Egypt: "4 out of 5 women sexually harassed, 2/3rd of men admit assaulting women"
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For you its a rubbish comparison, for me it was an appropriate one.
I got a lot of hassle from men there.
Men sticking their hands up my skirt, arse grabs, tit grabs. It was drunken, but just as distressing.
I'm from there and have had one or two incidents like that over the years so I find the comparison ridiculous. Newcastle is nothing like as hassley as the places you're discussing
Strange thing to say....
I was there for university and at times walking through the Bigg Market, or going to one of the bars was like running a gauntlet.
After several assaults, girls in my year wore jeans and not skirts when out at night because of the up the skirt groping. Verbal abuse was certainly common too.
That is my experience of the place.
After several assaults, girls in my year wore jeans and not skirts when out at night because of the up the skirt groping. Verbal abuse was certainly common too.
That is my experience of the place.
Yuwipi Woman
Whack-A-Mole Queen
There's certainly enough of that kind of thing to go around. It's not confined to muslim countries by any means.
I went hiking this weekend and went out about 11:00 am. Around 9:00 am that morning a woman was raped on the trail I hiked. I'd originally planned on going out earlier, but was delayed. Turned out it was this man's third arrest for the same thing.
But you can't let things like that limit you.
I went hiking this weekend and went out about 11:00 am. Around 9:00 am that morning a woman was raped on the trail I hiked. I'd originally planned on going out earlier, but was delayed. Turned out it was this man's third arrest for the same thing.
But you can't let things like that limit you.
I'm from there and have had one or two incidents like that over the years so I find the comparison ridiculous. Newcastle is nothing like as hassley as the places you're discussing
Strange thing to say....
Not really. Its an almost pavlovian response for many lefties when faced with something that could be deemed as critical of a culture from outside of Western Europe/North America to immediately try and put up an 'equivilent' experience from here.
Never been outside of Europe myself so have no direct experience but my Parents and sister did once visit Istanbul and my Dad relates how he found himself looking to punch out on many occassions because of men trying to touch my Mum and sister but how, on having his own bum pinched, he decided that it was best just to go back to the cruise liner they came in on and suffer the blow to his pride.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Exactly. The Bigg Market used to be notorious when I lived in N/cle in the 80's.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
That says it all, quite frankly.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
camouflage
gaslit at scale.
Probably becoz they beleive women who don't wear hijabs etc are shameless sluts, and becoz women in the West don't cover themsleves from head to toe (well, women in the rest of humaity generaly realy), this must mean they're asking for it. Besides, men in the muslim world are not expected to have any self control.
Louloubelle
Well-Known Member
CharlieAddict
nekomimi rocks!!!
i'd love to hear you say that in front of my muslim buddies.
CyberRose
أرفع الشفرات
Well, shouldn't be a problem if they have so much self control!
Are you really really asking people to make a comparison between what goes on in a part of Newcastle that is (in)famous for being home to what can be a very raucous night life to this survey from Egypt ?
If women were being harassed at 3.30pm in the Bigg Market then maybe but since I would guess most of the leering or jeers of 'get your tits out for the lads' ( or what ever the Geordie equivilent is ) takes place in the early hours of a Friday or Saturday night then I guess that the girls who go there have a fair idea of what they are in for when they go there and I would guess that a fair few quite enjoy the attention.
Now I am sure that you can quite happily get on your high horse and accuse me of all sorts now but please, to try and equate what is no more than high jinx in Newcastle (which I accept may on occassion get a little out of hand ) with systamatic and sustained sexual harasment in places such as Egypt is almost beyond paraody.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
I'm not "asking" anyone to do anything; I was merely responding to a post that mentioned the Bigg Market. Try reading the thread.
Well your use of the word 'excatly' strikes me as being in full agreement with the person trying to make this laughable 'comparison'.
Do 4 out of 5 women who walk through the Bigg Market complain of sexual harasment ?
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Think what you like. You're just nitpicking.
Andy the Don
Wise men say only fools..
I am wondering if this is a recent phenomena, I was travelling in Egypt in 1988 and meet up and travelled with two girls. When I was with them the girls had no hassle from males and they only had limited hassle when they were on their own. The hassle they attracted was the "hello pretty lady, come into my shop" variety. Although they dressed modestly when on the streets. I am also thinking does this have any correlation with the increase in hajib wearing in Egypt. When I was there I would say only about 40-50% of women wear the hajib and it was mainly worn by uneducated women. Educated Egyptian women would wear smartish but modest western clothing.
As Ive said, Ive found the harassment in Cairo to be citywide and overwhelming. The relentless nature of the harassment and that often even inside your hotel you cant escape it, of course makes it worse than the Bigg Market by many orders of magnitude.
I mentioned the Bigg Market only in response to the notion that OTT harassment was 'an Islamic thing,' because that hasnt been my experience of long stays in several Arab countries.
I mentioned the Bigg Market only in response to the notion that OTT harassment was 'an Islamic thing,' because that hasnt been my experience of long stays in several Arab countries.
I would guess that the proliferation of internet cafes in Cairo and the availability of dirt cheap copies of porn dvds have greatly exacerbated the situation.
camouflage
gaslit at scale.
Sure I'd say it to their face, what would they do anyway, behead me?
I bloody loved the women-only carriages. Never really felt any hostility in there.
Didn't really feel any scorn or dislike either, anywhere in the Middle East or Iran I went. Just crappy boring 'heyy, you, lovely bum', constant weird snake-noises, 'you come here, I fuck you', etc etc etc. Perhaps you interpret them as scorn, I just interpreted them as idiocy.
Have to say I'm still sceptical about extensive sexual harrassment being a Muslim country thing, CyberRose. Some of the worst reports of harrassment I've heard have been from mates who have been to India, which I believe isn't predominantly Muslim. Having lived in Muslim countries I agree that most of the men I knew had an utterly shit attitude to women but unfortunately that's not confined to one particular religion/culture.
I'd also take issue with your view that Syria and Jordan 'aren't as Islamic' as Egypt - what do you mean, exactly? Egypt has one of the most liberal regimes in the Arab world. (Yes, it's all relative, I know). That's why Western women can go there and not have to wear the hijab. It's not like Saudi at all - in fact it's where Saudis go to drink, take drugs and whore.
In a nation that forciblies perfoms radical female circumcisions (removing outer labia and entire clitoris, then sewing it up so that it heals in smooth skin shield of sorts, that must be ripped open everytime intercourse takes place," permits "honour killings" even if a rumor about one's sister, daughter, etc. is said ot have looked too long in the direction of a boy is it any wonder than woman would find themselves "harrassed?"
Arab treatment of women is a real problem, but what might have made a great poll was harrassment against fellow men as any man who has been to Egypt can probably tell you. UN -PC as it is, it is fact.
Arab treatment of women is a real problem, but what might have made a great poll was harrassment against fellow men as any man who has been to Egypt can probably tell you. UN -PC as it is, it is fact.
I agree. Sexual abuse and harassment of women seems to be common in any backward / socially repressive society. "Eve-Teasing" is a deceptive term often used to describe rape.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Ah, more distortions from our No. 1 bigot and spambot.
Melinda: "PC Cafes.": Many last only a very short while before fundamentalist groups shut them down violently.
To others who complain about segregated public transport, it is an issue throughout the region but many females say it benefits them. Personally I am not agains it because the attitude, unfortunatley is, if a woman chooses to sit by an unrelated man, she is promiscuous and rather than even come near anything like that I would much rather just avoid the brouhaha.
Andy: Egypt has always had this isuee but outside the metro areas until the early 90s. Many hate its political leadership (Mubarek et al) and of course foreigners are a safer scapegoat than attacking a cop. In many cases, people bothering foreigners will not find any help from the police,etc.
To others who complain about segregated public transport, it is an issue throughout the region but many females say it benefits them. Personally I am not agains it because the attitude, unfortunatley is, if a woman chooses to sit by an unrelated man, she is promiscuous and rather than even come near anything like that I would much rather just avoid the brouhaha.
Andy: Egypt has always had this isuee but outside the metro areas until the early 90s. Many hate its political leadership (Mubarek et al) and of course foreigners are a safer scapegoat than attacking a cop. In many cases, people bothering foreigners will not find any help from the police,etc.
I agree. Sexual abuse and harassment of women seems to be common in any backward / socially repressive society. "Eve-Teasing" is a deceptive term often used to describe rape.
Dr Jon!! Hello! Looooooong time since Ive spoken to you!
I was sorting through some photos of Sri Lanka the other day for work and came across photos of Mirissa!
Lovely place, but I had a huge problem there- a guy tried to break into my room one night, and later accosted me on the beach.
You, Mae and some others were incredibly supportive at the time.
You told me the window bars werent just to keep the monkeys out!
'Eve teasing' and assaults were common knowledge, but this was *just* after the Tsunami, there was no security or police. Rates of assaults on women just rocketed.
Where are you atm? I still owe you a drink at the Inn on the Green!
Eh up! Blimey - I'd almost forgotten Mirissa..
I'm in UK atm. PM me and I'll see if I can squeeze in a trip to London before I leave.
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