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Ill Advised Protest Chants

I've been on plenty and I know you are talking shit, you don't understand what ultra leftism is and instead have equated it with leftists (Leninists, Maoists, Stalinists) who spout mental shit, when infact it is they very groups and ideologies that denounce ultra leftism.

No, I know you mean it in the same way as ultra-gauche or left communism. I should imagine most of us mean it in the common sense ie some 'I'm more revolutionary than you anti anti fascista death to screws no pasaran where's my I-phone' type wanker. There also tends to be significant overlap between the two, not entirely co-incidentally.
 
No, I know you mean it in the same way as ultra-gauche or left communism. I should imagine most of us mean it in the common sense ie some 'I'm more revolutionary than you anti anti fascista death to screws no pasaran where's my I-phone' type wanker. There also tends to be significant overlap between the two, not entirely co-incidentally.

Well you and those that use it in that sense are wrong and infact all your doing is falsely equating having mental positions like defending North Korea as a workers state (Sparts) or giving it the big political hard man act like cheerleading ETA, IRA and various other armed groups with being more far left when infact these positions are actually far more to the right.
 
Well you and those that use it in that sense are wrong and infact all your doing is falsely equating having mental positions like defending North Korea as a workers state (Sparts) or giving it the big political hard man act like cheerleading ETA, IRA and various other armed groups with being more far left when infact these positions are actually far more to the right.

Well, no, because ultra-left has always meant posing ra-ra-revolutionaries in the UK. We've always used the term left communism instead of what the French call ultra-gauche.

So you're trying to take back a term that has never meant what you want it to mean in the UK.
 
Well, no, because ultra-left has always meant posing ra-ra-revolutionaries in the UK. We've always used the term left communism instead of what the French call ultra-gauche.

So you're trying to take back a term that has never meant what you want it to mean in the UK.

No it hasn't and those that are using it are fuckwits that are equating left with mentalness.

Those chanting for victory for Serbia are not ultra leftists they are Leninists and are pushing positions inline with Lenin's revolutionary defeatism, a position that was rejected by the very people Lenin coined the term ultra leftism for.

And left communism does not cover ultra leftism as left communism is usually used in reference to tendencies that came out of leninist parties, the workers opposition etc as opposed to say the dutch and german council commmunists or anarchists.
 
Look, use whatever terms you like, all I'm saying is when you use ultra-left most people will think of some twat with a keffiyeh and daddy's charge card.
 
Look, use whatever terms you like, all I'm saying is when you use ultra-left most people will think of some twat with a keffiyeh and daddy's charge card.

They are called middle class wankers.

Though ofcourse if you want to use that term for SWP student members it does call into question your use of it towards groups who cheer on Serbian victory or the PKK etc who whilst obviously mental don't tend to be made up of middle class brats going through a wee fad before fucking off and becoming lawyers etc.

In short your use of the term is wrong and not even internally consistent.
 
They are called middle class wankers.

Though ofcourse if you want to use that term for SWP student members it does call into question your use of it towards groups who cheer on Serbian victory or the PKK etc who whilst obviously mental don't tend to be made up of middle class brats going through a wee fad before fucking off and becoming lawyers etc.

In short your use of the term is wrong and not even internally consistent.

Look 'revol' the term is a pejorative for trendy wankers pursuing stupid knee-jerk ra-ra politics that haven't a hope in hell of gaining support from working people.

If you want to rage against the machine and take back the term or whatever then knock yourself out. But my use of it is perfectly consistent with how people generally use it. You don't like it, tough shit.
 
Look 'revol' the term is a pejorative for trendy wankers pursuing stupid knee-jerk ra-ra politics that haven't a hope in hell of gaining support from working people.

If you want to rage against the machine and take back the term or whatever then knock yourself out. But my use of it is perfectly consistent with how people generally use it. You don't like it, tough shit.

so you use as it as little more than a idiotic empty rhetorical device, aimed at appealing to ignorance and reactionary stereotyping in order to circumvent actual intellectual engagement.

basically it's your version of the tabloids 'loony left', well done you are a retarded cunt.
 
so you use as it as little more than a idiotic empty rhetorical device, aimed at appealing to ignorance and reactionary stereotyping in order to circumvent actual intellectual engagement.

basically it's your version of the tabloids 'loony left', well done you are a retarded cunt.

Oh and you are exactly the kind of prick that I would call an ultra-left. Some dick calling himself the revolution pricking about being a ra-ra and being ever so fucking sanctimonious. I bet you use proletariat in general conversation. Fuck off.
 
Oh and you are exactly the kind of prick that I would call an ultra-left. Some dick calling himself the revolution pricking about being a ra-ra and being ever so fucking sanctimonious. I bet you use proletariat in general conversation. Fuck off.

i'm named after a Manics song, the 68 comes from the year of the French general strike.

so basically you hate anyone who actually understands and talks about politics in an educated manner and in order to avoid having to justify this idiocy you appeal to idiotic stereotypes about all anarchists and communists being lil rich kids going through a rebellious phase, draping themselves in symbols and slogans they don't really understand in order to appear cool. Which is ironic as the only person in this thread bandying around political terminology they clearly don't have a fucking clue about is you.
 
i'm named after a Manics song, the 68 comes from the year of the French general strike.

so basically you hate anyone who actually understands and talks about politics in an educated manner and in order to avoid having to justify this idiocy you appeal to idiotic stereotypes about all anarchists and communists being lil rich kids going through a rebellious phase, draping themselves in symbols and slogans they don't really understand in order to appear cool. Which is ironic as the only person in this thread bandying around political terminology they clearly don't have a fucking clue about is you.

Yeah that is exactly it
 
i always found the ANL chants of 'asylum seekers welcome here' from the mouths of wealthy young students (from out of town on the whole) marching through working class areas a little crass...
 
Look, use whatever terms you like, all I'm saying is when you use ultra-left most people will think of some twat with a keffiyeh and daddy's charge card.

No, they're called left wing students. I was one. No fucking charge card though :mad:
 
You are a fucking idiot, ultra leftists would be the last people to hold such a position.

You stupid boy. By using the term ultra-left I was not making a reference to left-wing communists as Lenin wrote about in Left-Wing Communists. The ultra-left - as opposed to hard-left and far-left - were those groups that took an anti-humanitarian line usually after spending far too much time theorising. In Britain, they were typified by the RCP and a case in point was their call for "Victory to Iraq" during the first Gulf war. Their reasoning behind this argument was that military victory for Iraq would be a defeat for the British and American ruling class. In effect, their political positioning was national chauvinism as a victory for Iraq would have strengthened the Iraqi ruling class. As it happens, the Iraqi people nearly overthrew their own government in the aftermath of the military defeat (They pulled a similar stunt during the Falklands War when they called for victory for the fascist Argentinian army).

Another classic ultra-left position was refusing to defend the NHS because it was a two-tier service for the private and public sector.

Would you like to give you any more political lessons little boy?

It's nice to see though that you have derailed another thread without contributing anything in response to the OP.
 
You stupid boy. By using the term ultra-left I was not making a reference to left-wing communists as Lenin wrote about in Left-Wing Communists. The ultra-left - as opposed to hard-left and far-left - were those groups that took an anti-humanitarian line usually after spending far too much time theorising. In Britain, they were typified by the RCP and a case in point was their call for "Victory to Iraq" during the first Gulf war. Their reasoning behind this argument was that military victory for Iraq would be a defeat for the British and American ruling class. In effect, their political positioning was national chauvinism as a victory for Iraq would have strengthened the Iraqi ruling class. As it happens, the Iraqi people nearly overthrew their own government in the aftermath of the military defeat (They pulled a similar stunt during the Falklands War when they called for victory for the fascist Argentinian army).

Another classic ultra-left position was refusing to defend the NHS because it was a two-tier service for the private and public sector.

Would you like to give you any more political lessons little boy?

It's nice to see though that you have derailed another thread without contributing anything in response to the OP.

You truly are an idiot, the RCP's line of victory to Iraq is straightforward Leninism, it's called "revolutionary defeatism" and is precisely one of the issues that 'ultra leftists' stood in opposition to.

And of course communists don't defend the NHS, which isn't the same as opposing cuts in services, just as communists don't support the state yet are opposed to attacks on unemployment benefit, schools etc.
 
I quite enjoyed watching 40 lads from Bolton waving an English flag at the EDL demo in Wrexham whilst chanting 'we want our country back'. D'oh!

Cue response from the af lads on the other side - 'it's that way'

Might have been the same march but the Indy had a picture a while back of an EDL twat holding a plackard saying "Ban the Burka". He had his hood up & a scarf across his face :facepalm:
 
I lead a a few rounds of the old anarcho song that begun 'Lord Mountbatten had a boat ....etc "( to the tune of 'Old Macdonald ' ) at a protest against the queen mums visit to our college a long time ago ( the SWPs's placards highlighting the contrasts between staff cuts and a reported 20 k gardening cost for her visit were in retrospect simple but spot on ) - it didn't pan out too well in the end tbh :(
 
appealing to ignorance and reactionary stereotyping in order to circumvent actual intellectual engagement...you are a retarded cunt.

On the contrary - the parade of ignorance and stereotyping is entirely yours by using the word "retarded" as an insult. Cunt.
 
On the contrary - the parade of ignorance and stereotyping is entirely yours by using the word "retarded" as an insult. Cunt.

retarded is a perfectly valid term, it means to be stunted, undeveloped which is precisely what the posters political understanding is.

you self righteous wannabe pc cunt.
 
I'm wading in here to say that "retard" is not acceptable language in my opinion.

Also, well done both for keeping it civil. Seriously, hats off!
 
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