The drowning of rural Welsh valleys in order to provide English cities with water

[editor]

Interesting piece from the History of Wales FB page showing how Wales was shamelessly plundered by the English authorities:


The drowning of rural Welsh valleys in order to provide English cities with water, often by compulsory purchase and without compensation, is a controversial subject which over the years has led to many protests.

On 2nd January 1982, The Welsh Army of Workers claimed responsibility for a bomb explosion at the Birmingham headquarters of the Severn Trent Water Authority. An hour later a second bomb was found and defused at the main complex of the International Development Corporation (IDC) in Stratford-upon-Avon. No one was hurt by the bombings, which were part of a campaign for local authorities from Birmingham and the West Midlands to pay for the water they receive from the Elan Valley reservoirs.

1880's - Lake Vyrnwy in Montgomeryshire was the first reservoir in Wales and at the time, it was the biggest man-made lake in the world. It was built to supply water to Liverpool and Merseyside and involved flooding the head of the Vyrnwy valley and submerging the small village of Llanwddyn.

1890s - The City of Birmingham Corporation bought 180km² of land in the Elan and Claerwen valleys in Powys, as there was an increasing demand for water in Birmingham for public health reasons and for industry.

1904 - The Elan Valley reservoir was opened to supply water to the City of Birmingham. The three dams opened there were - Craig Goch, Pen y Garreg and Caban Coch, with a surface area of 500 acres.

1907 - Llyn Alwen near Betws y Coed was constructed by the Wirral Water Board.to provide 9 million tonnes of water per day to Birkenhead.

1923 - Welsh MP's prevented the Corporation of Warrington drowning the Ceiriog valley near Wrexham.

1952 - Claerwen reservoir and dam in Elan Valley was opened and the area was leased by the Midlands for 999 years for a sum of 5 pence a year. It provides 75 tonnes of water per day.

1965 - Consruction of the Llyn Celyn reservoir in Gwynedd involved the drowning of the village of Capel Celyn, to supply water to Liverpool

1967 - Llyn Clywedog near Llanidloes was built to supply water to Birmingham and the English Midlands, following an Act of Parliament ordering its creation, despite strong local opposition.

 

[Pickman's model]

So much easier to drown rural valleys than urban ones

 

[planetgeli]

1965 - Consruction of the Llyn Celyn reservoir in Gwynedd involved the drowning of the village of Capel Celyn, to supply water to Liverpool

Remember Tryweryn.

Pivotal moment in Welsh nationalism as it was given a surge by yet more violence to the Welsh from the English who wanted water in Liverpool.

You can rail against nationalism all you like, just don't be surprised there is a cause and effect when you wipe away whole villages and valleys.

 

[platinumsage]

It's something that is easy for nationalists to jump on to, yet you don't see Northumberland residents bombing Tyne and Wear on account of the Kielder Water abstractions.

All infrastructure is going to be objected to by someone, it's a case of the weighing the costs and benefits.

 

[chilango]

My Mum went out with a lad who bombed some reservoir project in the 60s.

 

[planetgeli]

It's something that is easy for nationalists to jump on to, yet you don't see Northumberland residents bombing Tyne and Wear on account of the Kielder Water abstractions.

What a brilliant argument, I'd never thought of that. An almost direct equivalence.

 

[editor]

View attachment 246643

Remember Tryweryn.

Pivotal moment in Welsh nationalism as it was given a surge by yet more violence to the Welsh from the English who wanted water in Liverpool.

You can rail against nationalism all you like, just don't be surprised there is a cause and effect when you wipe away whole villages and valleys.

And to rub salt in the wounds:

Labour peer Lord Elystan Morgan has told a BBC documentary that in the 10 years preceding the flooding Liverpool’s population and its drinking water needs fell.

He added: “But Liverpool was selling industrial water to 24 other authorities, making a lot of money – and it wanted to maximise that profit. That’s what Tryweryn was about.”

Tryweryn 50 years on: What happened, why and what is the legacy?

The controversial project was finished when the reservoir officially opened on October 21, 1965

www.walesonline.co.uk

 

[Pickman's model]

It's something that is easy for nationalists to jump on to, yet you don't see Northumberland residents bombing Tyne and Wear on account of the Kielder Water abstractions.

All infrastructure is going to be objected to by someone, it's a case of the weighing the costs and benefits.

The costs are rarely paid by those who extract the benefits

 

[littlebabyjesus]

The Elan Valley aqueduct, using only gravity to get water all the way to Brum, was a marvel of Victorian engineering.

Big populations need safe water supplies. Providing those supplies was a great triumph of the Victorian age. In the 70s/80s, we would often get hosepipe bans before Birmingham, which was a bit galling. A tale of underinvestment in Welsh services for Welsh people, though, more than the English stealing our water, and more generally underinvestment in particular rural areas across the UK. This pattern isn't unique to Wales.

This, of course, was totally shit...

The Birmingham Corporation Water Department achieved an Act of Parliament in 1892 enabling the compulsory purchase of the Elan Valley.
"The people of the village had no say," said Glyn Webster at Elan Valley Visitors Centre.
"About 100 people had to move out and around 20 buildings were destroyed.
"Most of the villagers were tenant farmers and only the land owners were given a small amount of compensation."

Why Birmingham's water comes from Wales

The shitness is the lack of compensation for those people, not so much the fact they were forced to move. Big engineering projects often involve the forced removal of people, and 100 people forced to move is quite a low number for such a big project.

 

[Red Cat]

View attachment 246643

Remember Tryweryn.

Pivotal moment in Welsh nationalism as it was given a surge by yet more violence to the Welsh from the English who wanted water in Liverpool.

You can rail against nationalism all you like, just don't be surprised there is a cause and effect when you wipe away whole villages and valleys.

This was in The Crown (I think). First time I was aware this had happened.

 

[existentialist]

It's something that is easy for nationalists to jump on to, yet you don't see Northumberland residents bombing Tyne and Wear on account of the Kielder Water abstractions.

All infrastructure is going to be objected to by someone, it's a case of the weighing the costs and benefits.

Wales has a rather long history of being exploited for its resources by England, and it has largely been a one-way trade, as evinced by the shattered remains of the South Wales industrial economy - when it could no longer serve English purposes, it was dumped - coal mines, railways, ports, infrastructure.

That kind of thing breeds nationalism, and when you start flooding big bits of a land which has developed that nationalistic outlook, it's no surprise that some of it will become violent.

 

[chilango]

This was in The Crown (I think). First time I was aware this had happened.

Yeah it was.

They omitted all the bombings (including the two dead in the attempt on the royal train) though.

 

[kebabking]

The Elan Valley aqueduct, using only gravity to get water all the way to Brum, was a marvel of Victorian engineering.

Big populations need safe water supplies. Providing those supplies was a great triumph of the Victorian age. In the 70s/80s, we would often get hosepipe bans before Birmingham, which was a bit galling. A tale of underinvestment in Welsh services for Welsh people, though, more than the English stealing our water, and more generally underinvestment in particular rural areas across the UK. This pattern isn't unique to Wales.

This, of course, was totally shit...



Why Birmingham's water comes from Wales

The shitness is the lack of compensation for those people, not so much the fact they were forced to move. Big engineering projects often involve the forced removal of people, and 100 people forced to move is quite a low number for such a big project.

Elan Valley pipeline on NYE...

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Wales has a rather long history of being exploited for its resources by England, and it has largely been a one-way trade, as evinced by the shattered remains of the South Wales industrial economy - when it could no longer serve English purposes, it was dumped - coal mines, railways, ports, infrastructure.

Not sure Wales vs England is very illuminating here, though. The gutting of South Wales industry is part of the same process that has seen industry gutted across the UK, including in England. The way it was done was part of the class war waged by the Tories in the 80s and 90s across the UK without prejudice, or should I say with equal prejudice.

 

[Plumdaff]

There's also the fact that even if every Welsh MP votes against these developments they still go ahead. In fact this lack of clout will get worse now as the number of Welsh MPs is reduced and the Internal Market Bill means much devolution can be overridden. The fact that many English regions are equally poorly served isn't an argument against the obvious fact that the current UK settlement is shit for Wales.

 

[planetgeli]

View attachment 246654
Elan Valley pipeline on NYE...

About 10 years ago there was a major project to install a gas pipeline from Milford Haven to England. It goes literally past my house, two fields away (about 100m). Construction went on for about 2 years, finished on time (boy did they throw money at it) and massively scarred the landscape of south and west Wales while it was going on.

They put everything back as it was. It was so fucking impressive to see, 12 months later, when you wouldn't know any work had taken place. Topsoil, hedges, plants - everything was replaced exactly as it was, or as exactly as you can get.

The fact I live in a village without gas only rankles a tiny bit because the workmanship was so excellent.

 

[existentialist]

About 10 years ago there was a major project to install a gas pipeline from Milford Haven to England. It goes literally past my house, two fields away (about 100m). Construction went on for about 2 years, finished on time (boy did they throw money at it) and massively scarred the landscape of south and west Wales while it was going on.

They put everything back as it was. It was so fucking impressive to see, 12 months later, when you wouldn't know any work had taken place. Topsoil, hedges, plants - everything was replaced exactly as it was, or as exactly as you can get.

The fact I live in a village without gas only rankles a tiny bit because the workmanship was so excellent.

Just the occasional stripy pole by the side of the road...yeah, that was pretty incredible.

 

[nogojones]

My Mum went out with a lad who bombed some reservoir project in the 60s.

The Welsh dambusters

 

[StoneRoad]

I'm always surprised that the Northumbrian & Pennine Reservoirs garnered so little protests, and what occurred was as easily ignored as the Welsh dissent, or so it seems.

[Cow Green was one protest I was involved with ... but "industry" won out over "environment" ...
much as the economy seems to be trumping saving lives in the Covid Pandemic ]

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

The Elan Valley aqueduct, using only gravity to get water all the way to Brum, was a marvel of Victorian engineering.

It really was. Over 70 miles long, with water travelling at approx 1.5 mph, taking nearly 2 days to travel its length, being propelled by gravity alone.

 

[ddraig]

There's also the fact that even if every Welsh MP votes against these developments they still go ahead. In fact this lack of clout will get worse now as the number of Welsh MPs is reduced and the Internal Market Bill means much devolution can be overridden. The fact that many English regions are equally poorly served isn't an argument against the obvious fact that the current UK settlement is shit for Wales.

LBJ often argues glib, weak points with self assured certainty, weird that they are sort of justifying these acts and abuses

 

[Pickman's model]

The Elan Valley aqueduct, using only gravity to get water all the way to Brum, was a marvel of Victorian engineering.

Big populations need safe water supplies. Providing those supplies was a great triumph of the Victorian age. In the 70s/80s, we would often get hosepipe bans before Birmingham, which was a bit galling. A tale of underinvestment in Welsh services for Welsh people, though, more than the English stealing our water, and more generally underinvestment in particular rural areas across the UK. This pattern isn't unique to Wales.

This, of course, was totally shit...



Why Birmingham's water comes from Wales

The shitness is the lack of compensation for those people, not so much the fact they were forced to move. Big engineering projects often involve the forced removal of people, and 100 people forced to move is quite a low number for such a big project.

It'd have been a wonder of Roman engineering. many centuries after frontinus wrote his 'aqueducts of rome' you'd hope such a feat well within the capabilities of Victorian engineers

 

[pogofish]

I'm always surprised that the Northumbrian & Pennine Reservoirs garnered so little protests, and what occurred was as easily ignored as the Welsh dissent, or so it seems.

My memory is that Keilder in particular attracted significant and spirited opposition - which was largely ignored through two public enquiries by the water authority who were probably at the height of their power/influence and financial abilities before the scheme. Because of this, the government backed them to the hilt, despite there already being evidence that the economic/industrial and population changes that were going to hit the region from the 1970s-onwards would lead to a big reduction in water supply requirements.

Anyway, when the political, financial and vested interest clusterfuck that Keilder became had worked-through, there was IIRC a promise (again later ignored, esp in Wales) from the government that it would be the last scheme of its type and the whole sorry mess became the very excuse/lever/justification for the Thatcher Government’s determination to privatise the water authorities from the mid-80s onwards.

 

[mwgdrwg]

Turn off the taps!

 

[StoneRoad]

My memory is that Keilder in particular attracted significant and spirited opposition - which was largely ignored through two public enquiries by the water authority who were probably at the height of their power/influence and financial abilities before the scheme. Because of this, the government backed them to the hilt, despite there already being evidence that the economic/industrial and population changes that were going to hit the region from the 1970s-onwards would lead to a big reduction in water supply requirements.

Anyway, when the political, financial and vested interest clusterfuck that Keilder became had worked-through, there was IIRC a promise (again later ignored, esp in Wales) from the government that it would be the last scheme of its type and the whole sorry mess became the very excuse/lever/justification for the Thatcher Government’s determination to privatise the water authorities from the mid-80s onwards.

Now I live in the area, I've gradually found out a lot more of the local ill-feeling towards the railroading that went on over Kielder ...
I know, from my academic background, added to that information - the reasons for Kielder Water, and the pipelines connecting the Tyne. Wear & Tees rivers were almost out of date before the schemes were finished. ie the collapse / destruction of the regions heavy industries and the alternative demand from domestic users would always be a magnitude lower.
The main reason I'm suspicious of pumping water to different catchments and using the rivers for some of the distribution is the risk of ecological damage. The water from Kielder has different proportions of various dissolved chemicals when compared with the Wear & the Tees. (Not the Tyne, Kielder is a natural headwater for the R. North Tyne).
Kielder and the over-provision of domestic water supply does have a minor advantage ... the water co. does not usually need to strictly enforce controls during droughts.

 

[agricola]

It'd have been a wonder of Roman engineering. many centuries after frontinus wrote his 'aqueducts of rome' you'd hope such a feat well within the capabilities of Victorian engineers

Of all the surviving works from the classical age, its that one that shows humanity at its best.

There are loads of things that survived because they were about war, politics, jokes, how to be a bellend or worst of all religion but that (and Vitruvius, come to think of it) were actually useful, the sort of knowledge few people would ever think about writing down in case their society collapsed (or copied to preserve it). I also like to think he used to read it to people at parties.