Dowsing

[Baronage-Phase]

Also it appears that you're greatly overstating that claim.

And it appears you failed to read that link
Fully.

 

[Signal 11]

One last chance. Point me to a test that you think shows evidence of it working.

 

[Ralph Llama]

oh please give me another chance LOL

 

[Signal 11]

a Bottle of water is actually "at rest", where as liquid of any kind in movement is energy in motion. These people were set up to fail. This was an unfair test.

The water was flowing in the test that you keep touting.

 

[Ralph Llama]

Which test ?... sorry.. we have looked at more than one.

irrelevant... you missed my point... I have a sneaky feeling your not going to understand much TBH. Learn to read.

 

[Signal 11]

Which test ?... sorry.. we have looked at more than one.

This one: Testing Dowsing: The Failure of the Munich Experiments - CSI

 

[Baronage-Phase]

'Dowsing works' says Humphrys after using it to find water on his Welsh farm



And yes..it's someone who experienced it working... and forgot to call in the local laboratory to make sure it was fully controlled.

 

[Ralph Llama]

This one: Testing Dowsing: The Failure of the Munich Experiments - CSI

I have already stated I agree with that research! .... sorry m8e this is getting boring now. Can`t you dig out some evidence that conclusively proves that dowsing is false?

 

[Signal 11]

I have already stated I agree with that research!

You have repeatedly touted the article which it disproves.

 

[Ralph Llama]

Jesus ! It does not disprove the other article. Neither article disprove the other.

this is becoming circular

 

[Signal 11]

Jesus ! It does not disprove the other article. Neither article disprove the other.

this is becoming circular

It says that it disproves the other article. You say that it doesn't. And you also say that you accept it. Those two claims cannot both be true.

Conclusion
The Munich dowsing experiments represent the most extensive test ever conducted of the hypothesis that a genuine mysterious ability permits dowsers to detect hidden water sources. The research was conducted in a sympathetic atmosphere, on a highly selected group of candidates, with careful control of many relevant variables. The researchers themselves concluded that the outcome unquestionably demonstrated successful dowsing abilities, but a thoughtful re-examination of the data indicates that such an interpretation can only be regarded as the result of wishful thinking. In fact, it is difficult to imagine a set of experimental results that would represent a more persuasive disproof of the ability of dowsers to do what they claim. The experiments thus can and should be considered a decisive failure by the dowsers.

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

Can`t you dig out some evidence that conclusively proves that dowsing is false?

And finally we have a full house on bullshit bingo

 

[Ralph Llama]

It says that it disproves the other article. You say that it doesn't. And you also say that you accept it. Those two claims cannot both be true.

The Munich lab experiments are the focus of the debunking.... not the experiments referred to here :

Researchers analyzed the successes and failures of dowsers in attempting to locate water at more than 2000 sites in arid regions of Sri Lanka, Zaire, Kenya, Namibia and Yemen over a 10-year period. To do this, researchers teamed geological experts with experienced dowsers and then set up a scientific study group to evaluate the results. Drill crews guided by dowsers didn't hit water every time, but their success rate was impressive. In Sri Lanka, for example, they drilled 691 holes and had an overall success rate of 96 percent.

"In hundreds of cases the dowsers were able to predict the depth of the water source and the yield of the well to within 10 percent or 20 percent," says Hans-Dieter Betz, a physicist at the University of Munich, who headed the research group.

Finding Water With A Forked Stick May Not Be A Hoax

 

[Ralph Llama]

And finally we have a full house on bullshit bingo

You`ll get over it

I am the 4%

 

[Mrs Miggins]

I can't believe you've posted that one article AGAIN Ralph Llama

If someone proved somehow that dowsing did actually work and could explain the mechanism by which it worked I'd be the first one to say "well bugger me sideways - how very fascinating". But it's not going to be possible to even begin to explain that mechanism until it can be replicated under controlled conditions because how else could it be studied properly and eventually understood?

Until that happens, it's a person with 2 sticks wandering around going "here....I reckon it's here".

 

[Mrs Miggins]

And this is where woo peddling muppets always go wrong. Rather than accepting “we don’t know” as an answer or a point from which to investigate further, they simply fill the gap with bullshit.

This. In spades!

 

[gentlegreen]

I don't know if woo is any worse now than before or whether it's just that it shows up so starkly in the Internet age ... which technology can also enable it to punch above its weight now that the proponents have alternatives to writing letters to local papers or shouting at people on street corners.

A quick search on Youtube reveals a steady trickle of dowsing videos though they're trumped massively even by flat earth these days - let alone the ever popular chemtrails...

 

[Signal 11]

The Munich lab experiments are the focus of the debunking.... not the experiments referred to here

The claims about Sri Lanka don't come from experiments. Those are Schröter's own claims about himself. Schröter was a water engineer working for the German government’s overseas aid agency, who claimed that he used dowsing "in addition to conventional methods of prospecting for water". Betz says that Schröter's claims convinced him and so he wrote them up as an article.

Since anecdote isn't taken seriously in science that didn't convince anyone. So Betz decided, correctly, that he should do a proper controlled study. That was the Munich study mentioned above, which as you've accepted, showed that there was nothing in it after all:

it is difficult to imagine a set of experimental results that would represent a more persuasive disproof of the ability of dowsers to do what they claim. The experiments thus can and should be considered a decisive failure by the dowsers.

 

[spanglechick]

Science is very happy to say it doesn't know stuff (e.g. - why placebos work on animals), and also change its collective mind in the face of evidence. If science is able to observe dowsing under any conditions that can then be repeated, science will embrace it. It would be beyond cool to have observed another type of natural force. Nobel prizewinning stuff.

 

[weltweit]

I know a couple, nice in many ways, in fact I like them and spend time with them from time to time, but at Christmas I discovered they believe in homeopathy. I was both disappointed in them and concerned for their health and safety.

 

[Mrs Miggins]

I know a couple, nice in many ways, in fact I like them and spend time with them from time to time, but at Christmas I discovered they believe in homeopathy. I was both disappointed in them and concerned for their health and safety.

I would be interested to know what percentage of people who believe in homeopathy actually stick with it when faced with serious, life threatening disease.

 

[weltweit]

I would be interested to know what percentage of people who believe in homeopathy actually stick with it when faced with serious, life threatening disease.

Their homeopathist has been giving them medical opinions far beyond what their quackery should permit and I find that profoundly worrying. Ok that they go to them for minor things where a bit of placebo might help but more than that no way.

 

[Mrs Miggins]

Their homeopathist has been giving them medical opinions far beyond what their quackery should permit and I find that profoundly worrying. Ok that they go to them for minor things where a bit of placebo might help but more than that no way.

Hm. I have no real issue with "alternative" therapies for minor things that will correct themselves in time (which is how this stuff works anyway) but when it gets serious, it is worrying.

 

[joustmaster]

beesonthewhatnow do a similar thread on homeopathy. I want to find out who else is a deluded loon who doesn't understand basic logic and reasoning.

 

[weltweit]

beesonthewhatnow do a similar thread on homeopathy. I want to find out who else is a deluded loon who doesn't understand basic logic and reasoning.

I would be very surprised if anyone on u75 believed in homeopathy.

 

[joustmaster]

I would be very surprised if anyone on u75 believed in homeopathy.

PippinTook Ralph Llama

I'm also willing to sell them some of my finest snake oil

 

[nogojones]

Ralph earlier

 

[Mrs Miggins]

I would be very surprised if anyone on u75 believed in homeopathy.

I wouldn't!

 

[nogojones]

Finding Water With A Forked Stick May Not Be A Hoax

Would you class this as pseudo science?

That's a report of a paper (not the paper), so it would be uuseful to read the whole document before trying to make an informed decision. However that report was frrom 1998. Much done in the way of peer reviewing this work in the last 20 years?

 

[beesonthewhatnow]

I would be very surprised if anyone on u75 believed in homeopathy.

Certainly used to be a good few that did, how that may have changed over the years god knows...