Accused rapist Ched Evans to be released from prison

[bimble]

Yes, actually. When this case started there had just been a similar one locally where a bloke had 'picked up' an incredibly drunk girl after a night out, followed her and.....she didn't remember, because she was utterly pissed. But they eventually pieced together enough information, and got him to tell a bunch of what became obvious lies, so that he got sent down for rape. It's a sadly all too common way that certain scumbags commit rape, because they know they've got such a bloody good chance of getting away with it.

ok. Didn't know that. That's good, the local police deserve more respect given that. Retracted.

 

[hegley]

Yes. It's very ugly. It is the fault of the police and the CPS though.

Nothing to do with his so called mates who've named her time and again on social media to the extent that she's had to move several times.

 

[Athos]

Would it be very rude to use the word conspiracy theory here?

Not rude, but certainly reaching. Anyone approaching the case from a neutral stance is bound to consider that possibility, in the circumstances.

 

[Athos]

So you think it's a coincidence that in this particular case it was a famous millionaire footballer involved; The police and CPS would have shown the same intense interest in forensically reconstructing her night that she had no memory of had it turned out to have been just some bloke/s.

Similarly, you have to wonder whether he'd have been acquitted if he was Joe Public/light on funds.

 

[bimble]

Nothing to do with his so called mates who've named her time and again on social media to the extent that she's had to move several times.

They started it is all i meant. But belboid 's new info above gives me reason to shut up about the local police.

 

[planetgeli]

Maybe quick from blood but not hair or urine How long do drugs stay in your system? - Drug and Alcohol Information and Support in Ireland - Drugs.ie

10/10 for pedantry, and yes, you're correct. All except for the fact that the reports state that, as is normal in sample testing, BLOOD tests were taken from all involved in the case.

 

[Orang Utan]

They started it is all i meant. But belboid 's new info above gives me reason to shut up about the local police.

No, Evans and McDonald started it

 

[planetgeli]

It's not a drug and it dosen't.

Er, alcohol is a drug and leaves the blood stream within 10-12 hours.

You have just lost any credibility you may have had.

Are you deliberately making a challenge for most ridiculous post in the thread?

 

[bimble]

No, Evans and McDonald started it

I might not agree with you but think I get where you're coming from, that their behaviour was so morally reprehensable that in your opinion the police were right to start an investigation along those lines.

 

[bemused]

Er, alcohol is a drug and leaves the blood stream within 10-12 hours.

I often wonder at what point it will become socially unacceptable to go out with your friends for the evening then let them wander off alone shit faced?

 

[Athos]

I might not agree with you but think I get where you're coming from, that their behaviour was so morally reprehensable that in your opinion the police were right to start an investigation along those lines.

They would have been right to start an investigation if they had reasonabe grounds to suspect that a crime had been commited. We don't know the police's rationale, and the factors they took into consideration. But the fact that there were ultimately grounds to charge, and to avoid any sucessful submission of no case to answer at the end of the prosecution case (twice), would seem to vindicate their decision.

 

[Athos]

I often wonder at what point it will become socially unacceptable to go out with your friends for the evening then let them wander off alone shit faced?

When Evans is around.

 

[Joe Reilly]

They started it is all i meant. But belboid 's new info above gives me reason to shut up about the local police.

Don't be so quick to let them off the hook. Ask yourself first what the population of Rhyl is?

 

[bimble]

When Evans is around.

There are thousands of Evanses everywhere, opportunists who see women as things to be used, and there are also thousands of young women on any given Saturday night out drunk / high. As I see it the question at the heart of this case is where is the line where we all can agree that a crime has been committed when these two meet.
If she had made an accusation I would not be here at all and the case would probably have proceeded differently, but she didn't. Which is what makes X a sort of blank slate / test case for all of our prejudices.

 

[ViolentPanda]

With regarsds to why the witness came forward later, i belive that the sexual dominance of the alleged victim with the witnesss a short time after the alleged rape was so out of character with somebody who had just been raped that he felt compelled to come forward. This is indeed judgmental but bares no baring on the facts.

Except that what constitutes "out of character" during or soon after a traumatic event, is incredibly hard to determine. What is common to trauma is peri-and post-traumatic dissociation or similar behaviour-warping psychological protections.

As for what you believe, your beliefs are irrelevant. In your own words they have "no baring [sic] on the facts".

 

[bimble]

Don't be so quick to let them off the hook. Ask yourself first what the population of Rhyl is?

Some 25,000 souls apparently. What's your point? That the police were onto a juicy headline winning case instead of the usual drudgery ? That's what I thought too, but willing to stand corrected as per the belboid

 

[Athos]

There are thousands of Evanses everywhere, opportunists who see women as things to be used, and there are also thousands of young women on any given Saturday night out drunk / high. As I see it the question at the heart of this case is where is the line where we all can agree that a crime has been committed when these two meet.
If she had made an accusation I would not be here at all and the case would probably have proceeded differently, but she didn't, which is what makes X a sort of blank slate / test case for all of our prejudices.

It also means those thousands of young men now know they need just get a woman so drunk that she can't remember whether or not she consented, and find someone else willing to say they've had sex with her (and bung in some salacious details), and they're home and dry.

 

[bimble]

It also means those thousands of young men now know they need just get a woman so drunk that she can't remember whether or not she consented, and find someone else willing to say they've had sex with her (and bung in some salacious details), and they're home and dry.

I totally agree with you that this high profile failed case brought by the state has been a disaster in every way for x and for women in general.
His being found guilty and then being cleared are both pretty much incidental to the damage done.

 

[Joe Reilly]

Some 25,000 souls apparently. What's your point? That the police were onto a juicy headline winning case instead of the usual drudgery ? That's what I thought too, but willing to stand corrected as per the belboid

My point is she phoned police to report a missing handbag. It was they who persuaded her down the criminal route. They did so in the full knowledge her identity would have been in the public domain within weeks or days. But they had targets to meet. Alternatively they thought it was about time a couple of big time Charley's were brought down a peg or two. Not forgetting either that careers might be enhanced by a high profile collar. Whatever the combination of (win,win,win) factors involved their concern for her welfare can be put at about zero. Collateral damage.

 

[Pickman's model]

10/10 for pedantry, and yes, you're correct. All except for the fact that the reports state that, as is normal in sample testing, BLOOD tests were taken from all involved in the case.

Yeh. If I was being pedantic I'd have pointed out your information not wholly accurate

 

[Spymaster]

My point is she phoned police to report a missing handbag. It was they who persuaded her down the criminal route. They did so in the full knowledge her identity would have been in the public domain within weeks or days. But they had targets to meet. Alternatively they thought it was about time a couple of big time Charley's were brought down a peg or two. Not forgetting either that careers might be enhanced by a high profile collar. Whatever the combination of (win,win,win) factors involved their concern for her welfare can be put at about zero. Collateral damage.

Add to that, she didn't want the case brought.

 

[bimble]

My point is she phoned police to report a missing handbag. It was they who persuaded her down the criminal route. They did so in the full knowledge her identity would have been in the public domain within weeks or days. But they had targets to meet. Alternatively they thought it was about time a couple of big time Charley's were brought down a peg or two. Not forgetting either that careers might be enhanced by a high profile collar. Whatever the combination of (win,win,win) factors involved their concern for her welfare can be put at about zero. Collateral damage.

My instinct is to agree with you on this, it is hard to believe they had her interests at heart, but for Belboid's post above, which does suggest that the police there in Rhyl is seriously interested in this sort of thing and willing to put time into it even when no footballers are involved.

Does anyone know where her handbag was - did it turn up?
Just occurred to me that was she missing her phone when she woke up? If she hadn't been missing her handbag she might have phoned a friend instead of going to the police station.

 

[Athos]

... But they had targets to meet. Alternatively they thought it was about time a couple of big time Charley's were brought down a peg or two. Not forgetting either that careers might be enhanced by a high profile collar. ...

Pure speculation. They might just as easily chosen to pursue it becasue they had a stack of itelligence reports to suggest that Evans and McDonald regularly raped women. You don't know one way or the other. But you choose to belive one interpretation, without any evidence, becasue it suits your agenda. Transparent.

 

[Pickman's model]

My point is she phoned police to report a missing handbag. It was they who persuaded her down the criminal route. They did so in the full knowledge her identity would have been in the public domain within weeks or days. But they had targets to meet. Alternatively they thought it was about time a couple of big time Charley's were brought down a peg or two. Not forgetting either that careers might be enhanced by a high profile collar. Whatever the combination of (win,win,win) factors involved their concern for her welfare can be put at about zero. Collateral damage.

Tbh I'd have thought it a bit of a gamble if they believed careers might be enhanced as an embarrassing failure could ruin said careers.

 

[bimble]

You don't know one way or the other. But you choose to belive one interpretation, without any evidence, becasue it suits your agenda. Transparent.

As do you Athos. Or are you just right, morally right, no speculation and no agenda involved.

 

[equationgirl]

You have a lot to say how a court works clearly without ever having been in one.

Please answer the question.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Please answer the question.

He doesn't like the question so he'll dodge as per.

 

[Athos]

As do you Athos. Or are you just right, morally right, no speculation and no agenda involved.

No I don't; I've said that I don't know the police's rationale for pursuing the case. I've not chosen to believe one of a number of possible explnations which best suits my agenda.

Nothing in the arguments I've advanced is predicated on speculation; the only times I've advanced speculation is to demonstrate that two could play that game - at no time have I relied upon it.

 

[bemused]

It also means those thousands of young men now know they need just get a woman so drunk that she can't remember whether or not she consented, and find someone else willing to say they've had sex with her (and bung in some salacious details), and they're home and dry.

Do you really believe men look at this case I think 'blimey, that's how I get away with rape'?

 

[Pickman's model]

You have a lot to say how a court works clearly without ever having been in one.

I've been in lots of courts: mags - Haringey, Highbury, Barnet, Horseferry Rd, clerkenwell, Neasden; crown - blackfriars, Southwark, Snaresbrook, Harrow, Wallington; courts of justice. I think I've a reasonable notion how a court works.