as in the new star wars films) is annoying too
Reno
The In Kraut
You find fast camera moves annoying. That can be done with a real or a CG camera and the effect is the same. It's not the computer that's at fault, it's the creative decision behind it.
ska invita
back on the other side
yes.
i love process though - process is everything. call me old fashioned but a virtual slow pan cgi/greenscreen shot will never beat a slow pan real world tracking shot. Thats why a genuinely breathtaking bit of camera movement like in Soy Cuba or The Shining is always going to whip a similar camera movement in a CGI generated field.
Which isnt really what this thread is about...>>> i dont particularly have a problem with digital cameras and digital projection - I read once that the UK often gets sent old prints from the US, and so the quality is already down a fair bit from earlier plays...better clarity on the screen can only be a good thing (never noticed pixels on a big screen before tbh...have from DVD on a big TV though)
Reno
The In Kraut
The vast majority of films I watch don't contain CG cameras , so it's not something I regard as a major problem or annoyance. All you have to do is to watch something other that effects heavy blockbusters or CG animation.
I do however work with CG cameras on an almost daily basis.
I do however work with CG cameras on an almost daily basis.
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