autonomous cars - the future of motoring is driverless

[Cid]

Traffic lights are very specific light sources though, I doubt there's many if any other light sources with Red, Amber, Green all the same size stacked on top of each other, especially once you take into account the phasing of the lights and that often the vehicle will have time to see the lights change and I really doubt anything else in nature or our urban landscape would mimic that (except by intent of course). I agree about the dirty white lines and hexagonal signs though and do wonder how they will deal with low contrast when paint is really dirty or under puddles.

Yeah, but think of something like this:

Or lights that have a green cyclist. You need to be pretty confident in measuring the specific amount of light emitted at various distances... Also you'll have massive variance in general light conditions, I mean a bright day in SF is going to provide a fairly overwhelming level of general light. And, of course, broken lights - though they're a problem for anyone.

 

[BigTom]

good point - I think they'd be fine distinguishing between a round light, a cycle symbol and an arrow but yeah a street full of them like that could be confusing.

 

[hash tag]

"Machines" night be able to make more sense of that than me! No turns. One way to left. one way to right. don't block the box........
thats without street names, other road users and pedestraians all over the place.

 

[Crispy]

They build a complete 3D representation of the world around them, so there's no ambuguity about where each light is in the world. That photo is shot with a telephot lens which compresses the depth, anyway.

 

[kabbes]

"Machines" night be able to make more sense of that than me! No turns. One way to left. one way to right. don't block the box........
thats without street names, other road users and pedestraians all over the place.

That's what I was going to say! Forget the robot, you better hope it's never me driving down that street.

 

[hash tag]

In case anyone fancies catching up, this is worth watching Horizon, 2017: Dawn of the Driverless Car
particularly interesting were the differences between level 3 and level 5 ( I can't remember level 4 being mentioned?).

They did talk briefly about the Tesla death - but for me that was not a self driving car, just a car with lane control and it went wrong.

 

[Cid]

They did talk about 4 iirc, but mostly to say it's pointless because that level of autonomy means a driver is never going to pay enough attention.

 

[weltweit]

In case anyone fancies catching up, this is worth watching Horizon, 2017: Dawn of the Driverless Car
particularly interesting were the differences between level 3 and level 5 ( I can't remember level 4 being mentioned?). ..

Might watch that now ..

 

[weltweit]

Watched it, good program I thought, interesting and included the range from large corporates trying to reinvent transport to small startups.

 

[T & P]

As I believe it's been pointed out on this thread already, autonomous cars will only work if everyone is forced to switch to them.

If it is left to people to buy them and share the roads with human operated cars, the poor sods might find out their journey home takes three times as much, certainly in cities and busy areas, as the automated car's software will forever be giving way to the more 'proactive' human drivers. Good luck incorporating into a traffic jammed street where the oncoming traffic has preference

 

[weltweit]

As I believe it's been pointed out on this thread already, autonomous cars will only work if everyone is forced to switch to them.

If it is left to people to buy them and share the roads with human operated cars, the poor sods might find out their journey home takes three times as much, certainly in cities and busy areas, as the automated car's software will forever be giving way to the more proactive human drivers.

Yes, I have wondered about that myself, but it may be the case that auto cars might operate with closer tolerances of other vehicles permitting them to pull out when a human driver might not.

 

[T & P]

Yes, I have wondered about that myself, but it may be the case that auto cars might operate with closer tolerances of other vehicles permitting them to pull out when a human driver might not.

The thing is in many real life situations one has to simply be a bit cheeky and inch your way in (safely of course) because otherwise you will simply not be able to join in for a very long time. If the software in command of the car has such initiative written in, fair enough. But if it is programmed to follow the Highway Code to the letter, it has all the hallmarks of being an unmitigated disaster IMO.

 

[weltweit]

Indeed, I often drive some nose to tail rush hour roads where if people didn't regularly let others join, in front of them, no one on the side road would join the main road at all.

Nevertheless I don't think we are going to wake up one day and find that everyone has switched to auto cars. Firstly I think they are going to be expensive. They may have low insurance costs, if they are safer, but you can buy a £500 runabout petrol manual car now and I don't see auto cars replacing that cheap second hand market any time soon.

 

[A380]

Was in MK today and they have put signs up ready for the station to centre automatic pod trial...

 

[cupid_stunt]

Was in MK today and they have put signs up ready for the station to centre automatic pod trial...

Sky News is featuring the driver-less pods in Milton Keynes this morning as, after years of testing, up to 40 will start operating from spring 2018.

The coming year will see driverless vehicle technology become part of everyday life in Britain, according to experts.

The sector has already seen a sharp acceleration in development over the past 12 months with the Government backing the technology in the last Budget - promising fully driverless cars on the roads within three years.

The first street trials have already been successfully completed by UK Autodrive, who worked with JLR, Tata and Ford to test vehicles on public roads in Coventry in the autumn.

In spring 2018 a fleet of up to 40 driverless pods will take to the walkways of Milton Keynes to enable passengers to complete the "last mile" of their journeys in the town.
Driverless vehicle technology will go mainstream in 2018, experts claim

Funny looking things...

 

[cupid_stunt]

This is from 7/11/18 - Google sibling Waymo launches fully autonomous ride-hailing service

So, drive-less cabs are actually arriving in the US during 2018 as well.

Waymo, formerly known as Google’s self-driving car, is launching a fully autonomous Uber-like ride-hailing service with no human driver behind the wheel, after testing the vehicles on public roads in Arizona.

Waymo, which is owned by Google parent Alphabet, said members of the public will begin riding in its fleet of modified Fiat Chrysler Pacifica minivans outfitted with self-driving technology in the next few months. Passengers will initially be accompanied in the back seat by a Waymo employee, but will eventually travel alone in the robotic car.

The service will first be available to those who are already part of the company’s public trial already under way in Phoenix. Rides will be free to start with, but Waymo expects to begin charging for journeys at some point.

 

[cybershot]

Why do they have to look so shit.

 

[hash tag]

I sort of heard this the other night and it sounded interesting. There are differing conditions, around the world the cars are having difficulty coping with; foxes, kangaroos.....they also discuss issues with the law and insurance

BBC Radio 4 - Law in Action, Driverless Cars and the Law

 

[weltweit]

Driverless Uber car kills female pedestrian in first deadly crash

Autonomous Uber car kills cyclist in Tempe, Arizona.

 

[weltweit]

A better link Uber halts self-driving tests after death

 

[cupid_stunt]

A better link Uber halts self-driving tests after death

Poor woman.

That link mentions there's almost 6,000 pedestrians deaths per year on US roads, so it would be interesting to compare 'deaths per mile' between driver-less & normal cars.

It would seem the car was not actually at fault on this occasion...

The police chief of Tempe, Arizona, where a woman was struck and killed by one of Uber’s self-driving cars Sunday, says the ride-sharing company is likely not at fault for the accident, following a preliminary investigation.

Chief of Police Sylvia Moir told the San Francisco Chronicle on Monday that video footage taken from cameras equipped to the autonomous Volvo SUV potentially shift the blame to the victim herself, 49-year-old Elaine Herzberg, rather than the vehicle.

“It’s very clear it would have been difficult to avoid this collision in any kind of mode [autonomous or human-driven] based on how she came from the shadows right into the roadway,” Moir told the paper, adding that the incident occurred roughly 100 yards from a crosswalk. “It is dangerous to cross roadways in the evening hour when well-illuminated managed crosswalks are available,” she said.

Police Say Uber Is Likely Not at Fault for Its Self-Driving Car Fatality in Arizona

 

[Poi E]

They'll name some code after her, in memoriam.

 

[mauvais]

Unlike humans, autonomous cars shouldn't necessarily behave any differently if it's light or dark, and definitely shouldn't care if it's a marked crosswalk or not. That said, some collisions are physically unavoidable.

 

[kabbes]

Unlike humans, autonomous cars... definitely shouldn't care if it's a marked crosswalk or not.

I thought that at first, then I wondered if it would be reasonable to include in your AI a tendency towards speed restriction or other enhanced risk mitigation when approaching a marked crosswalk. After all, that's how humans drive.

 

[IC3D]

Teaching AI to assert itself in traffic could be the begining of the end of humanity. Everyone is assuming this sad death was an accident

 

[Poi E]

Do you think she might have seen that the car had no driver and assumed it was stationary? Or do they put dummies behind the wheel, like real life?

 

[mauvais]

Do you think she might have seen that the car had no driver and assumed it was stationary? Or do they put dummies behind the wheel, like real life?

There was a driver, just not driving.

 

[T & P]

Frankly I'm fucking amazed how lax the authorities in various countries seem to have been about autonomous cars being used on public roads to any degree whatsoever, especially as many have some absurdly draconian rules for drivers at the same time.

It seems utterly unbelievable that an unproven technology still in its infancy, and one that allows the human driver to abandon control of the vehicle to boot (until now the mother of all no-nos in most nations' motoring laws), is actually allowed to happen in the US on public roads. As I understand it it has not been approved in the UK yet but changes in the law are planned as early as this year where the driver might be allowed to take their hands off the steering wheel for up to three minutes at a time.

Compare that with existing imbecilic laws whereby drivers are fined for eating an apple or drinking from a bottle in snail-pace speed during a traffic jam or even stationary at a traffic lights, which only a very imaginative person could possibly think is a reckless or dangerous act in any way whatsoever. But taking your hands off the wheel at 60 mph and letting a bunch of sensors drive is fine.

I mean, what in the actual fuck? i don't doubt one day we will have mastered the technology, but we're nowhere near that point at the moment.

ETA: the contrast between regulations governing aviation, where even minor changes must be certified by multiple bodies after hundreds of hours of testing, and those regarding autonomous cars bing used on public roads, is also interesting.

 

[Poi E]

Agreed. Law no doubt to catch up, too, with issues like which party is deemed to be "in control" of the vehicle, responsibilities for accidents like this (Uber? Driver who should have reacted? Makers of self drive tech? Google maps?)

 

[hash tag]

I also saw there was a "driver" in the uber car that killed that poor woman, but why, what were they for? Given that the legislation and insurance for Driverless cars is still in it's infancy, I wonder who will get the blame, the non driver, the programmer or uber?