Change UK: Chuka Umunna resigns from Labour party and launches Independent Group

[Pickman's model]

you could certainly do with one you tedious gibbon.

that's the post of the thread

 

[Libertad]

a mini General Election.

What's one of those then?

 

[butchersapron]

What's one of those then?

In this case 7 labour MPs.

 

[SpookyFrank]

They could go with "Chukka's Muckers" and wait for the rhymes to pour in.

Pretty sure I've got copyright on that from c. 2015

 

[imposs1904]

'There's no comparison between this & the SDP...'

Nope, they started with 4 people just about everyone had heard of.

7 Bill Rodgers launch split from the Labour Party.

 

[dessiato]

 

[CRI]

 

[tim]

If they'd taken Tom Watson with them, I'd be more forgiving.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

7 Bill Rodgers launch split from the Labour Party.

tbf Rodgers was a former cabinet minister. It's not even that.

Googling, it's one of those 'he's still alive!?' moments.

 

[Wookey]

Honest question, as I've really just been ignoring a lot of the mess: how has Labour become a racist party? What new policies or messages have come about? Or is it a case of "the racists were always there and now they feel emboldened?". Or "racists have taken over the party?" In which case, again, how has that actually manifested itself?

As I say, genuine question. I know there's been a lot of shit thrown around on the internet, and some have trouble with Corbyn's past, but I'm still not sure I see the link between that and how the Labour party as an institution is racist/anti-Semitic.

I think it's an infiltration that hasn't been properly challenged by the leadership, and is worst on social media.

I don't know in detail how bad the problem is, as regards racism and anti-Semitism, partly of course because I'm a white anti-theist and I'm not in the Party. But I know that if a gay person that I respected said an organisation was institutionally homophobic, I would assume that to be the case unless and until it was proven otherwise.

That isn't the weight of evidence required in a criminal court of law, it's not even-handed or dispassionate. I'm aware of that. But we have a Holocaust within living memory that acts as a permanent warning signal of how quickly we can lose our shit as a society, so I don't need to see compelling evidence with my own eyes, because secondary reportage from the affected group is more than enough for me. Should be more than enough for anybody.

Yup, it's pre-emptive self-protection that I recognise in this, and share. Jews and gay people didn't stand in exactly the same queues in the concentration camps, but our deaths were the same. And there is an imaginary bell in my head, and when someone rings that bell with conviction and reason, as these people have, and Berger has been doing for a long time now, and lots of Jewish people have now been ringing a while, then I have to fucking listen, even though I'm not Jewish and so not a direct target of this...yet.

 

[Wookey]

you could certainly do with one you tedious gibbon.

A tedious gibbon. See, that is just poetry.

 

[Pickman's model]

I think it's an infiltration that hasn't been properly challenged by the leadership, and is worst on social media.

I don't know in detail how bad the problem is, as regards racism and anti-Semitism, partly of course because I'm a white anti-theist and I'm not in the Party. But I know that if a gay person that I respected said an organisation was institutionally homophobic, I would assume that to be the case unless and until it was proven otherwise.

That isn't the weight of evidence required in a criminal court of law, it's not even-handed or dispassionate. I'm aware of that. But we have a Holocaust within living memory that acts as a permanent warning signal of how quickly we can lose our shit as a society, so I don't need to see compelling evidence with my own eyes, because secondary reportage from the affected group is more than enough for me. Should be more than enough for anybody.

Yup, it's pre-emptive self-protection that I recognise in this, and share. Jews and gay people didn't stand in exactly the same queues in the concentration camps, but our deaths were the same. And there is an imaginary bell in my head, and when someone rings that bell with conviction and reason, as these people have, and Berger has been doing for a long time now, and lots of Jewish people have now been ringing a while, then I have to fucking listen, even though I'm not Jewish and so not a direct target of this...yet.

so you don't demand any of your actual evidence before making your mind up and spouting about it.

 

[Indeliblelink]

View attachment 162232

 

[tony.c]

So how long before Blair backs them? I reckon in time for the evening news.

 

[Shechemite]

The new season of The Thick of It is something else!

 

[Shechemite]

If they'd taken Tom Watson with them, I'd be more forgiving.

Can’t see Watson going for a PV personally

 

[treelover]

Not a fan of any of them(especially Leslie, who helped develop New Labours welfare reform programe) but Berger seems to have resigned on the one issue of A/S, she has faced huge amounts of abuse, from inside the LP and without, she even had a well known Liverpool Music Scene Face follow her on the street shouting about the 'Jews'.

 

[Athos]

Gemini. The symbol of two faces.

 

[butchersapron]

Not a fan of any of them(especially Leslie, who helped develop New Labours welfare reform programe) but Berger seems to have resigned on the one issue of A/S, she has faced huge amounts of abuse, from inside the LP and without, she even had a well known Liverpool Music Scene Face follow her on the street shouting about the 'Jews'.

Who is this and what happened?

 

[rubbershoes]

This thread illustrates perfectly how Urban isn't representative of labour supporters.

My and many of my friends are of the left but don't like Corbyn or brexit. A lot here would say we're not really of the left. But I stand with Wookey in being disappointed by Corbyn

I'm now clearing my inbox ready for the abusive PMs

 

[danny la rouge]

The "future of British politics".

 

[Raheem]

she even had a well known Liverpool Music Scene Face follow her on the street shouting about the 'Jews'.

Go on, gizza clue.

Really hoping it's not Gerry Marsden.

 

[treelover]

Who is this and what happened?

Phil Hayes, ex Picket manager/promoter

all over the Echo

updated

Hayes not Holmes

 

[philosophical]

What's one of those then?

A series of by elections on the same day is what I am getting at.

 

[brogdale]

This thread illustrates perfectly how Urban isn't representative of labour supporters.

Is it meant to be?
God how I wish I'd properly read the T&C when joining.

 

[mauvais]

It's not one of history's better coups is it? You'd think they could have at least got a tank off BAES on the never-never but they seem to have barely managed a written off clown car.

 

[danny la rouge]

Go on, gizza clue.

Really hoping it's not Gerry Marsden.

“How do you Jew what you Jew to me”?

 

[philosophical]

isn't lewisham east in london?

ah - i see you've missed some important words out

Yes. London Assembly politics

 

[philosophical]

go on then, make it

Is this an unfinished post?

 

[treelover]

This thread illustrates perfectly how Urban isn't representative of labour supporters.

My and many of my friends are of the left but don't like Corbyn or brexit. A lot here would say we're not really of the left. But I stand with Wookey in being disappointed by Corbyn

I'm now clearing my inbox ready for the abusive PMs

Never been a fan of Corbyn, though he got better, but I have lost faith in Team Corbyn and Momentum, etc, too much student type politics, not robust enough on challenging welfare reform, etc, still holding out for John McDonnell