"37 social units is 37 too many" says estate agent about Lambeth's shrinking affordable housing

[beesonthewhatnow]

In all seriousness, is what editor did not a breach of the Data Protection Act?

He has collected personal information (in this instance their political views) which is absolutely fine; but - crucially - hasn't complied with the following 'fairness' regulations on processing that data, as set down by the Information Commissioners Office:

• handle their personal data only in ways they would reasonably expect; and
• above all, not use their information in ways that unjustifiably have a negative effect on them.

Interestingly, it also notes that "a decision to share personal data with another organisation does not take away your duty to treat individuals fairly. So before sharing personal data, you should consider carefully what the recipient will do with it, and what the effect on individuals is likely to be."

I'm not sure how the DPA translates to anonymised forum posts and it's not an easy read across, but interesting stuff none the less. Surely this sort of thing has happened before and some legal nerd can link me to the precedent?

Right, time to cook dinner!

Oh just fuck off you colossal fucking tit.

 

[ViolentPanda]

"froth and red mist"

Don't get your hopes up, it's nothing like toning mist.

 

[ViolentPanda]

In all seriousness, is what editor did not a breach of the Data Protection Act?

He has collected personal information (in this instance their political views) which is absolutely fine; but - crucially - hasn't complied with the following 'fairness' regulations on processing that data, as set down by the Information Commissioners Office:

• handle their personal data only in ways they would reasonably expect; and
• above all, not use their information in ways that unjustifiably have a negative effect on them.

Interestingly, it also notes that "a decision to share personal data with another organisation does not take away your duty to treat individuals fairly. So before sharing personal data, you should consider carefully what the recipient will do with it, and what the effect on individuals is likely to be."

I'm not sure how the DPA translates to anonymised forum posts and it's not an easy read across, but interesting stuff none the less. Surely this sort of thing has happened before and some legal nerd can link me to the precedent?

Right, time to cook dinner!

You appear to be labouring under the misapprehension that a publicly-available e-mail address and/or an IP number is "personal data". It isn't. If it were, you could have every shyster spamming your e-mail account, held to account. Your e-mail address in no more in the category "personal data" (records pertaining to you) than is your home address.

 

[ViolentPanda]

btw, I wasn't talking about the IP address, the personal data in this context is the posters political opinions. The reason I said its a difficult read across is that the opinion is openly stated but from a position of assumed anonymity

[EDIT] although link you posted had this to say "If you wish to use IP addresses to identify or build a profile on each of your visitors as an individual, even if they are never identified by name, you should assume that the Data Protection Act applies. Only a court can decide for certain whether or not this is a processing of personal data to which the Act applies and there have been no court rulings on this point to date."

An expressed opinion in a public forum (which Brixton Buzz is) isn't "personal data". It's a publicly-expressed opinion.
BTW, the "you" in the above quote of yours? it refers to commercial use. That's why it talks about harvesting the information of customers.

 

[sleaterkinney]

This probably belongs on here:

http://www.homesandproperty.co.uk/p...-ps15-million-affordable-homes-subsidy-battle

The millionaire developer behind London’s priciest block of flats, One Hyde Park, is pleading poverty over his latest project.

 

[Nancy_Winks]

I know everyone's meant to know this shit or have done an open university degree in internet security or something. But this thread has been an absolute education in internet privacy to me. Shit I never knew before reading this thread:
Your IP address relates to your internet provider not individual computer. I thought the latter cos when you ring IT up they get you to read the IP address of the computer that's broken
Your IP is broadcast when you post

Stuff I still don't know:
Can a techy person trace an IP to an area or road (like a postcode?)
Can a website your on (say works homepage) know which website you've come from or go to next?

Honestly I haven't a fucking clue about this stuff. I know people on here talk like everyone can or should or does know this stuff, but I don't and I can't be the only one? It's like a dark art to me

 

[maomao]

I know everyone's meant to know this shit or have done an open university degree in internet security or something. But this thread has been an absolute education in internet privacy to me. Shit I never knew before reading this thread:
Your IP address relates to your internet provider not individual computer. I thought the latter cos when you ring IT up they get you to read the IP address of the computer that's broken
Your IP is broadcast when you post

Stuff I still don't know:
Can a techy person trace an IP to an area or road (like a postcode?)
Can a website your on (say works homepage) know which website you've come from or go to next?

Honestly I haven't a fucking clue about this stuff. I know people on here talk like everyone can or should or does know this stuff, but I don't and I can't be the only one? It's like a dark art to me

IT dept will ask you for your IP because that's it's address on the company network, not it's public IP. Anyone (doesn't need to be particularly 'techy') can work out your Internet Service Provider and a rough geographical area from your IP. If you're posting from a workplace or institution they can probably identify that as well. Street or door number would be impossible as far as I know.

 

[fishfinger]

I know everyone's meant to know this shit or have done an open university degree in internet security or something. But this thread has been an absolute education in internet privacy to me. Shit I never knew before reading this thread:
Your IP address relates to your internet provider not individual computer. I thought the latter cos when you ring IT up they get you to read the IP address of the computer that's broken
Your IP is broadcast when you post

Stuff I still don't know:
Can a techy person trace an IP to an area or road (like a postcode?)
Can a website your on (say works homepage) know which website you've come from or go to next?

Honestly I haven't a fucking clue about this stuff. I know people on here talk like everyone can or should or does know this stuff, but I don't and I can't be the only one? It's like a dark art to me

Your IP address relates to the address of your router. However. only your ISP knows your actual street address. If someone traces your IP address, then they will only get the details of the ISP.

 

[Nancy_Winks]

IT dept will ask you for your IP because that's it's address on the company network, not it's public IP. Anyone (doesn't need to be particularly 'techy') can work out your Internet Service Provider and a rough geographical area from your IP. If you're posting from a workplace or institution they can probably identify that as well. Street or door number would be impossible as far as I know.

Ah thanks. So how'd you do it then? (Work out the ISP and geographical area?). Don't do mine please as it freaks me out

By geographical area how big are we talking? Like city or area or postcode?

 

[Nancy_Winks]

Your IP address relates to the address of your router. However. only your ISP knows your actual street address. If someone traces your IP address, then they will only get the details of the ISP.

Nope. Foreign language

Edit: Ah, your router is your hub (the wifi box)

 

[fishfinger]

Edit: Ah, your router is your hub (the wifi box)

Yes.

 

[Nancy_Winks]

Yes.

So say you were doing something illegal online from a shared wifi (say a university or costa coffee wifi) on your phone. The police wouldn't be able to prove it was you unless there was evidence on your phone?

 

[Crispy]

So say you were doing something illegal online from a shared wifi (say a university or costa coffee wifi) on your phone. The police wouldn't be able to prove it was you unless there was evidence on your phone?

Correct.
There is also a thing called a MAC address, which *is* unique to every device, but that doesn't get recorded most of the time.

 

[fishfinger]

So say you were doing something illegal online from a shared wifi (say a university or costa coffee wifi) on your phone. The police wouldn't be able to prove it was you unless there was evidence on your phone?

If the university, or coffee shop keep logs of who has used their wifi, then it could be traced to your phone or laptop. But they'd have to suspect you in order to confirm it was your device that was using the connection.

 

[Nancy_Winks]

Correct.
There is also a thing called a MAC address, which *is* unique to every device, but that doesn't get recorded most of the time.

How come everyone just doesn't order there drugs, guns and K9s from costa then?

 

[sim667]

but I'm not surprised it's raised some concerns.

It bothers me because I predominantly post from work, so if I say something that mods don't like, then they could go on to give me employer hassle about it?

Ill have to stop posting from work if thats the case.

 

[Nancy_Winks]

It bothers me because I predominantly post from work, so if I say something that mods don't like, then they could go on to give me employer hassle about it?

Ill have to stop posting from work if thats the case.

Well exactly. You'd be daft NOT to think that.

 

[cesare]

Correct.
There is also a thing called a MAC address, which *is* unique to every device, but that doesn't get recorded most of the time.

Depending on the web analytics tool used it's possible to track quite a bit of individual visitor data eg IP to geo location (as already said) but also carrier such as TalkTalk, referrer such as google, how many visits, pages viewed, amount of time spent on each page, what platform/OS, which browser, etc

 

[Belushi]

It bothers me because I predominantly post from work, so if I say something that mods don't like, then they could go on to give me employer hassle about it?

Ill have to stop posting from work if thats the case.

Well that's never happened on urban and the Editors assured everyone that it's not going to start happening; saying that it's always worth bearing in mind that nothing you say or do on the net is ever completely private.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Well that's never happened on urban and the Editors assured everyone that it's not going to start happening; saying that it's always worth bearing in mind that nothing you say or do on the net is ever completely private.

Exactly this. I think people who post from work (me included) are far more likely to get into hot water because what they do is being monitored by their IT Dept than from the U75 mods.

 

[Enviro]

Exactly this. I think people who post from work (me included) are far more likely to get into hot water because what they do is being monitored by their IT Dept than from the U75 mods.

I think the general gist of the thread is that you NEVER have to worry about having your U75 information/ posts passed on by mods except in exceptional circumstances where someone's safety may be in danger.

 

[Dexter Deadwood]

I think the general gist of the thread is that you NEVER have to worry about having your U75 information/ posts passed on by mods except in exceptional circumstances where someone's safety may be in danger.

Yes, but most of us had taken that as a given, except those that are uncomfortable in defending social housing because they have a vested interest in promoting gentrification.

 

[killer b]

should they not be able to take it as given too?

 

[butchersapron]

should they not be able to take it as given too?

They should and they can - but if they're not then that's their call if they choose to do so with no evidence supporting the taking of that position.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

should they not be able to take it as given too?

Quite clearly they should whilst on Urban75, yes.

 

[killer b]

OK. But if anyone should choose to comment on the editor's blog, they should do so in the knowledge that their employer may be contacted if they piss him off?

It just seems a particularly dodgy line to be crossing - and I'm not sure what it accomplishes to cross it, other than a brawl on here (and it isn't just the 'usual suspects' rocking up, although it is a bit of a gift to them).

 

[spanglechick]

I believe editor won't do the same here, because he's not, ime, a liar, and the passion with which he's defending his position suggests that he sees a clear difference between what may befall posters here and posters on Brixton buzz.

But I wonder if posters to Brixton Buzz had any cause to suspect a difference in privacy? I have little enough time these days to comment here, but this thread has taught me that should I be inspired to comment on BB in future, I probably won't. Not because I agree with this landlord-type - who is clearly a twat - but because I don't always agree with ppl.

Sometimes I'm quite shocked and upset by the opinions of people I thought I knew. It's highly, highly unlikely but if there's any chance that I'll be reported to my employers for an unpopular opinion, it's safer to avoid that site altogether.

If I comment on an article on Huffpost, say, even quite stridently in opposition to the article, I do so trusting that unless I am breaking the law, the site admins will not try to impact on my real life. Have I been naive? Or am I missing why this is different?

 

[sim667]

Well that's never happened on urban and the Editors assured everyone that it's not going to start happening; saying that it's always worth bearing in mind that nothing you say or do on the net is ever completely private.

Exactly this. I think people who post from work (me included) are far more likely to get into hot water because what they do is being monitored by their IT Dept than from the U75 mods.

Its worth baring in mind considering how heated some of the discussion gets. Its only the mods who have access to the IP records right?

I know its because of the principle of the comment in the first place, and by and large most regular users aren't going to make comments like that, but its not something I want to see start happening.

 

[sim667]

I believe editor won't do the same here, because he's not, ime, a liar, and the passion with which he's defending his position suggests that he sees a clear difference between what may befall posters here and posters on Brixton buzz.

TBH I've met ed in person for maybe 20 mins, and we didn't chat beyond saying hello..... So I don't have that experience of anyone really on the boards..... All the people I've met off the boards have been great though, so I tend to assume most people are the same.

I'm not trying to have dig at anyone by the way, I just feel a bit uncomfortable with the precedent..... It might be covered in the t&c's of signing up for an account, and I've missed it, but I've never heard of that being done on teh urbanz, unless its been a dangerous situtation or something illegal..... Due to that I've always pretty much complicitly trusted the mods here, and will continue to do so.

I take it there's no way other users can work out IP's for posts? There's a few here that I've rubbed up the wrong way a little bit here, and I hate to think they could be a total cunt to me just for the sake of it.

What is brixtonbuzz? Just a local brixton discussion thang?

 

[elmpp]

A little bit of humility here would repair some of the sentiment I think people are feeling about this.

Something along the lines of "shucks, in retrospect, perhaps i shouldn't have contacted the commenters place of work. I still think his views are abhorrent though".

It's the fact this is never forthcoming and we get posts like #277.