Lonely post about music thread

[Knotted]

Well I feel this might work. Post a review. Post a musing about a song. Post a theory about music theory. Reminisce about the madchester scene. Recommend your favourite Ravel (but give reasons not videos!!!) Post a semilattice of Captain Beefheart albums from worst at bottom to multiple bests at the top (maybe partial orders are the best way to rank music?).

		Doc at the Radar Station				Trout Mask Replica
		Ice Cream for Crow				Lick My Decals off Baby
Clear Spot		Bat Chain Puller		Safe as Milk		Strictly Personal
Spotlight Kid		Shiny Beast		Legendary A&M Sessions		Mirror Man
			Unconditional Guaranteed
			Blue Jeans and Moonbeams

Just don't post songs you like from the youtube please! Threads and threads for that already.

 

[Steel Icarus]

I don't get how that works ^^^

 

[Puddy_Tat]

* head tilt *

 

[clicker]

Que?

 

[kalidarkone]

Don't get it either Knotted

 

[krtek a houby]

Neil Young's Rust Never Sleeps is rather good, with some interesting lyrics. That kind of thing?

 

[Knotted]

I don't get how that works ^^^

I should have drawn it properly with lines. The table just gives it structure. So Shiny Beast and Spotlight Kid are better than unconditional guaranteed, but I'm not going to judge whether Shiny Beast is better than Spotlight Kid, so they start their own separate rankings. So in a semilattice not everything is superior or inferior to everything else, but any two albums are superior to something - ie. Unconditional Guaranteed and Moonbeams and Blues Jeans are definitely the worst.

 

[Knotted]

Neil Young's Rust Never Sleeps is rather good, with some interesting lyrics. That kind of thing?

Yeah. That's a perfectly good lonely thought about music. I may even give it a like if you find a good lyric to quote.

 

[krtek a houby]

Yeah. That's a perfectly good lonely thought about music. I may even give it a like if you find a good lyric to quote.

Something about Mars, another something about llamas...

 

[Knotted]

I want to contrast music which is well packaged and music where the thought process is apparent. This isn't the difference between the popular and the avant garde. It's a contrast between music with emotional/dancing/serious utility and comedy music. There's an awareness of process in comedy - hey look I'm doing this thing, yeah and? Flanders and Swan are a particularly good example.

 

[Kaka Tim]

im none the wiser

 

[Aladdin]

Too mind bogglingly difficult to grasp right now.

And music needs sound....for me..

So I may not be up to this sorry.

 

[hitmouse]

Well, I've just learned that Mirror Man is presumably a song for the "songs with same titles but different" thread?

 

[Knotted]

Well, I've just learned that Mirror Man is presumably a song for the "songs with same titles but different" thread?

I actually didn't know the Human League song. I know!!

 

[Knotted]

Well anyway. I think Bobby McFerrin's Don't Worry Be Happy comes from a dark place. It perhaps has this reputation as a song that's relentlessly upbeat whatever you might be feeling. Enforced happiness. But I hear a lot of sadness in it. I think it's fantastic.

Also when people are angry (seems to happen wherever I go) it really tips them over the edge if you sing it to them.

 

[Knotted]

A few thoughts I shoved on Tiktok. Music that I don't just like but I feel that I can do something with. I'm going to do a little series of these.

 

[two sheds]

Lou Reed’s earliest Velvet Underground demos unearthed for reissue

Recordings from May 1965 were sealed for nearly 50 years, and reveal folk-like renditions of songs including I’m Waiting for the Man and Heroin

www.theguardian.com

Looking forward to hearing these, did love Velvet Underground and Nico: special album.

 

[story]

The pub across the street is doing a karaoke night. Most participants are fair to middling but right now someone is belting out Jolene and it’s so good I’ve opened the window to hear it better.

 

[Steel Icarus]

It's far from my favourite Clash song but the drums on Should I Stay Or Should I Go are fucking brilliant - those rolling toms are testament to how clever a drummer Topper was.

 

[story]

Walking past The Sultan on New Park Road the other evening, a parked up beaten up old car was thumping out a club remix of Relax at top volume and it was rebounding off the buildings. Gorgeous sunset moment.

 

[JimW]

The piece I'm currently translating is a book excerpt; the central character is an old woman now but we get various flashbacks/memories of her youth in a Taiwan recently returned to China from Japanese colonial control, then through the White Terror years then her going abroad and being in Paris for the May events. Music features a fair amount -she's a singer herself, there's a bit about the impact of American forces radio on the musical world of Taiwanese youth and then there's various snatches of some classic Hokkien pop by singers who are massive names in the Sinosphere but almost all unknown to me. Wonder of modern streaming services is I can listen via my phone while I'm trying to do a good version of the quoted lyrics. Mostly not really my thing but the more folk influenced ones are pretty good and some of the voices outstanding.

 

[Knotted]

The piece I'm currently translating is a book excerpt; the central character is an old woman now but we get various flashbacks/memories of her youth in a Taiwan recently returned to China from Japanese colonial control, then through the White Terror years then her going abroad and being in Paris for the May events. Music features a fair amount -she's a singer herself, there's a bit about the impact of American forces radio on the musical world of Taiwanese youth and then there's various snatches of some classic Hokkien pop by singers who are massive names in the Sinosphere but almost all unknown to me. Wonder of modern streaming services is I can listen via my phone while I'm trying to do a good version of the quoted lyrics. Mostly not really my thing but the more folk influenced ones are pretty good and some of the voices outstanding.

I mentioned them on the other thread but I've recently discovered and really got into the Taiwanese folk/pop group 交工樂隊 [Jiaogong Yuedui]. It's a world of music we don't really here about in the west.

 

[JimW]

I mentioned them on the other thread but I've recently discovered and really got into the Taiwanese folk/pop group 交工樂隊 [Jiaogong Yuedui]. It's a world of music we don't really here about in the west.

Missed that post and don't know them, will check them out.

 

[Knotted]

Modern pop music has moved away from the tension - resolve chords of traditional western music theory. This is a very interesting thing but it doesn't make for sweet endings. Which is ironic in the age of Tiktok brevity. Music now is very slabby rather than nuggetty.

 

[Steel Icarus]

Modern pop music has moved away from the tension - resolve chords of traditional western music theory. This is a very interesting thing but it doesn't make for sweet endings. Which is ironic in the age of Tiktok brevity. Music now is very slabby rather than nuggetty.

What has it moved to? Knotted

 

[Knotted]

What has it moved to? Knotted

I think music theorists are only just catching up. Music theory being descriptive rather than proscriptive, it inherently lags behind. I'm also really no expert and I'm just cribbing off youtuber 12tone who in turn is building off Phillip Tagg. I think the whole concept of key (eg. G major) is less central than it used to be and you don't get strong "dominant" resolutions like D->G so often.. This is a more loopy analysis and it applies to some older songs as well and doesn't apply to everything contemporary so there isn't some absolute marker of modernity.

Sorry not a very clear answer. Not sure there are clear answers.

 

[Knotted]

Edgard Varèse quote “I do not write experimental music. My experimenting is done before I make the music. Afterwards, it is the listener who must experiment."

If you don't know about him, he was an early/mid 20th century composer who wrote idiosyncratic, angular, avant garde music for orchestras largely composed of brass instruments and percussion, later adding electronics. I'm a big fan, but in my opinion this quote belies a control freakery at the heart of his musical philosophy. There is nothing to be discovered in the performance. I think classical music has spent the last 300 years putting the composer at the centre. I think this is a readily visible problem. His composition for the solo flute Density 21.5 is extraordinary and sounds expressive and direct, but it's supposed to sound the same each time, it's up to the flautist to deliver not to experiment.

 

[Knotted]

My favourite Kraftwerk album is Kraftwerk 2. This is an unpopular choice, most fans are dismissive of it. Ralf and Florian themselves tried to bury their three pre-Autobahn albums and I can actually see why. These early works lack the austere quasi-ironic modernist statements that characterise Autobahn and onwards, they are relatively speaking directionless and visionless sonic exploration of various types (the three albums are remarkably different to each other). The later albums are stunning in the way art can be stunning, but they're not necessarily things you want to spend much time with, the affect and the idea behind them are brilliantly instant. On the other hand Kraftwerk 2 feels like it has all the time in world for you, it's unhurried, as John Cage proscribed it lets sounds just be sounds. And what sounds, some of it feels like a warm tingle up the spine. Can't get enough of it.

 

[Cloo]

Edgard Varèse quote “I do not write experimental music. My experimenting is done before I make the music. Afterwards, it is the listener who must experiment."

If you don't know about him, he was an early/mid 20th century composer who wrote idiosyncratic, angular, avant garde music for orchestras largely composed of brass instruments and percussion, later adding electronics. I'm a big fan, but in my opinion this quote belies a control freakery at the heart of his musical philosophy. There is nothing to be discovered in the performance. I think classical music has spent the last 300 years putting the composer at the centre. I think this is a readily visible problem. His composition for the solo flute Density 21.5 is extraordinary and sounds expressive and direct, but it's supposed to sound the same each time, it's up to the flautist to deliver not to experiment.

I heard Varese's 'Ameriques' at the Proms about 20 years ago - it's an amazing chunk of noise capturing the chaos and energy of New York in the early 20th century. I've heard his music described as 3-dimensional, and it's a good description but sort of hard to put it to words. It's like, most music is linear, you're listening to 'a line' of music unfurl. What I've heard of Varese's also feels like your listening to 'depth' of sound extending back. I'd love to hear more of his work in concert. Sadly, as he was such a perfectionist I gather he didn't leave that many pieces.

 

[Knotted]

I heard Varese's 'Ameriques' at the Proms about 20 years ago - it's an amazing chunk of noise capturing the chaos and energy of New York in the early 20th century. I've heard his music described as 3-dimensional, and it's a good description but sort of hard to put it to words. It's like, most music is linear, you're listening to 'a line' of music unfurl. What I've heard of Varese's also feels like your listening to 'depth' of sound extending back. I'd love to hear more of his work in concert. Sadly, as he was such a perfectionist I gather he didn't leave that many pieces.

I've seen Ionisation performed live. That's the percussion one, which is its own peculiar thing. I've heard his music described as blocks of sound, although I don't really hear it that way I somehow found that a useful way in.

My above thought was triggered by this little video of somebody playing Density 21.5, a little solo flute composition. I just noted that he complained that it doesn't leave much to the performer, even though it sounds wild and improvisatory.