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Brixton Liveable Neighbourhood and LTN schemes - improvements for pedestrians and cyclists

Isn't traffic pricing the only way to go, then there will be no argument about who is affected. It could also be intelligent i.e 7am in central ldn on a sunday could be 1p a mile?
 
I'd be all for replacing the C charge with a reduction in roadspace capacity in central london - give it over to bus lanes, cycle lanes and more pedestrian space.

Roadspace capacity reductions (which in effect is what LTNs are a type of) is fairest because you can't really bypass it by paying your way out of it.

But of course we know why anything like this is so hard to get implemented.
 
Here is what they are up against in one of the outer London boroughs (a reply to a resident from a councillor) -

View attachment 268605
Wow, that's awful, I do think that those who support changes to make walking, cycling, car use reduction are less vocal. We need to not be. I was told by one of my Cllrs to write to them all and my MP as they use their inboxes to gauge public opinion and if all they are hearing is complaints then they assume that's what the majority of their constituents think. I'm off to pen some more in support right now
 
Here is what they are up against in one of the outer London boroughs (a reply to a resident from a councillor) -

View attachment 268605
If their engineers aren’t aware of ways to make a roundabout more cyclist friendly they should be sacked, as all they need to do is Google “Dutch roundabout design”.

As for the rest - this is why the views of private motorists shouldn’t be taken into account until everyone else has been catered for. They need to be at the very bottom of the pile.
 
No, I feel pretty clear about the reason.

A very large portion of the openly presented argument against the LTN principle is the idea that it displaces traffic and pollution. On this specific point, there is agreement that things improve (pollution-wise) for those inside the LTN.

There is disagreement about the consequences for streets around the LTN, with opponents claiming that things here become unacceptably worse, and supporters claiming that the effects are small, and/or temporary, and are outweighed by the larger benefits.

Because those who support the LTNs are the ones that want to make a change from the status quo, they are put in this position of defending possible negative effects of making a change. They can talk all they wish about the current, ongoing negative consequences of not doing anything, but the anti-LTN side can avoid being held responsible for that because hey, they aren't suggesting changing anything, and it's for someone else to come up with alternative solutions.

Well, if the anti LTN side really believes that there's an overall benefit of maintaining things as they are; that is, traffic should not be concentrated on main roads but be allowed to disperse freely as it wishes, then there should be no objection to widening that strategy so that more people can benefit from it. Any existing measures which are designed to keep traffic on main roads are already causing harm, so these measures should be removed.

The purpose of asking the question "ok should we remove historical LTNs" is to put the anti side in the position of defending and justifying an active intervention that follows their claimed principles and beliefs.

Of course an anti LTN person doesn't want to be put in the position where they have to advocate something that will directly increase traffic and pollution on someone's street. Of course they don't want to become answerable to those people. That would require full courage in their convictions, and I don't believe they have it. If they did, they would prove it by being happy to advocate removing long-existing restrictions.

Speaking for myself - but I think this would apply to most people who are basically in favour of the LTNs - I do have the courage of my convictions. It might be that I am wrong, but I do genuinely believe that LTN type strategies are part of what needs to be done to reduce the problems that traffic creates. It is never easy when you are confronted with someone who tells you that they live on a main road, and they believe pollution has increased as a result. I am able in most cases to say to those people that I genuinely believe that pursuing the LTNs will in the long term make things better or at least no worse for them.

If those who oppose LTNs on the basis that they unfairly displace pollution to main roads really believe that, then their rationale should apply to LTNs whether they were put in place in 2020 or 1970. I would stop short of saying that all those who use this argument are doing so disingenuously (although I think some certainly are). I think there are probably lots of people for whom it's a genuine worry, but they may not be willing to examine the thinking behind it. Either way, the result is that whenever this question is asked, it is avoided.

I see the Guardian have picked up a story along these lines

 
People vandalising community garden projects like that has to be one of the more soul destroying things around.
Indeed - like I say don’t know if it’s to do with the LTN but it really does seem that people in favour of them want to improve our areas and lots of those against just want to be able to drive on all roads everywhere.

People opposed say a lot about other ways to cut air pollution but really don’t see them campaigning for anything else.

we need to deal with genuine issues LTNs may cause but I think we can agree the main principle is sound which is to reduce tthrough traffic on minor roads.
 
Vandalism of planters on Jelf Rd. Not sure if it’s connected to the LTN but terrible that anyone would do this.View attachment 269715

Here’s how it was before

View attachment 269716
I understand they are being rebuilt today at 11 am - if anyone want to help/show support. I find it so depressing that people think it's OK to vandalise thing like this. What is wrong with them??? How on earth can that be negatively impacting on anyone??
 
All I’m seeing there is a residential street with too many people driving on it. Perhaps it should be made an LTN too...

They've added a filter by the bridge art the Brixton end but the description of the first video mentions that the signs have been vandalised and says that's what's causing the issues. The council need to fix these as soon as they can and try and catch who's doing it.

But, yeah - the videos show that this sort of road isn't suitable for lots of traffic. You either need to reduce the traffic or remove some of the parking.
 
The video description -
While our lucky neighbours on Sandmere Road enjoy the benefits of going low traffic, the Ferndale LTN scheme continues to deliver misery and pain to the residents of Ferndale Road… because we now have all their traffic driving down our street! As nearly all of the Ferndale filters have now been vandalised and removed, except for the one at the end of Sandmere Road, all the local traffic is now being funnelled on to Ferndale Road. On weekdays, from 4pm to 8pm, a jam and the inevitable horn beeping can occur every 15 minutes. On Saturdays, the jams start earlier, and go on for longer. This video was shot at 9.20pm on Saturday night 22/05/21. Lambeth Council are now saying they cannot assess the scheme properly while the filters are being vandalised, but the residents of Ferndale Road are happy to do your job for you. As you can see, the scheme is clearly not working. Motorbikes did not drive on the pavement before. While some streets may be quieter, traffic has just been pushed on to other streets. At busy times Bedford Road is jammed solid from Acre Lane to Clapham North, and drivers try to escape down our street, so Ferndale Road has more traffic than it can handle. We don’t want to be a main road. We don’t want you to remove parking spaces on our street to facilitate the increased traffic. We don’t want cars idling outside our windows, and beeping their horns to let other cars know they should wait… or go… or wait. We had a quiet neighbourhood before. We want it back. Remove the Ferndale LTN!

It's a bit strange to say the scheme is not working at the same time as attributing the problems to the filters that have been vandalised. They could demand that Lambeth sort out the vandalised filters, rather than that Lambeth remove the LTN. You might be tempted to think they wouldn't like the LTN regardless of what's happening on their street.

On an earlier video they say

The Ferndale LTN has been a disaster from the start. Please remove it. Do not try to fix one bad idea with another. Do not make Ferndale Road one way or remove our parking spaces to accommodate the increased traffic we do not want on our residential street. Traffic and pollution on each road will reduce if vehicles are allowed to spread out across the whole road network. Remove the LTNs.

So they obviously sign up to the thinking that congestion and pollution can be solved by increasing the capacity of the road network. They go along with the idea that traffic will "spread out" rather than just filling up whatever capacity is given to it.

What they are observing from their window is traffic filling up capacity that is provided to it. In this particular case, capacity which has been provided by those who have vandalised the filters.

I'm not quite sure why Lambeth can't get on top of the issue of signs etc being vandalised. You'd think it would not be so complicated to set up CCTV in these locations funded by what they are receiving in fines from the ANPR locations.
 
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