Miners' strike 1984-85 40th anniversary general stuff

[Kate Sharpley]

Having started a thread British class struggle anarchists in the Miners' Strike 1984-1985 to ask for info/ reflections on anarchist involvement in the strike, inevitably you come across stuff that's interesting.
EG
radio arthur
Radio Arthur – Nottingham

This station used to broadcast over the top of Nottingham’s ILR station, Radio Trent, encouraging people to support the miners who were on strike at the time. There were calls to save the nation’s minefields and to join the strike. They were therefore dubbed “Radio Arthur” by the national press.

The first broadcast was in July of 1984 and was slotted in quite skilfully. There was the normal build up to the news at the top of the hour, and then just after the news jingle, “Radio Arthur” would switch on. To the unsuspecting Radio Trent listener, it would sound like they were broadcasting biased news. Many people complained, even those who realised Trent were not responsible, but still wanted to know why it was not stopped. All Trent could do was to reassure listeners and complain to the DTI.

 

[hitmouse]

One of my favourite anecdotes from the strike is that there was a roadside cafe that was quite busy during the strike and used to give free breakfasts to pickets, and would subsidise this charitable activity by overcharging the coppers who came in. Which sounds like an unverifiable urban myth, but it turns up in quite a detailed (and lovely) article, was apparently Rose's cafe in Retford according to this article from the OTJC publication At The Coal Face:

 

[hitmouse]

New film coming out:

Strike: An Uncivil War | In Cinemas now - Tull Stories

Filmmaker Daniel Gordon follows his double BAFTA-winning, EMMY-nominated and critically acclaimed documentary HILLSBOROUGH with a searing new feature documentary.

tullstories.co.uk

 

[Elpenor]

New film coming out:

Strike: An Uncivil War | In Cinemas now - Tull Stories

Filmmaker Daniel Gordon follows his double BAFTA-winning, EMMY-nominated and critically acclaimed documentary HILLSBOROUGH with a searing new feature documentary.

tullstories.co.uk

Saw the trailer for this tonight. I am not likely to be able to get to see it but suffice to say you’ll feel very angry should you watch the film if my reaction to the trailer is anything to go by.

 

[two sheds]

She was right in her quote at the end though: "The violence and intimidation we have seen should never have happened, it is the work of extremists, it is the enemy within" only in this case she was talking about herself and the police who carried it out.

,

 

[porp]

New film coming out:

Strike: An Uncivil War | In Cinemas now - Tull Stories

Filmmaker Daniel Gordon follows his double BAFTA-winning, EMMY-nominated and critically acclaimed documentary HILLSBOROUGH with a searing new feature documentary.

tullstories.co.uk

Thanks, but this falls into the too painful to think about category. There are some things that make the feeling of powerlessness almost too much.

I would genuinely like to know what people think would have been different, had there been a strike vote. Knowing what we know about the utter ... Single mindedness of those ranged against the miners, do people think some sort of 'fair play" would have ensued?

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I would genuinely like to know what people think would have been different, had there been a strike vote. Knowing what we know about the utter ... Single mindedness of those ranged against the miners, do people think some sort of 'fair play" would have ensued?

from the perspective that i was 14/15 at the time, in south london so not really in close touch with it, and while i had formed leftish views by then, i'd done so pretty much independently of family etc so wasn't all that well informed, but -

it did seem at the time that the main line of attack from the government and their friends in the media was that there hadn't been a strike ballot and that's what made it 'wrong' or 'worse', and i expect this did sway some public opinion, although there were a lot of other anti union messages during the 80s.

from the perspective of now, i'm aware opinion is divided about what the outcome of a national ballot would have been - some areas may have not been under threat at the time. some of the miners who carried on working argued they were doing this because there hadn't been a ballot - would they have done the same if there had been a strike mandate or would they have stayed loyal to the union? in which case would there have been so much trouble (which the tories and media blamed solely on the strikers not the police) on picket lines?

and also, again from the perspective of now, i am fairly sure the tories and their friends in the media would have found another line of attack if it had been an official strike, and neil kinnock would probably still have been soggy about expressing any support...

 

[nogojones]

Thanks, but this falls into the too painful to think about category. There are some things that make the feeling of powerlessness almost too much.

I would genuinely like to know what people think would have been different, had there been a strike vote. Knowing what we know about the utter ... Single mindedness of those ranged against the miners, do people think some sort of 'fair play" would have ensued?

No. A vote would have made no difference. The NUM would have voted to go out, but wasted time and resources doing so and the state would have still gone for them with their full might.

 

[marty21]

from the perspective that i was 14/15 at the time, in south london so not really in close touch with it, and while i had formed leftish views by then, i'd done so pretty much independently of family etc so wasn't all that well informed, but -

it did seem at the time that the main line of attack from the government and their friends in the media was that there hadn't been a strike ballot and that's what made it 'wrong' or 'worse', and i expect this did sway some public opinion, although there were a lot of other anti union messages during the 80s.

from the perspective of now, i'm aware opinion is divided about what the outcome of a national ballot would have been - some areas may have not been under threat at the time. some of the miners who carried on working argued they were doing this because there hadn't been a ballot - would they have done the same if there had been a strike mandate or would they have stayed loyal to the union? in which case would there have been so much trouble (which the tories and media blamed solely on the strikers not the police) on picket lines?

and also, again from the perspective of now, i am fairly sure the tories and their friends in the media would have found another line of attack if it had been an official strike, and neil kinnock would probably still have been soggy about expressing any support...

I was 19, living in Swansea (at the Uni) and there was huge support for the miners there , I shook a bucket on many mornings at the Quadrant (City centre shopping centre) , collecting money for the miners and the Student Union was fully behind the strike. I remember at the time, the other Miner's union (the Nottingham one) kicking off about the strike and demanding another ballot and the feeling at the time was that it wasn't necessary, my feelings haven't changed in the 40 years since.

 

[planetgeli]

from the perspective of now, i'm aware opinion is divided about what the outcome of a national ballot would have been - some areas may have not been under threat at the time. some of the miners who carried on working argued they were doing this because there hadn't been a ballot - would they have done the same if there had been a strike mandate or would they have stayed loyal to the union? in which case would there have been so much trouble (which the tories and media blamed solely on the strikers not the police) on picket lines?

1) Many areas were not 'under threat' openly at the time but Scargill & co knew what was going on and said what was going on. Miners were under no illusions, or didn't need to be.

2) Those carrying on working - some would still have done and a few might not. It would have made little difference to the strike. Thatcher wasn't after democratic legitimacy. She was out to crush trade unions.

3) Picket line violence was orchestrated by the government bussing thousands of coppers all over the country. Orgreave, never forget.

 

[porp]

from the perspective that i was 14/15 at the time, in south london so not really in close touch with it, and while i had formed leftish views by then, i'd done so pretty much independently of family etc so wasn't all that well informed, but -

it did seem at the time that the main line of attack from the government and their friends in the media was that there hadn't been a strike ballot and that's what made it 'wrong' or 'worse', and i expect this did sway some public opinion, although there were a lot of other anti union messages during the 80s.

from the perspective of now, i'm aware opinion is divided about what the outcome of a national ballot would have been - some areas may have not been under threat at the time. some of the miners who carried on working argued they were doing this because there hadn't been a ballot - would they have done the same if there had been a strike mandate or would they have stayed loyal to the union? in which case would there have been so much trouble (which the tories and media blamed solely on the strikers not the police) on picket lines?

and also, again from the perspective of now, i am fairly sure the tories and their friends in the media would have found another line of attack if it had been an official strike, and neil kinnock would probably still have been soggy about expressing any support...

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. I was young at the time of the strike. Miners from the Kent colliery collected in our high street. I didn't even know there was coal in Kent .

It's really difficult to judge from where we are, but my instinct is that a majority vote in favour but minority in, say , Notts, would have provided just more reasons to delegitimise the very idea of collective action.

It makes you wonder, in relation to other situations, how often the widely repeated "sensible" reason to favour oppression, will turn out to be something confected

 

[Kate Sharpley]

"And all of these villages that are worst hit in Fife all had mining communities. There were jobs when you walked out of school back then. You walked out of school and you went right into a job. You walk out of school nowadays and you walk to the Job Centre."
Marissa Campbell interviewed by Robert Gildea for new collection of oral histories Backbone of the Nation

 

[Kate Sharpley]

Askern pickets were chased into a wood by cops with dogs. 3 pickets climbed a tree. The cops told them to get down. The pickets refused, replying: "Piss off we are having a branch meeting!"
From Miners Update in Black Flag https://files.libcom.org/files/bf7-122-1984.pdf

 

[Wilf]

I was at the Gala today and there was a decent turnout even thought it was pissing down throughout. Not surprisingly, the bulk of the big meeting was about the 84/5 strike, from miners and women organisers. I always feel a bit ambiguous nowadays at the focus on the strike when left groups are doing things like planning public meetings. Naturally, it was the most important postwar strike, went way beyond male labourism and was also a key turning point in the victory of the right. It was also, by far, the thing I spent the most time on, organising and collecting, in my life (tear in my eye at a few points). My ambiguity is just about whether it's always the best way of bringing people in, 40 years on. Anyway, if there's ever a time and place to celebrate the miners and communities in struggle, it's the Gala 40 years on.

Edit: to avoid ambiguity, I'm not saying 'move on' from the strike, far from it. It's just I've been involved in a few groups that have been seeking to establish themselves and think that a meeting on the strike is a way to bring the punters in. Ironically, 40 years on, we're probably reaching a point where we do need those meeting to re-establish a memory of the strike.

 

[newbie]

Thanks, but this falls into the too painful to think about category. There are some things that make the feeling of powerlessness almost too much.

I would genuinely like to know what people think would have been different, had there been a strike vote. Knowing what we know about the utter ... Single mindedness of those ranged against the miners, do people think some sort of 'fair play" would have ensued?

I went to a special conference of my union, and was part of the minority that voted for a general strike. We weren't heavy industry, and weren't part of the Triple Alliance- coal, rail, & transport, including the docks, so we didn't really matter too much, but they did. That's what could have been decisive, as it was in the 3 day week period a decade earlier when we didn't really need to shake buckets in London because those workers and their picket lines held fast.

Not holding a ballot muddied the question sufficiently that members of other unions could and did argue against basic solidarity and respecting picket lines. No-one can say a ballot would have been won or that it would have made a difference, but not holding one was a strategy that didn't work.

 

[brogdale]

It was also, by far, the thing I spent the most time on, organising and collecting, in my life (tear in my eye at a few points). My ambiguity is just about whether it's always the best way of bringing people in, 40 years on. Anyway, if there's ever a time and place to celebrate the miners and communities in struggle, it's the Gala 40 years on.

Just reading that brought a tear to mine too; 40 years ago but the energy, impetus and downright visceral struggle for the soul of our class still makes me emotional.

 

[Wilf]

Just reading that brought a tear to mine too; 40 years ago but the energy, impetus and downright visceral struggle for the soul of our class still makes me emotional.

Aye, very much so.

 

[Richard46]

Just reading that brought a tear to mine too; 40 years ago but the energy, impetus and downright visceral struggle for the soul of our class still makes me emotional.

Same here. My Union branch (Newham NALGO) was heavily involved in supporting the strikers in one particular Nottingham colliery. In Nottingham, of course, the Union of Democratic Miners did not support the strike so the strikers got no strike pay or benefits. We payed a % of our salaries as well as the usual bucket shaking etc in order to support the strikers. Strikers stayed with us in London, we went and stayed with them in Nottingham. We got very close. What still gets me is that at the end when they knew it was hopeless I am pretty sure our friends stayed out for a time because they thought they would be letting us down. I still choke when I remember that.

 

[Kate Sharpley]

Ironically, 40 years on, we're probably reaching a point where we do need those meeting to re-establish a memory of the strike.

One thing I recall reading was Dave Douglass talking about going into a local school and telling the kids "I got paid more than your headmaster". Which of course is not part of the narrative the ruling class wants to push, now it's all 'we offshored our carbon emissions, aren't we fucking clever".
Speaking of narratives, I look at some of the "we've earned these mines a hundred times over" graphics from the time and think that they worked well enough on anarchists who had some sense of class (and working class history). Doubt they did much for the "liberal intelligentsia" element though.

 

[porp]

I went to a special conference of my union, and was part of the minority that voted for a general strike. We weren't heavy industry, and weren't part of the Triple Alliance- coal, rail, & transport, including the docks, so we didn't really matter too much, but they did. That's what could have been decisive, as it was in the 3 day week period a decade earlier when we didn't really need to shake buckets in London because those workers and their picket lines held fast.

Not holding a ballot muddied the question sufficiently that members of other unions could and did argue against basic solidarity and respecting picket lines. No-one can say a ballot would have been won or that it would have made a difference, but not holding one was a strategy that didn't work.

Thank you, the question of the ballot or no ballot as an excuse or reason for not exercising solidarity, is a really valuable insight.

 

[newbie]

Thank you, the question of the ballot or no ballot as an excuse or reason for not exercising solidarity, is a really valuable insight.

What started as bottom up wildcats became (or perhaps became seen as) top down instructions from the NUM center, and from memory it wasn't only the rightwing press and some Nottinghamshire miners who resented that. The refusal to call a ballot was very divisive as it chimed with the longrunning 'Union barons' attacks that had helped Thacher win in 1979 and was already causing union membership to decline.

 

[hitmouse]

I was at the Gala today and there was a decent turnout even thought it was pissing down throughout. Not surprisingly, the bulk of the big meeting was about the 84/5 strike, from miners and women organisers. I always feel a bit ambiguous nowadays at the focus on the strike when left groups are doing things like planning public meetings. Naturally, it was the most important postwar strike, went way beyond male labourism and was also a key turning point in the victory of the right. It was also, by far, the thing I spent the most time on, organising and collecting, in my life (tear in my eye at a few points). My ambiguity is just about whether it's always the best way of bringing people in, 40 years on. Anyway, if there's ever a time and place to celebrate the miners and communities in struggle, it's the Gala 40 years on.

Edit: to avoid ambiguity, I'm not saying 'move on' from the strike, far from it. It's just I've been involved in a few groups that have been seeking to establish themselves and think that a meeting on the strike is a way to bring the punters in. Ironically, 40 years on, we're probably reaching a point where we do need those meeting to re-establish a memory of the strike.

Ah, would be good to have a pint if we're both there next time. Yeah, bloody awful weather but a great event. Did feel like the turnout was quite heavily skewed towards union paid officials rather than lay members, but that might well just be an indictment of the circles I move in nowadays rather than the actual crowd as a whole.

 

[Wilf]

Ah, would be good to have a pint if we're both there next time. Yeah, bloody awful weather but a great event. Did feel like the turnout was quite heavily skewed towards union paid officials rather than lay members, but that might well just be an indictment of the circles I move in nowadays rather than the actual crowd as a whole.

Definitely.

 

[Smokeandsteam]

That was my take as well hitmouse

It seemed full of bureaucrats. It might have been the weather, or my tired cynicism, but it felt even more performative than ever from them, and the miner’s communities and rank and file felt even more pushed to the periphery than previously. At least the banners and the Cathedral remain.

Some really good and thought provoking points by Wilf

I will reply properly when I have time

 

[Wilf]

Just on the bureaucracy bit, I saw something on Facebook from the former secretary of either the Durham NUM or gala organisers. Can't find it now but it was all about how he hadn't been given a spot on the balcony at the county hotel or the food and drink due to 'former office holders' . All a bit sad no doubt, but seemed quite telling. This isn't a coalfield that has existed for decades, but still demanding the pomp due to officeholders. Performative indeed.

 

[HeAthen]

One thing I recall reading was Dave Douglass talking about going into a local school and telling the kids "I got paid more than your headmaster". Which of course is not part of the narrative the ruling class wants to push, now it's all 'we offshored our carbon emissions, aren't we fucking clever".
Speaking of narratives, I look at some of the "we've earned these mines a hundred times over" graphics from the time and think that they worked well enough on anarchists who had some sense of class (and working class history). Doubt they did much for the "liberal intelligentsia" element though.

Sorry to intrude on the thread as I probably can't add a great deal of stuff being as I was 14 during the strike. We did have pickets staying with us both then and in the 70s strikes. I used to get taken up to the Durham gala as a child and my step-father had quite a few of the Labour and colliery banners going back decades (all donated to the NUM when he passed away).

Anyway, the reason I've posted with your post is purely because Dave Douglass was a good family friend of my wife's family, mainly through my father-in-law who passed away earlier in the year so your post amongst some others jumped out at me with his name being mentioned.

 

[Kate Sharpley]

Not about the strike at all, but:
'Quote of the month
"As long as women are taught to handle the crowbar, we cannot expect them to be expert with their needles."
Member of Victorian Middle Classes, talking about the "unfeminine" pit women in 1840s'.

from Black Seed: Manchester Anarchist News, no. 2 (July 1986)'

 

[Serge Forward]

I'd completely forgot about Black Seed.

 

[zedr]

That was my take as well hitmouse

It seemed full of bureaucrats. It might have been the weather, or my tired cynicism, but it felt even more performative than ever from them, and the miner’s communities and rank and file felt even more pushed to the periphery than previously. At least the banners and the Cathedral remain.

Some really good and thought provoking points by Wilf

I will reply properly when I have time

It was my first time up at the gala this year. Shame about all the rain but had a lovely time meeting pals and mooching about. I also forgot how much I love brass bands. Made me want to pick up a trombone again. I'm not as involved in union activity at the moment so can't comment on the amount of bureaucrats, though I was a but surprised to see the NEU president Daniel Kebede up on the balcony with the other bigwigs. Also enjoyed boring all my pals with all the small left parties/groups trainspotting.

Stayed for some of the speeches and appreciated the talk of cross union solidarity and militancy with reference to the 84/5 strike. That then felt quite disjointed with how union organising has been in the NEU in the local branches I've been part of.

Favorite part of the day was someone with a big IWW banner running across the road in front of cars and heckling everyone else who was waiting patiently for the lights to change for not being anarchist enough.

 

[hitmouse]

A Community Under Occupation

40 years ago this week, an army of riot police laid siege to the pit village of Easington to crush its defiant support for the miners' strike. Four decades on from Thatcher's assault, their community still bears the scars.

tribunemag.co.uk