Old Negatives

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I thought that looked more like MARD, rather than an S



reckon it probably is.

Yeah, I thought anything but an S but I think it was the only watchmaker on that list of surnames that began MAR. However, I think I remember that list being from 1830s so probably not the same. Need a census of Spon Street for 1871 maybe?

Have found other barber/surgeon poles similar.

Did wonder as the one in the picture doesn't seem to have a bowl, but doesn't look like this one does either

 

[cybertect]

I'm pretty certain that the building on the corner of Barras Lane is this one

http://www.cwn.org.uk/heritage/orga...reservation-trust/1999/01/990113-car-link.htm

now preserved by the Spon End Building Preservation Trust, apparently

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

This is how it looks today. Bit confusing because although it says it's at the junction of Barras Lane/Spon Street, on google maps, it seems to become Windsor Street

The end property looks nothing like it used to. I'm guessing it's been converted into two shops?

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Before restoration

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Info on the restoration

http://www.regenwm.org/media/documents/blackswanterracerevadewm.pdf

 

[mick2007]

OK, Here is the reply I got from Rob from the Historic Coventry website.

'It's Spon Street looking westward, taken from somewhere near the modern-day Percy Street. At first, like yourself, I also thought from the "Barras Lane" sign that it must be Holyhead Road, which a modern map would lead us to believe.

However, the street names around there have apparently been altered, and rather than Windsor Street joining up Holyhead Road to The Butts, according to both my 1851 and 1905 maps Barras Lane used to continue southward, ending at Spon Street - with Windsor Street forming a crossroad off to the south (left on your wonderful photo).

The building that you used to show the close-up of the street name....
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5300/5528051051_08c2761bf0_o.jpg
is the old Black Swan - part of the Swan Terrace, and is on the north-west corner of the Spon St - Barras La - Windsor St junction. I have a friends photo of that pub from around 1900, and have copied it below - you can still see the street name under the eaves, although possibly repainted or altered. Another photo is on the library site here...
http://www.picturesofcoventry.co.uk.../www.picturesofcoventry.co.uk/jpgh/c05865.jpg

I think, judging from the pub numbering in my book "The character of Coventry", that the pub on the right of your photo is the Windmill at number 105 (not the Old Windmill, which is still in existence farther down the street on the other side, nearer 'town').'


This one is an old hall that burnt down in 1889 called Bagington Hall... obviously taken before the fire..

..and here's the after effects.

There's a good read about the history of the place here.

http://www.baginton-village.org.uk/...-baginton-hall/4-baginton-hall-the-great-fire

I also found again a copy of the neg I have in the Coventry Library..which makes me want to know even more now, who took these buggers.

http://www.picturesofcoventry.co.uk...yout=coventry&keyval=coventry.image_no=c05207

I can't seem to find a thing on this one, so be my guest..

 

[miss minnie]

The Commercial or Temperance Hotel on the corner of Union Street and Warwick Lane is not the same as The Three Tuns Commercial Hotel which was on Warwick Road close to Bull Yard at the bottom of Hertford Street - if you stood outside the Three Tuns and looked at 45degrees to your left, you would be looking at The Temperance Hotel over the road

Aha, although similar I could only imagine that there must have been a major extension and refurb for the Temperance to have become the Three Tuns.

 

[miss minnie]

Looks like a sign for Thomas Marston, Watchmaker, Spon Street may have been there, but I'm not sure that's an "s" after the M in the shop sign for watch manufacturer

Across the road from the watchmaker is "Gibbs Coach Builder" in the high res image

Perhaps the old guy in the workshop is James Gibbs himself? The lathes look like woodworking lathes circa mid 19th century, possibly correlating with the age of the negative and of Mr Gibbs?

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,293597.0.html

I would be pleased for any details of James Gibbs, coach builder of Spon St, Coventry, both as to whom he was apprenticed, and those apprenticed to him (hopefully giving his sons' names).

He was born in 1796 and so I'd guess that he started his own apprenticeship at about 13/14 years of age, so about 1810. He continued at his trade until his death in 1866.

 

[mick2007]

OK Kiddies..

Drum Roll...

There his!....Joseph Wingrave's..

Pour yourself a large one Cybertect..you were right in the early part of this thread.

If you goto the Coventry Library website and type in 'Wingrave' in the bottom search. There are about half that on this thread there.

http://www.picturesofcoventry.co.uk/search.php

To be honest, I absolutely godsmacked..

What's more, I still possibly think that the photograph of the old guy in his workshop is him. I know it's not his natural environment..

 

[miss minnie]

So the library has prints but you have the original negatives?

 

[mick2007]

It would appear so!....but only a few of them.

 

[miss minnie]

Searching on 'Wingrave' certainly returns a lot of results although none of them have an attribution so how do you know that Wingrave was definitely the photographer?

If you select "W" and then "Wingrave's" from the drop-down list you get only one result. "Wingrave's shop on the corner of High Street and Pepper Lane." Presumably that is Wingrave himself standing in the doorway.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

OK Kiddies..

Drum Roll...

There his!....Joseph Wingrave's..

Pour yourself a large one Cybertect..you were right in the early part of this thread.

If you goto the Coventry Library website and type in 'Wingrave' in the bottom search. There are about half that on this thread there.

http://www.picturesofcoventry.co.uk/search.php

To be honest, I absolutely godsmacked..

What's more, I still possibly think that the photograph of the old guy in his workshop is him. I know it's not his natural environment..

I posted up the list of Coventry photographers in the first place

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Searching on 'Wingrave' certainly returns a lot of results although none of them have an attribution so how do you know that Wingrave was definitely the photographer?

Not sure if I posted this earlier in the thread but Wingrave was apparently the only photographer in Coventry who took pictures outside of his studio

 

[miss minnie]

Not sure if I posted this earlier in the thread but Wingrave was apparently the only photographer in Coventry who took pictures outside of his studio

So there is no point attributing the creator, the library just assumes that all photos are by Wingrave? Seems a bit slack.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

So there is no point attributing the creator, the library just assumes that all photos are by Wingrave? Seems a bit slack.

Yeah, could have been one of those travelling photographers with all that kit on a wagon as mentioned earlier in the thread by you or cybertect (can't remember who posted that picture... sorry!)

 

[Midland Red]

I can't seem to find a thing on this one, so be my guest..

This is the old Charterhouse, Coventry - the best image I can quickly find is at http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/ne...easure-its-historic-buildings-92746-28000593/
the 3rd photo on the first page of images

 

[mick2007]

Nothing is ever simple isn't it?!..

I was of the understanding that if I went to a established reference library and typed something in, the results would be factual. I think there are about 130 photographs listed there under 'Wingrave' and being that he was the just about the only photographer taking photographs around Coventry for about 20 years..that number would seem about right, I would of thought.

Yeah, I had tried the pull down menu and only got the odd result before. So it was a surprise, but a pleasant one to see all those listed.

Today the library got in touch about the email I sent the other day, just about the photograph of the 'Three Tuns Commercial Inn'. Though they don't know who took it..I presumed like most photographs from this period they would of been on a 'carte de visite' with the photographers name on the back and possibly the front..so very easy to identify. The quality on the library website certainly suggest they were taken from that.

The library also said that Joseph Wingrave's son donated his negatives to the local library back in 1935..

The reason I now presume that so many photographs are listed under him in the library is because a lot of those were donated to Coventry Library back in 1960 and for whatever reason, were presumed to Mr. Wingrave's...now they're not sure!

So why it's in the search..I don't know.

So it's a very intriguing one.

As for being a 'mobile' photographer..I would question that because of the age difference in some of the photographs..but who knows.

There is still a lot there to suggest they are Joseph Wingrave's though..but you would of thought they would be in the library?

So either way..I would love to know who took took them.

Midland Red...cheer mate..I looked all over for that and couldn't find I thing. I was beginning to think the place had been demolished years ago..look's like it nearly was recently as well!

 

[cybertect]

You've taken a lot of the photos down, mick?

I was wanting to show my mother-in-law

 

[mick2007]

Sorry about that..

I just thought anybody that was interested would of copied them!

It's just these have turned out to be very rare historic negs and I just didn't want someone sailing in and using the high res for their own ends...not until I've restored them e.t.c.

It's not like I want to make anything from them at all..but other people do..I've had it in the past the odd time.

Give me a bit and I'll put them back up...though minus the high res if you don't mind.

 

[mick2007]

 

[dutchman]

Not directly related to the negatives but I came across this interesting old imgae while searching:

Not the gaol, which was a short distance away, but the public market place:

The cell in the background was only a temporary lockup.

 

[creteskyblue]

Turks Head,SilverStreet Coventry.

Hi everybody,

I am trying to find any information concerning the Turks Head at present it is called the Dipolmat & is right at the beginning of Silver Street but my info is that its address was No 29 which would leadme to think that originally it was further along the Street probably some where near the old Matterson's car park.

I am really interested around about 1870 when my Gr Gr Grandfather was the Landlord.


Many Thanks.

 

[Mrs Magpie]

Minnie_the_Minx is a fact fossicker par excellence. If there's anything to be found out, despite the fact that she's in South London, she'll find it.

 

[dutchman]

A lot of late Victorian slum clearance occurred in Coventry according to mrs c. Which would fit with the age of the houses in the present view.

Many of the ancient houses in that particular view survived until the late 1960s, albeit converted to business premises.

She also says it's pronounced "Bars", not "Ba-rass"

Mrs C. is absolutely correct, it is even spelt "Barr's Lane" on old maps. There are conflicting theories as to why. Some say it had to do with the nearby Spon Street cattle bars, others that it leads to Barr's Hill.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Minnie_the_Minx is a fact fossicker par excellence. If there's anything to be found out, despite the fact that she's in South London, she'll find it.

Don't say that!

I'm struggling. I've found a picture of the Diplomat Public House on Google maps and I know who his grandfather was, but I don't have much time to look today between shopping and gardening, so giving this a bump. Need to have more of a look at the surrounding streets to see if it's in the background of some photos listed under other streets

(There is a tudor style building on the opposite corner and there's pictures of that, but probably taken from an angle where The Turks head is behind/or to the side or taken from a totally different street, but I've not looked yet, but just in case anyone else wants to).

The sun is out, I have no intention of searching for photos yet!

There is a quite distinctive building on the corner of the street though which might help.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I'm going out. You need Cybertect, Miss Minnie, Paul Russell and everyone else on this thread to have a look!

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I expected someone to have found pics by the time I got back to save me looking, but nothing!

 

[cybertect]

I only just saw this and I should be going to bed.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I only just saw this and I should be going to bed.

Nah, you might as well have a look and see what you can find. It's Saturday tomorrow