New Study says e-cigarettes may lead to cancer and heart disease

[littlebabyjesus]

It can actually be quite unpleasant getting a facefull of fuck knows what, even outdoors, and it often has a strong smell. Studies have shown nicotine present in the bodies of second hand vapers but it's not necessarily a question of whether it's really harmful or not, IMO it can just come down to not wanting that shit in my face or lungs. Flatus isn't harmful to the health in moderation but you can understand me not wanting you to fart in my face right?

That's about being considerate, though, no? The one I use doesn't have a strong smell, and I don't blow it in other people's faces. As long as I don't blow it in people's faces, even a person sitting next to me does not notice it - I know because I've asked. The increasing banning of vaping from places seems like an overreaction to me.

I don't like the smell or sound of people chewing gum. Doesn't mean I want it banned.

 

[Pickman's model]

That's about being considerate, though, no? The one I use doesn't have a strong smell, and I don't blow it in other people's faces. As long as I don't blow it in people's faces, even a person sitting next to me does not notice it - I know because I've asked. The increasing banning of vaping from places seems like an overreaction to me.

not sure bans are *increasing*, as it's banned pretty much everywhere your actual smoking's banned.

 

[xenon]

PHE still want e-cigs to be available on prescription.

E-cigarettes 'should be on prescription'

Disagree with this. If people are buying fags, they can buy an ecig themselves. Other forms of nicateen sussation, tablets, fine but using NHS funds for ecigs, would be a stupid waste of money.

 

[maomao]

That's about being considerate, though, no? The one I use doesn't have a strong smell, and I don't blow it in other people's faces. As long as I don't blow it in people's faces, even a person sitting next to me does not notice it - I know because I've asked. The increasing banning of vaping from places seems like an overreaction to me.

I don't like the smell or sound of people chewing gum. Doesn't mean I want it banned.

You must be among the most considerate vapers then. As with anuthing it's the most visible and obnoxious behaviour that people are judging vapers by and that the rule makers are responding to. And given that you have no way of making them abide by your high standards of behaviour I don't think there's any alternative to that.

 

[elbows]

Based on the state of my windows, I dont buy the idea that there is no such thing as passive e-cig exposure, or at least the idea that this stuff can be dismissed without study is wrong.

 

[xenon]

I'm going to switch to zero nicateen shortly. Only reason I've not done so yet, is I keep buying liquid from a local shop. They don't have the flavour I like in zero.

I'd be surprised if there were no deleterious effects to vaping, even sans nicateen.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

There is passive vaping in the same way that there is passive coffee drinking. There will be molecules of caffeine in the fumes you smell from fresh coffee. There isn't much research, but Public Health England puts the likely risk at 'extremely low'. And even then, you need to look at the conditions they tested - enclosed spaces vary widely.

 

[8ball]

I'll get round to worrying about passive vaping once all the cars are gone and all the energy comes from renewables.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I'll get round to worrying about passive vaping once all the cars are gone and all the energy comes from renewables.

Yep, there is that. Dodging into a bar where people are vaping is very likely to be much less bad for you than staying out on the busy street next to the cars.

 

[editor]

I'll get round to worrying about passive vaping once all the cars are gone and all the energy comes from renewables.

Some of those vape smokes stink though. Sweet sickly pongs. It must be like inhaling a bag of Woolies pick'n'mix.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Some of those vape smokes stink though. Sweet sickly pongs. It must be like inhaling a bag of Woolies pick'n'mix.

Some of the flavoured ones do have a strong smell. I wish people didn't use them - gives the rest of us a bad name.

 

[xenon]

Yeah, the fruit and tobacco ones are rank. It's boring old mint for me. But it gives you a nice throat hit.

I mostly just vape in the pub, which is allowed in most places. Wouldn't vape at a dinner table though.

 

[scifisam]

not sure bans are *increasing*, as it's banned pretty much everywhere your actual smoking's banned.

When they first came out they weren't included in any bans though.

 

[Pickman's model]

When they first came out they weren't included in any bans though.

yeh. but now they are.

 

[scifisam]

yeh. but now they are.

Yes, after a gradual increase.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

not sure bans are *increasing*, as it's banned pretty much everywhere your actual smoking's banned.

No it's not. There are still pubs, restaurants, venues that allow it. I was at a gig the other week where the bouncer told me to stop vaping, then came back five minutes later to tell me that it was ok, carry on. A hotel I was at a few days ago allowed it in rooms but not communal areas. I can vape at work. Each place makes its own rules for vaping as there is no law against it currently.

I've been vaping for five years, and in that time, the number of places that don't allow it has gradually increased, and it continues to gradually increase.

 

[Pickman's model]

No it's not. There are still pubs, restaurants, venues that allow it. I was at a gig the other week where the bouncer told me to stop vaping, then came back five minutes later to tell me that it was ok, carry on. A hotel I was at a few days ago allowed it in rooms but not communal areas. I can vape at work. Each place makes its own rules for vaping as there is no law against it currently.

I've been vaping for five years, and in that time, the number of places that don't allow it has gradually increased, and it continues to gradually increase.

and rightly so. i don't want to smell your vanilla or butterscotch or whatever godforsaken chemicals you insist on filling your lungs with.

 

[8ball]

Some of those vape smokes stink though. Sweet sickly pongs. It must be like inhaling a bag of Woolies pick'n'mix.

I often smell far worse things when out and about tbf. They’re quite strong partly because a lot of people get insensitivity to the taste quite quickly.

 

[elbows]

Labour in Wales planned a ban in public places where children could be present, but they fucked it up by insulting Plaid Cymru. (in 2016)

'Cheap date' remark stubs out proposed Welsh vaping ban

 

[8ball]

 

[NoXion]

Disagree with this. If people are buying fags, they can buy an ecig themselves. Other forms of nicateen sussation, tablets, fine but using NHS funds for ecigs, would be a stupid waste of money.

What makes e-cigs different? Apart from the fact that buying them doesn't line the pockets of pharmaceutical companies, that is.

 

[bendeus]

That's about being considerate, though, no? The one I use doesn't have a strong smell, and I don't blow it in other people's faces. As long as I don't blow it in people's faces, even a person sitting next to me does not notice it - I know because I've asked. The increasing banning of vaping from places seems like an overreaction to me.

I don't like the smell or sound of people chewing gum. Doesn't mean I want it banned.

This is identical to my approach. Inhale, hold it in the lungs for a few seconds and what comes out is pretty much indistinguishable from normal breath.

I have a mate on the other hand who seems to revel in shrouding himself in vast, Gandalf-like clouds of rhubarb and custard flavoured exhalations. It's a fucking liberty and I hate being on the receiving end of it even as a vaper. Can totally understand why yer average punter would react to it and in turn why such behaviours are driving increasing bans.

 

[elbows]

There are various reasons why individual establishments ban vaping. But when it comes to calls for wider legislation to ban public vaping, its less about the behaviour of obnoxious vapers and more about things like trying to stop certain behaviour seeming normal. A big part of the smoking ban was about denormalising smoking, and, combined with a preceding drop in the percentage of smokers in the population, I think it worked. The attempted public vaping ban in Wales was sponsored by the combination of fears about people who had never smoking taking up vaping, and the desire not to make vaping seem normal, acceptable, something to copy. I think this was understandable but deeply misguided, especially combined with the usual 'we know best' and somewhat puritanical attitudes from some concerned with the public health.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

There are various reasons why individual establishments ban vaping. But when it comes to calls for wider legislation to ban public vaping, its less about the behaviour of obnoxious vapers and more about things like trying to stop certain behaviour seeming normal. A big part of the smoking ban was about denormalising smoking, and, combined with a preceding drop in the percentage of smokers in the population, I think it worked. The attempted public vaping ban in Wales was sponsored by the combination of fears about people who had never smoking taking up vaping, and the desire not to make vaping seem normal, acceptable, something to copy. I think this was understandable but deeply misguided, especially combined with the usual 'we know best' and somewhat puritanical attitudes from some concerned with the public health.

That's classic mission-creep. The smoking ban was brought in specifically as a public health measure due to evidence of the dangers of passive smoking. Nothing to do with denormalising smoking.

 

[Pickman's model]

That's classic mission-creep. The smoking ban was brought in specifically as a public health measure due to evidence of the dangers of passive smoking. Nothing to do with denormalising smoking.

yeh right nothing at all to do with denormalising smoking. strangely there is probably more smoking in tv programmes today than there was before the ban

 

[elbows]

That's classic mission-creep. The smoking ban was brought in specifically as a public health measure due to evidence of the dangers of passive smoking. Nothing to do with denormalising smoking.

The primary purpose was in regards people being exposed to smoke. But the other stuff like denormalisation has always been there. It's more overt these days, as further bans such as bans in parks get discussed, and as action has been taken on other fronts such as cigarette packaging. However I do understand that the topic is somewhat sensitive and we are perhaps still more likely to see anti-ban people and press articles and the tobacco industry moaning about denormalising smoking than institutions admitting this is part of the plan in their papers.

 

[elbows]

yeh right nothing at all to do with denormalising smoking. strangely there is probably more smoking in tv programmes today than there was before the ban

I dont watch enough modern tv to comment on that. I thought I had found an interesting article about it but it just dribbled on without reaching any exciting conclusions. I will post it anyway.

The smoking ban 10 years on: what’s changed on page and screen?

 

[elbows]

Many e-cigs on tv?

 

[littlebabyjesus]

The primary purpose was in regards people being exposed to smoke. But the other stuff like denormalisation has always been there. .

I don't think that's really true. These considerations have increasingly emerged after the ban was introduced. The original justification for the ban didn't mention anything other than protecting others from exposure to second-hand smoke.

 

[Pickman's model]

I don't think that's really true. These considerations have increasingly emerged after the ban was introduced. The original justification for the ban didn't mention anything other than protecting others from exposure to second-hand smoke.

yeh. and obvs what was said then must be the only reason, there's no conceivable reason for a purpose of the ban to a) remove smokers from interior public spaces and b) reduce the number of people smoking.