Spain introduces ‘Universal’ Basic Income

[Smokeandsteam]

A significant move.

The presence of socialists in government is, of course significant. But there also appears to be political consensus on its introduction.

Three immediate thoughts are:

1. How radical this is - and the debate about that question - will now have some substance. Whilst this is clearly about saving capital rather than replacing it the actual lived experience of it will throw up political, economic and cultural processes that could be significant.
2. The return of the state and interventionist national government reverses a trend in Europe that has developed alongside neo-liberalism over the past 40 years.
3. For those, and I have occasionally lapsed into thIs myself, who dismiss academic ideas as abstract then the work of Guy Standing appears to be conclusive proof to the contrary.

Spain to become first country in Europe to roll out a universal basic income

Government plans to keep payments ‘a permanent instrument’ after pandemic is over

www.independent.co.uk

 

[planetgeli]

A significant move.

The presence of socialists in government is, of course significant. But there also appears to be political consensus on its introduction.

Three immediate thoughts are:

1. How radical this is - and the debate about that question - will now have some substance. Whilst this is clearly about saving capital rather than replacing it the actual lived experience of it will throw up political, economic and cultural processes that could be significant.
2. The return of the state and interventionist national government reverses a trend in Europe that has developed alongside neo-liberalism over the past 40 years.
3. For those, and I have occasionally lapsed into thIs myself, who dismiss academic ideas as abstract then Guy Standing appears to be conclusive proof to the contrary.

Spain to become first country in Europe to roll out a universal basic income

Government plans to keep payments ‘a permanent instrument’ after pandemic is over

www.independent.co.uk

Can someone do that beat the ad-blocker thing please?

 

[Pickman's model]

A significant move.

The presence of socialists in government is, of course significant. But there also appears to be political consensus on its introduction.

Three immediate thoughts are:

1. How radical this is - and the debate about that question - will now have some substance. Whilst this is clearly about saving capital rather than replacing it the actual lived experience of it will throw up political, economic and cultural processes that could be significant.
2. The return of the state and interventionist national government reverses a trend in Europe that has developed alongside neo-liberalism over the past 40 years.
3. For those, and I have occasionally lapsed into thIs myself, who dismiss academic ideas as abstract then Guy Standing appears to be conclusive proof to the contrary.

Spain to become first country in Europe to roll out a universal basic income

Government plans to keep payments ‘a permanent instrument’ after pandemic is over

www.independent.co.uk

i see this was announced by nadia calvino. is she a socialist? it's unclear - she seems very much a technocrat judging by her eu experience

 

[Smokeandsteam]

i see this was announced by nadia calvino. is she a socialist? it's unclear - she seems very much a technocrat judging by her eu experience

The architect of the scheme is José Luis Escrivá (who is most definitely not a socialist). That’s why is must be understood as a move to provide space. It’s also contingent and limited to the poorest 2.5 million households.

However, what its introduction means in terms of how it’s individually and collectively received is, in my view, an unknown.

 

[Argonia]

So no need to go to the fucking Jobcentre?

 

[tim]

The architect of the scheme is José Luis Escrivá (who is most definitely not a socialist). That’s why is must be understood as a move to provide space. It’s also contingent and limited to the poorest 2.5 million households.

However, what its introduction means in terms of how it’s individually and collectively received is, in my view, an unknown.

If it's means-tested it can't be universal.

 

[Brainaddict]

So it's not universal then. It's conditional.

 

[Crispy]

UBI from the right is a means to dismantle the welfare state

 

[Smokeandsteam]

UBI from the right is a means to dismantle the welfare state

its not from the right. It’s from a coalition of the Spanish Socialist Workers’ party and Udinas Podemos

 

[Crispy]

its not from the right. It’s from a coalition of the Spanish Socialist Workers’ party and Udinas Podemos

The architect of the scheme is José Luis Escrivá (who is most definitely not a socialist).

This guy isn't from the right? José Luis Escrivá - Wikipedia

 

[Smokeandsteam]

So it's not universal then. It's conditional.

Its "a general mechanism to guarantee earnings for families with no or low income" but yes

 

[ska invita]

1. How radical this is - and the debate about that question - will now have some substance. Whilst this is clearly about saving capital rather than replacing it the actual lived experience of it will throw up political, economic and cultural processes that could be significant.
[/URL]

The thought I always come back to on this is that Basic Income radical changes the relationship between the state and its subjects - it has the opportunity to be the thin end of a wedge. Everything that happens afterward is the regular political struggle.

That article is from 6th April and has little detail.
It seems to be a temporary measure, not unlike furlough money etc. with a wish that it become permanent.
A long way to go there it seems.....

How much money are people on the scheme getting?

So no need to go to the fucking Jobcentre?

One of the best things about it, especially so under the current UK regime of impossible hoop jumping.

 

[redsquirrel]

The thought I always come back to on this is that Basic Income radical changes the relationship between the state and its subjects

How so? Has that relationship changed in Alaska? In Finland? Did the introduction of the minimum wage cause a radical change between the 'state and its subjects'? Interesting terminology there BTW, not the state and labour, but state and its subjects.

(U)BI is not without certain advantages but the above view (which mirrors Standings) is dangerously naive. What will change the relationship between states and workers is the power of labour, not top-down measures implemented by the state.

 

[treelover]

Seeing as the response in most european countries to the ideology and implementation of welfare reform from civil society, unions, the left, etc, has been truly pathetic, especially in the U.k, where thousands have taken their own lives, and millions live in misery and fear, then UBI may be the only option that provides some light in the tunnel and that abstractions mean nothing to these people.

 

[SpackleFrog]

I am interested in this discussion but mainly I just want to say Standing is a reactionary prick.