Foldable phones are coming

[cybershot]

If it's folded in three, then surely it can be folded in a way that the back is, well, the back, and not the screen. My only criticism, as if you drop it, it's certainly smashing.

 

[cheesethief]

It looks a lot less breakable to me. No brittle glass in sight, just a nice curvy bendy screen.

Imagine sticking it in your pocket, chucking it in a coat, carting it around in a handbag, sitting on it in a back pocket, all the things people normally do - no one wants a phone that needs handling with kid gloves. I remain eager to be proved wrong, enthusiastic even, but I am as yet unconvinced.

 

[skyscraper101]

Imagine sticking it in your pocket, chucking it in a coat, carting it around in a handbag, sitting on it in a back pocket, all the things people normally do - no one wants a phone that needs handling with kid gloves. I remain eager to be proved wrong, enthusiastic even, but I am as yet unconvinced.

As I said, like everything it depends how much you take care of it. From what I can tell, it looks like the screen is a lot less brittle so possibly even better for those prone to smashing screens. But I don't know. Real world tests won't be long around the corner.

Personally I almost always have my phone in my jeans pocket away from keys. I'm pretty careful with it and in the 18 years or so I've been owning mobile phones, I've yet to actually damage one this way.

 

[cheesethief]

As I said, like everything it depends how much you take care of it. From what I can tell, it looks like the screen is a lot less brittle so possibly even better for those prone to smashing screens. But I don't know. Real world tests won't be long around the corner.

Personally I almost always have my phone in my jeans pocket away from keys. I'm pretty careful with it and in the 18 years or so I've been owning mobile phones, I've yet to actually damage one this way.

I still have every mobile I've ever owned, as a little collection in a box, somewhere under the bed I think. Not a cracked screen amongst them and barely a few scratches. But I am anal & nerdy. Anecdotal evidence would suggest that many, if not most, mobile owners are feral, slapdash, rambunctious creatures, prone to wanton impulses. I've never seen my sister with an uncracked phone screen, and she managed to destroy her last one by dropping it in the loo, just after her 4 year old had failed to flush it properly... In the hands of such destructive owners, I would fear for the longevity of a fold out screen! Can't wait to see one in person though, it feels like the biggest shake-up in an otherwise doldrums beset market in years.

 

[skyscraper101]

I still have every mobile I've ever owned, as a little collection in a box, somewhere under the bed I think. Not a cracked screen amongst them and barely a few scratches. But I am anal & nerdy. Anecdotal evidence would suggest that many, if not most, mobile owners are feral, slapdash, rambunctious creatures, prone to wanton impulses. I've never seen my sister with an uncracked phone screen, and she managed to destroy her last one by dropping it in the loo, just after her 4 year old had failed to flush it properly... In the hands of such destructive owners, I would fear for the longevity of a fold out screen! Can't wait to see one in person though, it feels like the biggest shake-up in an otherwise doldrums beset market in years.

Some people do seem to have perpetually damaged screens.

One reason I've always been sceptical of those Samsung Galaxy edge curved screen phones is the likelihood that they would be more slippery. A phone geek friend of mine says it was the worst he ever had for slipping out of his hands and dropping because of the lack of grip on the side.

 

[editor]

Huawei are launching the world's "first" 5G smartphone with a foldable display at MWC in Barcelona.
Huawei will launch its foldable-screen 5G smartphone at MWC

 

[NoXion]

I am unconvinced that overcoming the considerable engineering difficulties inherent to creating a foldable full-colour high-resolution display, will be worth whatever problem it is that the concept of foldable screens is supposed to solve.

If you want a bigger screen, then you shouldn't spend a ridiculous amount of money on this kind of desperate stuff from hardware manufacturers running out of ideas, you should instead use the extra cash you've saved to buy a decent model of a more powerful yet still portable device with a larger form factor. Depending on your requirements you have a choice of either a phablet, pad or notebook/mini laptop.

 

[skyscraper101]

I am unconvinced that overcoming the considerable engineering difficulties inherent to creating a foldable full-colour high-resolution display, will be worth whatever problem it is that the concept of foldable screens is supposed to solve.

If you want a bigger screen, then you shouldn't spend a ridiculous amount of money on this kind of desperate stuff from hardware manufacturers running out of ideas, you should instead use the extra cash you've saved to buy a decent model of a more powerful yet still portable device with a larger form factor. Depending on your requirements you have a choice of either a phablet, pad or notebook/mini laptop.

By that logic, we'd all be carrying around separate ipods, laptops and basic phones to do all the things we can now just do on a smartphone.

The whole point is that you're creating a pocketable tablet which is also a smartphone. Negating the need to carry a tablet and a phone, because they can become the same thing. Folded for pocketing/using as a mobile phone, and unfolded for reading/watching/gaming.

Like everything they're bound to seem expensive at first, and then come down in price. That's just the way of tech.

 

[editor]

I am unconvinced that overcoming the considerable engineering difficulties inherent to creating a foldable full-colour high-resolution display, will be worth whatever problem it is that the concept of foldable screens is supposed to solve.

If you want a bigger screen, then you shouldn't spend a ridiculous amount of money on this kind of desperate stuff from hardware manufacturers running out of ideas, you should instead use the extra cash you've saved to buy a decent model of a more powerful yet still portable device with a larger form factor. Depending on your requirements you have a choice of either a phablet, pad or notebook/mini laptop.

And what happens if you want a decent sized screen but don't want to lug about a large tablet? Phablets were laughed at when they were first launched and now they're commonplace.

 

[skyscraper101]

Probably the least enjoyable part of my phablet phone is actually using it as a phone because its uncomfortable to grip for any length of time. I'd love to be able to fold it in half and hold it more comfortably like my old diddy nokia 6100.

 

[cheesethief]

I am unconvinced that overcoming the considerable engineering difficulties inherent to creating a foldable full-colour high-resolution display, will be worth whatever problem it is that the concept of foldable screens is supposed to solve.

If you want a bigger screen, then you shouldn't spend a ridiculous amount of money on this kind of desperate stuff from hardware manufacturers running out of ideas, you should instead use the extra cash you've saved to buy a decent model of a more powerful yet still portable device with a larger form factor. Depending on your requirements you have a choice of either a phablet, pad or notebook/mini laptop.

To add to what others have said, I think you may be a tad narrow in your assessment. Manufacturers do not only seek to satisfy requirements, they also strive to create new markets. You're assessment is entirely reasonable, and I'm minded to agree. However, much innovation is driven not by producing a better product to meet today's needs, but by producing something novel to meet a need people didn't know they had, or don't actually have at all. If you're looking at it from the point of view of someone who says "Why would I spend megabucks on a foldable phone that opens out into an inferior tablet?", you're looking at it the wrong way. The early models will sell to hipsters with deep pockets, the superficial moneyed that will pay for the wow factor. Sensible folk will wait for the 2nd or 3rd generation, when most of your objections will have been addressed and foldables will have inured themselves into the public consciousness. It'll be no different to when virtual keyboards on phones first emerged & threatened to supplant our beloved physical ones, and all the die-hard oldies (including me) said we'd never use one...

 

[NoXion]

By that logic, we'd all be carrying around separate ipods, laptops and basic phones to do all the things we can now just do on a smartphone.

The whole point is that you're creating a pocketable tablet which is also a smartphone. Negating the need to carry a tablet and a phone, because they can become the same thing. Folded for pocketing/using as a mobile phone, and unfolded for reading/watching/gaming.

Like everything they're bound to seem expensive at first, and then come down in price. That's just the way of tech.

I disagree. The smartphone was a genuine leap forward. It has so much flexibility in terms of functionality compared to the device it replaced, but the trade-off is that none of the gadgets or apps a smartphone has is as good as dedicated hardware and software.

This folding screen bollocks is piling yet more trade-offs on top of that, introducing another physical point of failure into the display itself, in addition to the standard weaknesses of smartphone hardware. Yet unlike when smartphones were first produced, the additional utility granted is marginal by comparison.

And what happens if you want a decent sized screen but don't want to lug about a large tablet? Phablets were laughed at when they were first launched and now they're commonplace.

It might be cheaper to buy clothing with larger pockets. Or to invest in the trivial sum it takes to get a bag. If you're actually doing work stuff rather than just faffing about while waiting for the train or whatever.

To add to what others have said, I think you may be a tad narrow in your assessment. Manufacturers do not only seek to satisfy requirements, they also strive to create new markets. You're assessment is entirely reasonable, and I'm minded to agree. However, much innovation is driven not by producing a better product to meet today's needs, but by producing something novel to meet a need people didn't know they had, or don't actually have at all. If you're looking at it from the point of view of someone who says "Why would I spend megabucks on a foldable phone that opens out into an inferior tablet?", you're looking at it the wrong way. The early models will sell to hipsters with deep pockets, the superficial moneyed that will pay for the wow factor. Sensible folk will wait for the 2nd or 3rd generation, when most of your objections will have been addressed and foldables will have inured themselves into the public consciousness. It'll be no different to when virtual keyboards on phones first emerged & threatened to supplant our beloved physical ones, and all the die-hard oldies (including me) said we'd never use one...

In the case of virtual keyboards, that was certainly not a choice on my part. Had I the option I would have stuck with a physical keypad.

 

[elbows]

The smartphone revolution may have looked like a giant leap but that was at a much later stage, for many, many years prior it was a crawl. A crawl that was expensive and clunky, but necessary for us to eventually reach the point where enough elements were ripe for prime time.

I'm glad this screen teach is evolving and we can see a few half-baked devices now. I still dont have many clues about mainstream timescale, it isnt a given that this tech in this form factor will be a winner, and the companies who are making these screens are searching for the form factors that may prove a successful and profitable destination for this tech. The available form factor options are not what some people would like to see because what we have here is rollable screen tech, not really foldable in the true sense at all, not a magic screen hinge.

 

[editor]

It might be cheaper to buy clothing with larger pockets. Or to invest in the trivial sum it takes to get a bag. If you're actually doing work stuff rather than just faffing about while waiting for the train or whatever..

Wait. So I'm supposed to buy clothes that fit the tech rather than having the tech fit my choices? No thanks. And good luck finding a pair of trousers that can accommodate a large tablet that don't look ridiculous.

 

[skyscraper101]

In the case of virtual keyboards, that was certainly not a choice on my part. Had I the option I would have stuck with a physical keypad.

You do have the option. There are plenty of phones out there with physical keypads.

 

[skyscraper101]

This folding screen bollocks is piling yet more trade-offs on top of that, introducing another physical point of failure into the display itself, in addition to the standard weaknesses of smartphone hardware. Yet unlike when smartphones were first produced, the additional utility granted is marginal by comparison.

What weaknesses are you talking about? None of these devices have even been released yet. How do you know these screens will be any less durable than the current non-bendy, prone to smashing, type of screens?

 

[8ball]

What weaknesses are you talking about? None of these devices have even been released yet. How do you know these screens will be any less durable than the current non-bendy, prone to smashing, type of screens?

What? Putting in a point of flex and adding the hinges etc. isn't going to compromise strength in a product because it hasn't yet been released? Odd thing to say.

Anyhoo, I think there is going to be a lot of potential for flexible screens, but I think it's unlikely to be with us for long in smartphones as (or very much like) they currently are.
One good application for these is TV screens that roll in or out like a projector screen, which could be used on all manner of products of different shapes or sizes.

We may find a lot more "rollable" rather than "foldable" tech comes along (like magic scrolls that you pull out to their desired length). There's also the potential for products where much of the outside surface is made of screen (that could lead to some fun games). And the direct retinal projection tech will certainly be a game-changer if they work out the bugs.

 

[8ball]

Wait. So I'm supposed to buy clothes that fit the tech rather than having the tech fit my choices? No thanks. And good luck finding a pair of trousers that can accommodate a large tablet that don't look ridiculous.

Hammertime!

 

[skyscraper101]

What? Putting in a point of flex and adding the hinges etc. isn't going to compromise strength in a product because it hasn't yet been released? Odd thing to say.

I'm saying these supposed 'weaknesses' are just theory - nobody has actually put these to the test in the real world yet. On the contrary, if anything, the fact they bend makes me think they'd be a lot more resilient than the current crop of brittle screens which are all too easily shattered.

 

[8ball]

I'm saying these supposed 'weaknesses' are just theory - nobody has actually put these to the test in the real world yet. On the contrary, if anything, the fact they bend makes me think they'd be a lot more resilient than the current crop of brittle screens which are all too easily shattered.

You add a join, you make something flexible where previously it wasn't, articulate something that was previously not articulated, then you introduce weaknesses (or other compromises). Just like weaknesses were introduced by making most of one side of a phone consist of screen.

Apparently the materials can hold up to being bent and straightened a great many times, but it will be interesting to see how that fares out in the world, as you say. Things tend to fare worse rather than better than lab tests suggest once they're out in the wild. Also, they are going to be a lot more scratchable, as well as being prone to trapping bits of grit etc.

On the other hand, you'll be able to get a screen in your jumper and look like a Teletubbie, so it's not all gloom.

 

[weltweit]

Hologram phones are on their way also.

Some way away on their way, but still.

 

[pinkmonkey]

I wonder if they'll be as shite as my 'screen edge to edge' Sony phone. I only got it in July and the touchscreen has stopped working down one side. there's a lot to be said for normal screens.

 

[editor]

I wonder if they'll be as shite as my 'screen edge to edge' Sony phone. I only got it in July and the touchscreen has stopped working down one side. there's a lot to be said for normal screens.

Why don't you get it exchanged?

 

[NoXion]

The smartphone revolution may have looked like a giant leap but that was at a much later stage, for many, many years prior it was a crawl. A crawl that was expensive and clunky, but necessary for us to eventually reach the point where enough elements were ripe for prime time.

I'm glad this screen teach is evolving and we can see a few half-baked devices now. I still dont have many clues about mainstream timescale, it isnt a given that this tech in this form factor will be a winner, and the companies who are making these screens are searching for the form factors that may prove a successful and profitable destination for this tech. The available form factor options are not what some people would like to see because what we have here is rollable screen tech, not really foldable in the true sense at all, not a magic screen hinge.

It's not about the tech, it's about the concept. The addition of even a perfectly foldable screen is of limited utility compared to the diverse array of functions that come with smartphones in general.

Wait. So I'm supposed to buy clothes that fit the tech rather than having the tech fit my choices? No thanks. And good luck finding a pair of trousers that can accommodate a large tablet that don't look ridiculous.

Like I said, and which you chose to ignore, you could also, you know, just put it in a bag? That's not hard or inconvenient or expensive, and if you disagree then you've been mesmerised by marketing. Or do you seriously think that manufacturers have no interest at all in creating a demand for their products where there was once none?

Nobody ever looked at their smartphone and thought, "you know what this thing really needs? An ugly crease right through the middle of the display! I also want it to be subject to additional wear and tear through the flexing of said display. It's not enough that batteries have limited charge cycles, I need something else that could potentially break as well!"

What users actually want is boring stuff like more internal storage, longer battery life, more physical durability, better build quality and so on.

You do have the option. There are plenty of phones out there with physical keypads.

No, I don't. When I got my current and first ever smartphone, I was not offered a choice of models. At the moment I do not have the money to buy a replacement myself, and it seems like a lot people are in a similar situation, selecting their phones from a limited choice on contracts offered by networks, rather than buying a specific model to their needs and desires. Manufacturers and network operators collude in this shit, so I don't see too much scope for users getting what they want rather than making do with what is offered.

What weaknesses are you talking about? None of these devices have even been released yet. How do you know these screens will be any less durable than the current non-bendy, prone to smashing, type of screens?

Smartphones are handheld devices and as such they might be subject to all kinds of physical shocks and disturbances, contact with fluids, exposure to dust and dirt, scratches (good luck making something that's flexible and scratch-resistant while still also being cheap), and so on.

These bendy screens will be less durable for the simple reason that moving parts break more quickly than non-moving ones. Introducing a bendy screen where once it was rigid would be to increase the amount of moving parts, especially when one considers how many tiny little gizmos are involved in modern high-resolution displays.

So not only is this bendy screen nonsense introducing a more easily breakable component, it's doing it in a form factor more likely than most to be subject to all kinds of abuse. While I'm sure this will work out to be profitable for the manufacturers, I'm less convinced that end-users will benefit so much.

 

[editor]

Like I said, and which you chose to ignore, you could also, you know, just put it in a bag? That's not hard or inconvenient or expensive, and if you disagree then you've been mesmerised by marketing.

This is such a ridiculous argument. i don't want to carry a bag for a gadget. But I'll take a phone that has a fold out screen.

And this whole 'they're going to be too fragile' argument seems pretty flawed too (even though you don't know anything about the hardiness of thee new foldable screens). People will always break screens. Some gadgets are more fragile than others and you have to treat them accordingly or stick them in a case. It's that simple.

 

[NoXion]

This is such a ridiculous argument. i don't want to carry a bag for a gadget. But I'll take a phone that has a fold out screen.

And this whole 'they're going to be too fragile' argument seems pretty flawed too (even though you don't know anything about the hardiness of thee new foldable screens). People will always break screens. Some gadgets are more fragile than others and you have to treat them accordingly or stick them in a case. It's that simple.

You're the one willing to splash out on flashy crap of limited utility instead of making use of a cheaper and more flexible solution, and *I'm* the one making ridiculous arguments? What on Earth are you doing that makes something as simple as carrying a damn bag such a massive inconvenience, that it justifies spending many hundreds or even a thousand or two thousand pounds on a wobbly screen? Do you regularly crawl though ductworks while using your devices?

They're going to be more fragile for multiple reasons. One, they're new. Two, there is now a moving part where once there was none. Three, they're going to be subject to all the wear and tear that such devices go through. Or maybe I hallucinated the bit of the thread where multiple people talked about people dropping phones and shit.

The fact that users tend to swaddle their devices in protective layers would seem to be a good argument for *not* making them more fragile through the introduction of gimmicky features, yes?

 

[editor]

You're the one willing to splash out on flashy crap of limited utility instead of making use of a cheaper and more flexible solution, and *I'm* the one making ridiculous arguments?

Why would these folding phones be of 'limited' utility? How can you declare them to be "flashy crap" when you haven't the slightest, remotest idea of how good (or bad) the finished article would be?

And having to carry around two devices and a bag would hardly be a more flexible solution for me, thanks.

 

[skyscraper101]

Arguing about phones on urban is always so ridiculous.

Not least in this case when it doesn’t even exist yet except for a prototype and which nobody has any real world experience of.

NoXion don’t worry nobody is going to make you buy this phone which is so obviously going to break the moment you unfold it.

 

[editor]

Arguing about phones on urban is always so ridiculous.

Not least in this case when it doesn’t even exist yet except for a prototype and which nobody has any real world experience of.

NoXion don’t worry nobody is going to make you buy this phone which is so obviously going to break the moment you unfold it.

Indeed. If they're shit and more fragile than Kipling's Crumbly Biscuits then I won't be getting one. But if they can deliver on the concept and the price drops down, I'll be very interested. Be great on a long train journey if you could fold out your screen and watch a movie on your phone.

 

[NoXion]

Why would these folding phones be of 'limited' utility? How can you declare them to be "flashy crap" when you haven't the slightest, remotest idea of how good (or bad) the finished article would be?

And having to carry around two devices and a bag would hardly be a more flexible solution for me, thanks.

Because a folding screen is just that, a folding screen. It adds much less utility than say, being able to browse the internet. People can get cheaper and less breakable non-foldy phones that do exactly the same things as the more expensive foldy phones.

I'm declaring foldy screens to be flashy crap because the basic concept is fundamentally vapid, while also introducing additional engineering challenges. Anyone here remember when curvy monitors were supposed to take over the world? Yeah. Those things weren't even expected to flex either like these foldy phones.

Here's the great thing about bags; if you put both items *inside* the bag, then you only have to carry one item. In case it also has to be pointed out, you can also get bags that hang off your back or a shoulder so as to keep your hands free to do other things while carrying. It's a fucking genius solution, but it doesn't have quite the same marketing team as these foldy phones do.