Study suggests that cats may get health benefits from vegan diet

[andysays]

Scientist 1: We need to cut back our our meat consumption for the sake of the environment.

Scientist 2: In the US, the canine population was responsible for between 25 and 30% of the animal production impact regarding land use, water, and fossil fuels, so we need to cut back drastically

Researcher: A fresh study has suggested that a vegan diet is not only safe for pet cats, but may have health benefits as well as reducing the environmental damage caused by the meat industry

Normal people: Well that's just great if the vegan food is proved safe, healthy and enjoyable for pets. Let's see if further research backs this up.

Urban: OMG! Obligate carnivores! Obligate carnivores! It's a worthless peer reviewed study! Dodgy journal! Tobacco industry! Human morals! Human beliefs! XL Bullys! CALL IN THE RSCPCA!

teuchter will be along soon to point out Urban75's lack of empathy for ordinary people who value vegan diets for cats

 

[BigMoaner]

12 pages. Day ban for one poster. C bombs x 2

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

Ooh. So they could live healthily off cucumbers and Red Bull.

Never done me any harm.

 

[mentalchik]

It would have to be proved with out any doubts that my cats would suffer no health problems (cats, unlike dogs are obligate carnivores and have to have meat) before even considering this...also how much will it cost ?

 

[CNT36]

It is worth noting that at least some of the "vegan" cats were receiving treats that contained meat. Many were taking supplements for Taurine and other amino acids, nutrients etc.

 

[teuchter]

teuchter will be along soon to point out Urban75's lack of empathy for ordinary people who value vegan diets for cats

When it comes to veganism, urban75 actually seems not very different from the general population, or at least, not very different from a similarly elderly part of the population. That is, reactionary and backwards. The response to this thread does seem to confirm this.

 

[klang]

and have concluded that cats can get quite ill and die through a lack of taurine.

a can of red bull / day should sort that.

 

[teuchter]

Not to mention the "five freedoms" of animal welfare, which inform the 2006 animal welfare act:

• need for a suitable environment
• need for a suitable diet
• need to be able to exhibit normal behaviour patterns
• need to be housed with, or apart, from other animals
• need to be protected from pain, suffering, injury and disease.

This is a very silly argument. If you think "normal behaviour patterns" means doing what they would do if they were not kept as a pet, then no-one should be keeping animals as pets. And they certainly shouldn't be feeding them meat based processed cat food from the supermarket.

 

[NoXion]

This is a very silly argument. If you think "normal behaviour patterns" means doing what they would do if they were not kept as a pet, then no-one should be keeping animals as pets. And they certainly shouldn't be feeding them meat based processed cat food from the supermarket.

Cats are domesticated animals. Living with and being fed by humans is a normal behaviour for them.

 

[ouirdeaux]

When it comes to veganism, urban75 actually seems not very different from the general population, or at least, not very different from a similarly elderly part of the population. That is, reactionary and backwards.

Leaving out the question of whether this is true (unlikely), surely that should be be a Good Thing for someone who thinks that Urban75 should be in favour of the Royal Family, or at least show more empathy for those who do.

 

[NoXion]

In this case the method of gathering data was to give vegan pet owners an anonymous questionnaire about their pets health, filled in by the pet owners themselves.

I struggle to see how anybody can not see how robust those results are likely not to be.

So, the actual results are: vegan pet owners think their pets health is pretty good.

This the most damning part IMO. The "study" is complete junk.

 

[A380]

Presumably if the vegan fed cats were hungry of felt they were lacking in some nutrients they's just go and fill up on birds and voles?

 

[teuchter]

Cats are domesticated animals. Living with and being fed by humans is a normal behaviour for them.

That's kind of the point. If humans are choosing what they get to eat then being fed vegan catfood is no more or less normal than being fed meat based catfood.

 

[teuchter]

Leaving out the question of whether this is true (unlikely), surely that should be be a Good Thing for someone who thinks that Urban75 should be in favour of the Royal Family, or at least show more empathy for those who do.

Not sure who "thinks that urban75 should be in favour of the Royal Family".

But yes we should have some empathy for people who find it difficult to change old-fashioned views and assumptions.

 

[Griff]

Vegan Diets are Healthier and Safer for Cats and Dogs – Or Are They?

Back in April 2022, a study made the headlines, after a peer-reviewed analysis of around 2,500 pets found that vegan dogs visit the vet less often and require fewer medications. This week, we have another, with the Guardian stating ‘Cats may get health benefits from vegan diet, study suggests’...

www.vetvoices.co.uk

Not sure if this has been posted.

 

[NoXion]

That's kind of the point. If humans are choosing what they get to eat then being fed vegan catfood is no more or less normal than being fed meat based catfood.

Except that vegan food is nutritionally deficient for cats.

 

[bimble]

Cats are domesticated animals.

This is not any kind of a simple or universally agreed fact, though. It’s more tenuous than that with a cat.

 

[CNT36]

Not sure who "thinks that urban75 should be in favour of the Royal Family".

But yes we should have some empathy for people who find it difficult to change old-fashioned views and assumptions.

Anyone under 355 should definitely know better.

 

[NoXion]

This is not any kind of a simple or universally agreed fact, though. It’s more tenuous than that with a cat.

Cats are better able to handle themselves in the absence of humans than most domesticated animals, sure. But I don't think domestication necessarily entails dependence. There's arguments that cats may have "domesticated themselves" so to speak, rather than being actively sought out for domestication by humans. Regardless, felis catus can find themselves much more comfortable around humans than most other felines.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Vegan Diets are Healthier and Safer for Cats and Dogs – Or Are They?

Back in April 2022, a study made the headlines, after a peer-reviewed analysis of around 2,500 pets found that vegan dogs visit the vet less often and require fewer medications. This week, we have another, with the Guardian stating ‘Cats may get health benefits from vegan diet, study suggests’...

www.vetvoices.co.uk

Not sure if this has been posted.

That's excellent. Answers all the questions really about the numerous limitations of this study. That 90% of the cats were non-vegan, that on average the vegan cats were 2 years younger, that the cats were more likely to be indoors cats, the likely personal beliefs and biases of the owners, conscious and unconscious, their likely attitude towards vets and 'conventional' pet medicine...

As FM said, the only robust finding of the study really is that vegan cat owners who are motivated to take part in studies generally think they're doing the right thing for their cats.

 

[teuchter]

Except that vegan food is nutritionally deficient for cats.

The discussion is about whether it may be possible to feed cats a vegan diet that is not nutritionally deficient. The study quoted in the OP may not convincingly demonstrate this. It may or may not become convincingly demonstrated in the future. The point is that using the "it's not normal" (implication: not "natural") argument is silly when we are talking about animals kept as pets.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

This is not any kind of a simple or universally agreed fact, though. It’s more tenuous than that with a cat.

It's not really so tenuous. The vast majority of domesticated cats exhibit neoteny - the maintaining of kitten-like traits into adulthood. You see the difference soon enough if you try to look after a genuinely non-domestic cat.

 

[teuchter]

That's excellent. Answers all the questions really about the numerous limitations of this study. That 90% of the cats were non-vegan, that on average the vegan cats were 2 years younger, that the cats were more likely to be indoors cats, the likely personal beliefs and biases of the owners, conscious and unconscious, their likely attitude towards vets and 'conventional' pet medicine...

As FM said, the only robust finding of the study really is that vegan cat owners who are motivated to take part in studies generally think they're doing the right thing for their cats.

That article has a much less kneejerk tone than the majority of replies to this thread though.

Towards the conclusion it says:

The results of this study are encouraging for the potential of a new and complete dietary choice for owners that also allows them to maintain their belief system while having the joy of pet ownership.

 

[NoXion]

The discussion is about whether it may be possible to feed cats a vegan diet that is not nutritionally deficient. The study quoted in the OP may not convincingly demonstrate this. It may or may not become convincingly demonstrated in the future. The point is that using the "it's not normal" (implication: not "natural") argument is silly when we are talking about animals kept as pets.

The fact that doctors and dieticians don't (as far as I know) endorse the diet of "eat what you want, and take supplements to fill in the nutritional gaps" for humans, suggests that it would be easier just to feed cats meat.

 

[bimble]

It's not really so tenuous. The vast majority of domesticated cats exhibit neoteny - the maintaining of kitten-like traits into adulthood. You see the difference soon enough if you try to look after a genuinely non-domestic cat.

Really? I thought that was something that hadn’t had time to happen. You mean behavioural traits not physical ones?

Also because I’m having a productive day at work, just enjoyed this possibly true story about a cat.

Unsinkable Sam - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[littlebabyjesus]

That article has a much less kneejerk tone than the majority of replies to this thread though.

Towards the conclusion it says:

My first post on this thread started like this:

Not exactly worthless but certainly no more than 'interesting results perhaps justifying more rigorous research'.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Not sure why a carnivore should be force fed vegetables to maintain its owner’s principles given said carnivore can still catch mice.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Really? I thought that was something that hadn’t had time to happen. You mean behavioural traits not physical ones?

Also because I’m having a productive day at work, just enjoyed this possibly true story about a cat.

Unsinkable Sam - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Both. So physical features such as round head and large eyes. Behavioural features such as kneading, which is something kittens do to their mothers. Yes, domestic cats are much more independent than domestic dogs, but they're still very much domesticated.

Humans exhibit neoteny as well, of course. It's a sure sign of domestication.

 

[bimble]

Are you saying humans are domesticated animals.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Yes.