Oil prices crash

[Proper Tidy]

So what should I do with the 3 thousand jerry cans I've just bought off ebay?

Stock up on water. Next big thing

 

[two sheds]

You don't need to store it Proper Tidy . Buying it is essentially a loan to KSA or whoever produces it - the barrels live their normal life, from extraction to refining and so on. No need for the investor to ever see or touch them. Then once prices inevitably go back up you sell - effectively calling in your loan at the interest rate which is tied to oil price and bingo. Petro dollars. I'm sure there are thousands of palms (no palm oil pun intended) rubbing together at the idea of buying in now at $20/barrel and it going back up to 60-70 by the end of the year. Fairly easy way to potentially triple your money. 'Cos as fast as demand has died down, it can and probably will pick up again. Oil may be fucked in the long term, but in the short term it's still the fuel almost every motorized transport relies on. So this is a temporary blip.

If there's less demand but still large supply why don't they need to store it? Perhaps not the crude oil but the petrol or diesel once they've produced that, and surely that will start backing up? And if there's no need to store it (with no capacity) I don't understand why prices have gone negative.

 

[gosub]

If there's less demand but still large supply why don't they need to store it? Perhaps not the crude oil but the petrol or diesel once they've produced that, and surely that will start backing up? And if there's no need to store it (with no capacity) I don't understand why prices have gone negative.

Negative $40 oil reflects panic - and U.S. crude market economic reality Coz if you are still playing hot potato tomorrow you do have take delivery

 

[two sheds]

Ta - but that's again saying there's no storage, or at least we're coming up to where the point there's no storage for crude. Earlier was said that you can't just shut oil fields down, but can they shut refineries down when petrol/diesel storage capacity is reached?

 

[yield]

Ta - but that's again saying there's no storage, or at least we're coming up to where the point there's no storage for crude. Earlier was said that you can't just shut oil fields down, but can they shut refineries down when petrol/diesel storage capacity is reached?

Yeah they'lll be mothballing refineries as we speak. Oil price tracks global expansion though so we know now for sure that it's crunch time.

Shale is uneconomical at this price. Loads of petrochemical countries are in a bind. Saudi, Russia, Venezuala...

 

[ffsear]

I don't understand why prices have gone negative.

Speculators dumping their May futures contracts. Its either that or take physical delivery of the oil.

 

[yield]

Speculators dumping their May futures contracts. Its either that or take physical delivery of the oil.

Yeah think of it as offset storage.

Still crazy though.

 

[ffsear]

Seriously though, which economies will this fuck? Venezuela already fucked, iran too but it can get worse. KSA has been trying to be less oil reliant I think but dunno how successful that's been. UAE can't be in good shape with no tourists + this.

 

[not-bono-ever]

The US has a strategic oil reserve capacity- trump has been banging on about maxxing this for a while now- the tanks are full. Plenty of mothballed supertakners will be sitting around as floating storage dumps for a while yet

 

[Proper Tidy]

Why has the title been edited? I dunno why titles have to be fiddled with and threads merged all the time. The title was oil, fairly self explanatory really.

 

[Idaho]

View attachment 207987

That's weird. I always thought that Saudi production was the cheapest by far. Which is why us production boomed during Obama when prices were high, and have now ground to a halt. I must have misunderstood something.

 

[JimW]

That's weird. I always thought that Saudi production was the cheapest by far. Which is why us production boomed during Obama when prices were high, and have now ground to a halt. I must have misunderstood something.

Makes you wonder if that's the cost of getting it to US markets factoring in distance/transport rather than some global figure.

 

[mauvais]

That's weird. I always thought that Saudi production was the cheapest by far. Which is why us production boomed during Obama when prices were high, and have now ground to a halt. I must have misunderstood something.

I don't understand this either. From a quick look it seems like it might be 'fiscal breakeven', rather than producer breakeven, whatever that means.

 

[Tankus]

Good job trump filled the national reserves at $30 per barrel....

 

[davesgcr]

So what should I do with the 3 thousand jerry cans I've just bought off ebay?

In the early days of WW2 - and before rationing kicked in - a few householders stored petrol in domestic baths. You can presume it did not end well for some.

 

[quimcunx]

In the early days of WW2 - and before rationing kicked in - a few householders stored petrol in domestic baths. You can presume it did not end well for some.

Thanks for the tip but our shower is over the bath so no good for us.

 

[keybored]

Don't fall for this "negative" price fake news. I just filled up and when I then walked into the kiosk and demanded £70 the cashier threatened to call the police on me

 

[ffsear]

I don't understand this either. From a quick look it seems like it might be 'fiscal breakeven', rather than producer breakeven, whatever that means.

Yes sorry, its fiscal

 

[two sheds]

Why has the title been edited? I dunno why titles have to be fiddled with and threads merged all the time. The title was oil, fairly self explanatory really.

Well I was hoping for a discussion of the relative benefits of different cooking oils. I've started using rapeseed oil rather than sunflower oil for example because it doesn't break down at high temperatures. Coconut oil though is that good too? And of course lard seems to be making a comeback among the health conscious among us

Now though I come to the thread hoping to see a crash in the price of vegetable oils

 

[Proper Tidy]

Well I was hoping for a discussion of the relative benefits of different cooking oils. I've started using rapeseed oil rather than sunflower oil for example because it doesn't break down at high temperatures. Coconut oil though is that good too? And of course lard seems to be making a comeback among the health conscious among us

Now though I come to the thread hoping to see a crash in the price of vegetable oils

Apparently coconut oil is really bad if that helps

 

[planetgeli]

Coronavirus: Oil plunges for a second day on gloomy outlook

Plunging demand, oversupply and dwindling storage space trigger another global oil selloff.

www.bbc.co.uk

Fairly decent explanatory in layman's terms about what happened last night and why (storage), why filling your car today isn't suddenly going to be massively cheaper than yesterday, and a heads up warning that trouble lays ahead.

 

[not-bono-ever]

1 chinese bank behind this price drop. speculators stiffed. no hedges. heads will roll in the PRC for this

 

[Chilli.s]

I recon it'll lead to price increases at the pumps.

 

[Pickman's model]

Coronavirus: Oil plunges for a second day on gloomy outlook

Plunging demand, oversupply and dwindling storage space trigger another global oil selloff.

www.bbc.co.uk

Fairly decent explanatory in layman's terms about what happened last night and why (storage), why filling your car today isn't suddenly going to be massively cheaper than yesterday, and a heads up warning that trouble lays ahead.

it'll all end in tears, mark my words

 

[yield]

When oil became waste: a week of turmoil for crude, and more pain to come
April 26, 2020

(Reuters) - The magnitude of how damaged the energy industry is came into full view on April 20 when the benchmark price of U.S. oil futures, which had never dropped below $10 a barrel in its nearly 40-year history, plunged to a previously unthinkable minus $38 a barrel.

In just a few months, the coronavirus pandemic has destroyed so much fuel demand as billions of people curtail travel that it has done what financial crashes, recessions and wars had failed to ever do - leave the United States with so much oil there was nowhere to put it.

While the unusual circumstance of negative oil prices may not be repeated, many in the industry say it is a harbinger for more bleak days ahead, and that years of overinvestment will not correct in a period of weeks or even months.

“What happened in the futures contract the other day indicated things are starting to get bad earlier than expected,” said Frederick Lawrence, vice president of economics and international affairs at the Independent Petroleum Association of America.

“People are getting notices from pipeline companies that say they can’t take their crude anymore. That means you’re shutting down the well yesterday.”

Evidence of the erosion of value for a product that has been a mainstay of global society since the late 19th century abounded across the world last week.

In Russia, one of the world’s top producers, the industry is considering resorting to burning its oil to take it off the market, sources told Reuters.

 

[two sheds]

Yes I wondered whether they'd start just dumping it somewhere as it's produced

 

[NoXion]

Hopefully this means that fracking will die the miserable fucking death that it absolutely deserves.

 

[yield]

Hopefully this means that fracking will die the miserable fucking death that it absolutely deserves.

U.S. banks prepare to seize energy assets as shale boom goes bust
April 9, 2020

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Major U.S. lenders are preparing to become operators of oil and gas fields across the country for the first time in a generation to avoid losses on loans to energy companies that may go bankrupt, sources aware of the plans told Reuters.

JPMorgan Chase & Co, Wells Fargo & Co, Bank of America Corp and Citigroup Inc are each in the process of setting up independent companies to own oil and gas assets, said three people who were not authorized to discuss the matter publicly. The banks are also looking to hire executives with relevant expertise to manage them, the sources said.

The banks did not provide comment in time for publication.

Energy companies are suffering through a plunge in oil prices caused by the coronavirus pandemic and a supply glut, with crude prices down more than 60% this year.

Although oil prices may gain support from a potential agreement Thursday between Saudi Arabia and Russia to cut production, few believe the curtailment can offset a 30% drop in global fuel demand, as the coronavirus has grounded aircraft, reduced vehicle use and curbed economic activity more broadly.

Oil and gas companies working in shale basins from Texas to Wyoming are saddled with debt.

The industry is estimated to owe more than $200 billion to lenders through loans backed by oil and gas reserves. As revenue has plummeted and assets have declined in value, some companies are saying they may be unable to repay.

 

[Idaho]

1 chinese bank behind this price drop. speculators stiffed. no hedges. heads will roll in the PRC for this

It's pretty hilarious when futures speculators run too close to the close date and then actually have to deal with the real world.

 

[yield]

Bank of China Clients Said to Lose $1 Billion on Oil Bets
Bloomberg, 26 April 2020
Over 60,000 customers invested in WTI-linked product: Caixin

Bank of China Ltd.’s estimate for the carnage to retail investors from the collapse in a product linked to U.S. crude oil futures surged 11-fold to more than 7 billion yuan ($1 billion) as it consolidated reports from its nationwide network, according to people familiar with the matter.

The estimate of losses to customers across China increased from about 600 million yuan in the middle of last week as more information was gathered from its more than 10,000 outlets, said the people, asking not to be identified discussing a private matter. The number isn’t final and subject to further change as more branch data are examined, one of the people said.