Attendances....

[Dulwich Mishi]

No, cup ties could go to extra-time, and if it go too 'murky' they were simply abandoned, and then another replay was held.

Happy to stand corrected, but I believe if the tie was abandoned in xtra time then the replay would 'revert' to the opposition.

 

[Pink Panther]

No, cup ties could go to extra-time, and if it go too 'murky' they were simply abandoned, and then another replay was held.

That's what I said! I said there were no penalty shoot outs in those days, (which would have necessitated an even earlier kick off). The point I'm trying to make is that, in order to stand a realistic chance of completing a replay (with possible extra time), 4.30pm is the latest time you can kick off at that time of year with no floodlights, hence the kick off time that PD found 'bizarre' when posting details of this match.

 

[LeslieB]

Just out of interest, how far up the non league pyramid can you go before you start needing floodlights? Are there a set of FA requirements that say at level x in the pyramid you must have this, that and the other, and once you get to level y you must also have so and so.

The local team where my mum and dad live just compete in a field, and play in Midland football league division three. But there is bascially fuck all there, it is just a reasonably flat and level field. They kick off at 2pm in winter for the light. How far up can you go without needing these sort of facilities.

 

[Dulwich Mishi]

That's what I said! I said there were no penalty shoot outs in those days, (which would have necessitated an even earlier kick off). The point I'm trying to make is that, in order to stand a realistic chance of completing a replay (with possible extra time), 4.30pm is the latest time you can kick off at that time of year with no floodlights, hence the kick off time that PD found 'bizarre' when posting details of this match.

Ah, fair enough...often 'scan read' posts if I've got a backlog to catch up on, must have misr-read it.

 

[Dulwich Mishi]

Just out of interest, how far up the non league pyramid can you go before you start needing floodlights? Are there a set of FA requirements that say at level x in the pyramid you must have this, that and the other, and once you get to level y you must also have so and so.

The local team where my mum and dad live just compete in a field, and play in Midland football league division three. But there is bascially fuck all there, it is just a reasonably flat and level field. They kick off at 2pm in winter for the light. How far up can you go without needing these sort of facilities.

Floodlights are 'technically' needed all the way down to Step Six, which is the Kent Invicta League. I think when that league was formed a few years ago, as there was no 'step six' league in that corner of the south-east, clubs were given four years to get their grounds 'up to standard'. The majority have improved them, or groundshared, or got their oww grounds. One I was particularly impresed with was the tidy little ground that Glebe have established in Chislehurst.

Many lower level leagues, in effect, go against the gradings, by not relegating clubs from the bottom level of the steps if they don't/can't get lights up, unless they have a full complement of clubs who are floodlit.

Generally, some of the northern based groundhoppers mock the poor standard of both football and grounds at the bottom of the pyramid down south.

 

[LeslieB]

Thanks for that

 

[Roger D]

Clubs without the appropriate ground grading on 31/3/16 were supposed to be thrown out of level 6 at the end of this season. Given this was nearly 50% of clubs the FA have back tracked and they can stay, for now but can't move leagues, enter FA competitions etc.

The possibility the grading requirements may be ludicrously expensive for that level doesn't seem to have crossed their minds.

 

[PartisanDulwich]

Top Average non league crowds Step 3:
1280 Dulwich Hamlet
1082 Darlington
684 Blyth Spartans
631 Salford City
607 Weymouth

 

[LeslieB]

That's really good. Darlington is kind of understandable because they (or their predecessor) were a league club not that many years ago.

Everyone else, including the high profile Salford City, are trailing in your wake

 

[PartisanDulwich]

Chairman Jim Parmenter threatens to pull out of Dover Athletic unless crowds improve
By Dover Express | Posted: March 01, 2016

By Sam Inkersole

DOVER ATHLETIC chairman Jim Parmenter has threatened to walk away from the club if he doesn't see attendances at Crabble improve dramatically in the next six months.

"I have spent 11 years and £3million getting this club where it is, pushing for promotion, close to the top five, and getting a crowd of less than 600, it's not do-able.

Read more: Chairman Jim Parmenter threatens to pull out of Dover Athletic unless crowds improve

 

[GregDHFC]

Chairman Jim Parmenter threatens to pull out of Dover Athletic unless crowds improve
By Dover Express | Posted: March 01, 2016

By Sam Inkersole

DOVER ATHLETIC chairman Jim Parmenter has threatened to walk away from the club if he doesn't see attendances at Crabble improve dramatically in the next six months.

"I have spent 11 years and £3million getting this club where it is, pushing for promotion, close to the top five, and getting a crowd of less than 600, it's not do-able.

Read more: Chairman Jim Parmenter threatens to pull out of Dover Athletic unless crowds improve

Interesting tactic. Not convinced sulking is the best way to draw crowds, though.

 

[Joe K]

That's really good. Darlington is kind of understandable because they (or their predecessor) were a league club not that many years ago.

Everyone else, including the high profile Salford City, are trailing in your wake

Just going to put this here: Darlington 1883 and Darlington are the same club, whatever Wikipedia and the FA might have to say about it.

 

[Dulwich Mishi]

Sorry...disagree totally...even if it's got the same fanbase.

 

[Joe K]

We paid the money we were told we had to pay so we could have our football share, but the FA insisted on demoting us with a name change. It wasn't a Salisbury/ Hereford situation.

That doesn't, of course, mean - as I think I said to you on the bus somewhere or other, possibly Ramsgate - that I think it's okay for clubs to run up shitloads of debt to (for example) the St John's Ambulance then use administration as a way to avoid paying it off. It's just that we've been treated differently to other clubs who have behaved that way.

 

[Al Crane]

Chairman Jim Parmenter threatens to pull out of Dover Athletic unless crowds improve
By Dover Express | Posted: March 01, 2016

By Sam Inkersole

DOVER ATHLETIC chairman Jim Parmenter has threatened to walk away from the club if he doesn't see attendances at Crabble improve dramatically in the next six months.

"I have spent 11 years and £3million getting this club where it is, pushing for promotion, close to the top five, and getting a crowd of less than 600, it's not do-able.

Read more: Chairman Jim Parmenter threatens to pull out of Dover Athletic unless crowds improve

The match day experience at Dover and general relationship with supporters is exactly the reason I now have a season ticket for Dulwich and not Dover.

I can't see that Jim's plea will be answered. Years of generally poor quality football and an even poorer relationship with supporters have eroded any hope of being able to regularly get the crowd numbers required to successfully sustain a Conf Prem team let alone a Football League one. If you factor in that the Town is generally on its knees and half the catchment area is made of water you're not left with much of fanbase to tap into.

The facilities at the ground are good but being told where to stand, what you can and can't say, bag searches etc. are all things that for me mean it's no different from watching Premiership football, it's just a bit less expensive and the football is poorer. Its exactly the sort of thing we should avoid.

There was a great opportunity to build up a new fan base when they dropped down to the Ryman South because the cost of running the Club should have been less (therefore savings passed onto supporters) but forming teams of well paid players isn't cheap and they effectively bought their promotions, tried to be a professional set up but completely fucked the family element of the Club and have lost many fans on the way.

Lots of people asked me who I would have supported if Dulwich had beaten Guiseley and gone onto play Dover in the next round of the FA Trophy. It's a tough one but I think I would probably have stood with the Hamlet such is my growing disillusion with Dover.

 

[Scutta]

The facilities at the ground are good but being told where to stand, what you can and can't say, bag searches etc. are all things that for me mean it's no different from watching Premiership football, it's just a bit less expensive and the football is poorer. Its exactly the sort of thing we should avoid.

 

[Joe K]

The match day experience at Dover and general relationship with supporters is exactly the reason I now have a season ticket for Dulwich and not Dover.

I can't see that Jim's plea will be answered. Years of generally poor quality football and an even poorer relationship with supporters have eroded any hope of being able to regularly get the crowd numbers required to successfully sustain a Conf Prem team let alone a Football League one. If you factor in that the Town is generally on its knees and half the catchment area is made of water you're not left with much of fanbase to tap into.

The facilities at the ground are good but being told where to stand, what you can and can't say, bag searches etc. are all things that for me mean it's no different from watching Premiership football, it's just a bit less expensive and the football is poorer. Its exactly the sort of thing we should avoid.

There was a great opportunity to build up a new fan base when they dropped down to the Ryman South because the cost of running the Club should have been less (therefore savings passed onto supporters) but forming teams of well paid players isn't cheap and they effectively bought their promotions, tried to be a professional set up but completely fucked the family element of the Club and have lost many fans on the way.

Lots of people asked me who I would have supported if Dulwich had beaten Guiseley and gone onto play Dover in the next round of the FA Trophy. It's a tough one but I think I would probably have stood with the Hamlet such is my growing disillusion with Dover.

I do often wonder if the demographic shift in football supporting will be from medium-sized and small clubs to (comparatively) tiny clubs, rather than from massive clubs to small clubs. So many of the more active new supporters at Dulwich didn't migrate from the Premier League, but from L1, L2 and Conference teams - often a matter of geographical necessity, I know, but I also think it's the bottom end of the professional game/ the very top of the semi-professional one where the bullshit of modern football is felt most sharply. As you say, going to watch Dover (or Darlington a few years back) is subject to most of the same restrictions as the Premier League, but instead of watching David Silva or Juan Mata you're watching a team of never-been big lads your pragmatist manager has assembled in a desperate bid to stave off relegation.

Clapton give the impression of also having a number of fans who've come from watching the dog-end of professional football, and I think it's something we'll see at more and more Step 3/4/5 clubs over the next few years.

 

[the 12th man]

Well we move up to 20th thanks to all the hard work of many with mainly only really big ex league clubs above us!

NonLeagueMatters

 

[dcdulwich]

Interesting. Hereford FC (7th highest crowds) are playing in the 9th tier Midlands Football League. They look set to get promoted having won ten on the bounce recently in the league and reaching the FA Vase final. They're the phoenix club which grew out of the defunct Hereford United in 2014, last seen at tier 7 (their badge includes the words: Forever United).
Got to admire their motto, transferred from the old club: 'Our greatest glory lies not in never having fallen, but in rising when we fall'.

 

[EDC]

Interesting. Hereford FC (6th highest crowds) are playing in the 9th tier Midlands Football League. They look set to get promoted having won ten on the bounce recently in the league and reaching the FA Vase final. They're the phoenix club which grew out of the defunct Hereford United in 2014, last seen at tier 7 (their badge includes the words: Forever United).
Got to admire their motto, transferred from the old club: 'Our greatest glory lies not in never having fallen, but in rising when we fall'.

They should have incorporated a Parka is the badge though, THAT pitch invasion is all I remember them for.

 

[Pink Panther]

They should have incorporated a Parka is the badge though, THAT pitch invasion is all I remember them for.

And the huge bull they parade around the pitch before each home game. Apparently they've asked to take one to Wembley to parade before the FA Vase Final!

 

[PartisanDulwich]

Great validation of the work on the pitch and in the community - Thanks to an army of volunteers #respect to all

As stated most teams with large attendances are ex League clubs and we were only 43 off Bromley (those winter rearranged games probably cost us)

Anyway next season we have a very real chance of ending up as London's No 1 non-league supported team

 

[Monkeygrinder's Organ]

As stated most teams with large attendances are ex League clubs and we were only 43 off Bromley (those winter rearranged games probably cost us)

Anyway next season we have a very real chance of ending up as London's No 1 non-league supported team

If we're 43 off Bromley I'd think we'd be bringing in comfortably more home fans than them already. Without Maidstone in the league our gates haven't really been pushed up by any particularly big away followings this year while they will have had some much bigger ones with all the ex-league teams in their division.

With the current growth of crowds it's not unrealistic to think some games will hit capacity next year. The club needs to be planning how they'll deal with that IMO.

 

[YTC]

We've got to have serious chat about the bar situation before next season.

 

[darryl]

 

[darryl]

Season average at Champion Hill: 1,343.

Attendance tables - The Ryman Isthmian Football League

 

[SDE]

Really shockingly bad organisation again yesterday. Such a shame. We brought 3 newbies along, (very lovable, honest) Palace fans. They were astonished at the level of bag/pocket-checking on the way in ("Never seen anything like that at a Premier League game, mate") and their summary of the actual match was "Errr, I spent most of the time queueing for things". They left before the end to get a beer elsewhere. It was more of the same down the EDT post-match, surrounded by wankers. Urgh!!! Sorry, really struggling to enjoy home games at the moment. Thankfully, we managed to find some decent mash-up booze-fest solace elsewhere and had a good day of it in the end. All of which had very little to do with DHFC. I really don't want to take anyone new down Champion Hill again for a long long time. It's embarrassing. I buzz about the club all the fucking time and want to be proud to take people there and play host for the day, but it's impossible to do that with a straight face right now. I had a moan to Matt / Hadley a few weeks back and they seemed to sort things out amazingly quickly for the next game. But it was back to the same old shit this weekend. 1 step forward, 3 back. What a joke. Can't be arsed to repeat my long list of gripes. I don't buy the whole big crowds thing as an excuse. We should be expecting this. It's such a HUGE commercial opportunity. And we're paying (PAYING!!!) total muppets to be in charge of things on the day. The duo selling beer tokens up in the clubhouse were desperately in need of a fucking pulse between them. And the bar manager is a waste of fresh air. I'm pretty damn sure there are plenty of qualified people we could approach and say: "Hey, we're expecting 2,000 this Saturday. Fancy running the show for 30% profits?" and they'd cream it. On a specific point, one of the most common things I hear, which is so easily fixed, is "Why don't they change the hinges on the door?" [at the top of the steps leading up to the clubhouse]. Is such a small thing, which would make such a big difference, really that difficult? When thinking back to the first time I went to a DH game, I remember very clearly what I loved about it and why I instantly returned. If that first experience had've been yesterday, I don't think I'd go back. Rant over. For now. So glad there are no more home games this season. Can't wait for next weekend. An away game. Hoo-fuckin'-ray!

 

[Scolly]

Bought two ale tokens and the girl had to use a calculator to add up 2 x3.80 and them the other used it to calculate my change from £8 and then game me 30p! Really could be arse going back for correct change.

 

[Dulwich Mishi]

And the huge bull they parade around the pitch before each home game. Apparently they've asked to take one to Wembley to parade before the FA Vase Final!

Not when we went there in that FA Trophy game.It's was during the 'Mad cow' crisis and we got boo's rather than moo's from all round the ground when we sang "BSE, BSE, BSE..."

Great 'old skool' Rabble day out...apart from the result, which no-one realyl cared about, as we all expected to lose!

 

[AndyDHFC]

Not when we went there in that FA Trophy game.It's was during the 'Mad cow' crisis and we got boo's rather than moo's from all round the ground when we sang "BSE, BSE, BSE..."

Great 'old skool' Rabble day out...apart from the result, which no-one realyl cared about, as we all expected to lose!

I will never forget you walking into the chemist I was working in, with a daft grin on your face enjoying refusing to tell me who we had drawn for about 10 minutes or so ...