Apple iPad and related items

[elbows]

You don't get that when a new Sony or HP product is announced.

Probably do, its just far less noticeable. For Sony its probably reaches noticeable levels when it comes to games consoles, and within a more limited high-end/prosumer audience things like cameras, tvs and fancy hi-fi's.

Brands of all sorts have their lovers and haters, and its no surprise that as Apple have a very visible brand and a mountain of hype these days, that they get a lot of the attention. I dont think Apples critics will succeed in bringing Apples visibility down to a more acceptable level, because they just bring more attention to Apple stuff by adding to all the talk about Apple, what will actually bring Apple down is really good alternative products marketed well by competitors, or simply the passage of time (& poor decisions on Apples part) leading to the fading of their star.

I dont really care if it seems silly and over the top to talk in terms of products and brands forming part of our identities, its no more absurd than other things that made up our identity in the past such as geographical location, religion, favorite musical genres. And its been a triumph of propaganda that a world of mass produced goods which are more uniform than was previously possible, have been sold to people on the basis of supporting their individuality.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Apple iPad is announced

You keep banging on and on about this mysterious "anti-Apple brigade" but where are they? I see endless magazine pages, blogs, Tweets, websites and newspapers full of frothing Apple fans gleefully uploading high fiving videos and superlative-packed praise, but where can I find this "anti-Apple brigade"?

Who's their equivalent of Stephen Fry? Where are the websites? Where are the magazine articles?

You never seen a negative comment about apple online ever? I thought you were a connected guy! There's always fanboyish detractors just like there are against Sony, nintendo or Microsoft...it's just a fact that one polar extreme will provoke the opposite.

Anyway like I say people that idolise apple are as idiotic as those that instinctively jump to slag them off....

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Apple iPad is announced

Probably do, its just far less noticeable. For Sony its probably reaches noticeable levels when it comes to games consoles, and within a more limited high-end/prosumer audience things like cameras, tvs and fancy hi-fi's.

Brands of all sorts have their lovers and haters, and its no surprise that as Apple have a very visible brand and a mountain of hype these days, that they get a lot of the attention. I dont think Apples critics will succeed in bringing Apples visibility down to a more acceptable level, because they just bring more attention to Apple stuff by adding to all the talk about Apple, what will actually bring Apple down is really good alternative products marketed well by competitors, or simply the passage of time (& poor decisions on Apples part) leading to the fading of their star.

I dont really care if it seems silly and over the top to talk in terms of products and brands forming part of our identities, its no more absurd than other things that made up our identity in the past such as geographical location, religion, favorite musical genres. And its been a triumph of propaganda that a world of mass produced goods which are more uniform than was previously possible, have been sold to people on the basis of supporting their individuality.

The detractors are clearly as obsessed with apple as the fan bois. Probably just a load of undiagnosed OCD sufferers I mean why else would you spend so much energy on this??

 

[elbows]

The detractors are clearly as obsessed with apple as the fan bois. Probably just a load of undiagnosed OCD sufferers I mean why else would you spend so much energy on this??

I can think of loads of good reasons why people might talk about Apple too much.

Like it or not, their stuff is presently a bit of a cultural phenomenon, its what lots of people keep talking about, good and bad, both media and individuals online.

Its a company that has some very specific approaches to a variety of things which may get people hopping mad, issues that may be worth harping on about such as control over what apps run on the device.

It suggests not enough other companies are innovating and succeeding in areas that become increasingly important in this internet age.

And never underestimate the internal conflict that can arise when you end up using a product because it currently seems to be the best one, but the brand is incompatible with your own sense of self, values. There have always been plenty of Apple users who do not like the cult of Apple, and the iphone brings these conflicts to the pockets of the pub-goer.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Apple iPad is announced

Does Apple have too much influence?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/04/debate-apple-steve-jobs

 

[FridgeMagnet]

That is a pretty silly article.

We already know that iPhone owners use it incessantly as an internet gateway and that they use their PCs less. The iPad is likely to turbocharge this trend. So we could be heading for a time when a significant proportion of internet users will access the network via a gateway controlled by a single powerful, secretive company. And a world in which most online paid-for journalism comes through a channel controlled by that same company.

That's just basically cock, unless you believe that Apple have internet filters on all of their devices, in which case I have a selection of highly-effective tinfoil hats I would like to sell you.

 

[elbows]

There are some silly points on both sides of that article, the one that is positive about Apple features even more stupidity.

The bit you quote is not quite as silly as it seems, at least when it comes to apps and paid content, where Apple are indeed the gatekeeper. I am sad that many of those who have concerns about the very real control that Apple exert over many aspects of the device and content, feel the need to make the stakes seem higher and the fear greater by conveniently forgetting to mention the web browser as a gateway to content that is not controlled by Apple. Unfortunately its not restricted to these criticisms of Apple, Ive seen it before with debates about net neutrality and h.264 licensing terms - it makes some sense that those who are fighting for freedom/openness and dont want to see us 'sleepwalk into a new trap' would draw attention to the implications and worst case scenerios, but I think they usually go well beyond that, ralying the troops with disproportionate fear rather than building alternatives that deliver in a meaningful way.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

But it isn't about apps and paid content. It explicitly says "internet users will access the network via a gateway controlled..." which is rubbish - quite apart from the fact that works on the same old "omg iPads will take over the world it really IS the future of computing" premise based on the wildest imaginings of fanboys and Apple PR (even the well-established iPhone only constitutes a tiny number of the mobile devices used), Safari does not and can't filter content. It is not a controlled gateway. When Safari starts to have content filters I would switch to another device. I'm far far more concerned about mandatory ISP and government content filters, which already exist.

The pro-Apple one is just pretty vapid tbh, it barely says anything.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Apple iPad is announced

That is a pretty silly article.

That's just basically cock, unless you believe that Apple have internet filters on all of their devices, in which case I have a selection of highly-effective tinfoil hats I would like to sell you.

Indeed, the article in the yes assumes people don't have brains to make other choices.

 

[elbows]

I mean lets look at this sentence ' And a world in which most online paid-for journalism comes through a channel controlled by that same company.'

There is a real chance that Apple may end up getting a lot of clout in the publishing industry, some power and control, and will have some say in how things are reshaped and potentially the content itself. In some areas it may actually improve things for customers, where Apples ideas are more progressive than the old distribution network it usurps, in other ways it can bring new horrors, restrictions or price implications for consumers, creators and the rest of the industry. A mixed bag thats worthy of watching and discussing as it happens.

But no, they have to go and stretch the fear too far with suggestions that most online paid journalism will come through channels controlled by them, which again is ignoring the wider web and the ability that sites featuring journalism will retain to charge customers to consume their content without going through the Apple gatekeeper taking its cut. Apple may get a nice big market share, enough to set some industry rules, but they dont become the only game in town. I mean heck, itunes is huge, and is the easiest option for me to purchase music for the ipod, but there is nothing to stop me buying music from other sources and using it on the ipod. Likewise Apple are leaving a few doors open besides the web for people to get books etc to get onto the iPad. The ultimate nightmare that some people fear will not happen unless they block off these gateways that they are not the keeper of, and I think if they went that far they would face a huge backlash and lose users, gotta keep an eye on them to make sure they dont push harder in this regard but its hardly a forgone conclusion that Apples way will lead us down this, the darkest of paths.

 

[elbows]

And as for the apparent pro-Apple bias in the media, I think there are plenty of reasons for it. Ive never been bowled over by the quality of reviews and especially not technology reviews. Lazy or poorly informed journalists, going with the flow, jumping on the bandwagon, unable to resist joining in the hype, not wishing to go against conventional wisdom or fail to back a winner, being easily impressed by commercial success, identifying with certain aspects of the brand, actually liking the devices because they fit their own needs quite well despite being a poor choice for others (apple airbook!), commercial interests interfering with integrity, saying what they think will be in tune with their audience, hoping that some of Apples kudos will rub off on them, being able to personalise the story by focussing on Apples highly visible figurehead, and probably others.

 

[mitochondria]

how many apple fanboys are there?

the remains of my faith in humanity would be shattered

shedload of ipads though - what do you think is their profit per item?

 

[elbows]

The pro-Apple one is just pretty vapid tbh, it barely says anything.

It makes amusingly absurd assertions which would be dangerous if many people believed them, as if the quality of the chairs are a guarantee against brutal dictatorship.

 

[elbows]

the remains of my faith in humanity would be shattered

shedload of ipads though - what do you think is their profit per item?

Not sure of exact profit but a fairly tidy sum. All the same they will be drooling over another potential prize, the amount of money they can extract from the ipad users by getting them to buy various sorts of content on a regular basis.

I dont think the various phenomenon surrounding Apple should be cause to change levels of faith n humanity, I dont think there is anything really unique happening here that we havent seen before. We know how much power and influence corporations can weild once they dominate an industry. We know that people are preapred to sacrifice many freedoms if they percieve that there are benefits to doing so, no matter how superficial those benefits may turn out to be in the grand scheme of things. We know that some people love certain brands and form very strong attachments to certain products. We know that strong aspects of form and design can overcome other limitations. We know that people can get all tribal and take things personally and that platform wars are a new ism, that humans are obsessed with what we have in common and what sets us apart.

 

[laptop]

That is a pretty silly article.

...we could be heading for a time when a significant proportion of internet users will access the network via a gateway controlled by a single powerful, secretive company. And a world in which most online paid-for journalism comes through a channel controlled by that same company.

That's just basically cock, unless you believe that Apple have internet filters on all of their devices, in which case I have a selection of highly-effective tinfoil hats I would like to sell you.

Interestingly, this is the line Google's been (thinking about) pushing.

Rather than donning tinfoil hats, they're asking about proprietary news-reader formats, and the possibility of iNews following on from iTunes.

 

[sunnysidedown]

I'm not sure how 'critical' a review can be from a lifelong Mac super-fan posting on a Mac bulletin board, but there you go.


Elsewhere the hype really is getting ridiculous:

iPad: "Like the Beatles of 2010"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/04/04/sunday/main6362239.shtml

I would rather read a critical review of the new Beatles album by someone who was a fan and had all their albums, than by someone who didn't have any... let alone someone who was a closet Stones fan, or someone who thought they had to comment just because it's the new Beatles album and I have to say something.

 

[editor]

I would rather read a critical review of the new Beatles album by someone who was a fan and had all their albums, than by someone who didn't have any..

I'd always prefer to read open-minded, independent, non-aligned reviews written by people who aren't already self-confessed life-long fans of the band/product they're reviewing, but each to their own, eh?

 

[editor]

Here's an interesting article about the hype surrounding the iPad.

And before I hear the usual bleating, please note: It was written by a self confessed Apple fanboy.

I don't recall any other product launch getting this sort of press—except, maybe, the iPhone. But just about every Apple product introduction is greeted with this sort of media frenzy. Incremental upgrades in the company's laptops are deemed worthy of coverage that must be the envy of Apple's competitors.

Quick quiz: When was the last time you saw coverage of the latest Thinkpad or Sony Vaio release? Never happens. Do you remember the coverage of Microsoft's efforts at a tablet computer (a proto-iPad) several years ago? I didn't think so. Do you remember voluminous takeouts a couple years ago when Asus, Dell, HP and others pioneered the netbook category, which was arguably as significant a development in portable computing as the iPad? Nope, didn't happen. But we're marinating in the iPad.

http://recoveringjournalist.typepad.com/recovering_journalist/2010/04/padding-the-coverage.html

 

[grit]

I'd always prefer to read open-minded, independent, non-aligned reviews written by people who aren't already self-confessed life-long fans of the band/product they're reviewing, but each to their own, eh?

Same goes the opposite direction regarding an axe to grind, but each to their own, eh?

 

[editor]

Same goes the opposite direction regarding an axe to grind, but each to their own, eh?

Who's written an "axe-grinding" review?

 

[elbows]

Here's an interesting article about the hype surrounding the iPad.

It made some good points. Some slight over egging of its points here and there, eg the idea that wide coverage of certain product launches by other corps 'never happens', though Id certainly agree that it rarely happens to the extent achieved by Apple in recent years.Personally I thought that iphone hype & media frenzy reached a more offensive level than ipad did, partly because of longer gap between product announcement and availability of iphone, partly because smart mobile phones were a surefire hit, a form factor lots of people clearly wanted, unlike tablets which still has unknown potential market size. Plus the form & UI was new with the iphone, creating a wow factor, whereas the ipad struggled to meet the stupidly high expectations and didnt have some mega new wow. The coverage is more positive now but from both individual consumers and journalists the initial reaction upon unveiling of the ipad was quite negative, an anticlimax in some ways. It may not be reflected in the actual sales figures, but even the extent of the queues does not give off quite the frenzied feel that the jesus phone launch did.

 

[sunnysidedown]

I'd always prefer to read open-minded, independent, non-aligned reviews written by people who aren't already self-confessed life-long fans of the band/product they're reviewing, but each to their own, eh?

so you only trust reviews on Apple products by people who do not use/own Apple products?

define independent/non-aligned.

that review I posted was open-minded (they were pretty critical of the device), independent (they do not work for Apple or write for tech sites/mags) - as for non-aligned, if you already have an Apple product are you aligned?

 

[moose]

I get my work iPad on Wednesday. I'd report back, but I'm a long-time fangirl, so my opinion is probably worthless

They're already having supply/demand issues, I note - I've pre-ordered 104 on behalf of a client, and they emailed last week to say we can only have 2 with the balance coming in May and June.

 

[Pie 1]

You keep banging on and on about this mysterious "anti-Apple brigade" but where are they?

There's a fuck ton of them on CiF who pile into pretty much any Guardian article/blog piece on Apple that allows comments.

 

[stupid dogbot]

Anyway like I say people that idolise apple are as idiotic as those that instinctively jump to slag them off....

Thanks for taking time out of your busy Xbox schedule to share your opinion with us, Billy Jnr.

 

[gabi]

Standing outside an Apple store in Arlington, Va., Saturday, was John Kay, a 27-year-old employee of AT&T. He would pay for just about anything Apple made and said, "If they came out with a $US1000 microwave, I'd buy the microwave."

from an article I've just read

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Apple iPad is announced

Thanks for taking time out of your busy Xbox schedule to share your opinion with us, Billy Jnr.

 

[grit]

There's a fuck ton of them on CiF who pile into pretty much any Guardian article/blog piece on Apple that allows comments.

I'd describe editor as a member of the anti apple brigade tbh.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Apple iPad is announced

I'd describe editor as a member of the anti apple brigade tbh.

I wouldn't. He's ott to be sure but he owns an iPhone now so he's at least got an informed opinion derived from personal experience.

 

[grit]

I wouldn't. He's ott to be sure but he owns an iPhone now so he's at least got an informed opinion derived from personal experience.

ill take it back as I dont have the energy to get dragged into another circular discussion on the same old shit.