Brixton is a village and local businesses need to ensure they are engaged with the local community.

[Lee Japser]

Lee, can you read this: http://www.institute-of-fundraising...-practice-charities-working-with-business.pdf and then consider what you're doing in light of what it recommends?

Your practices may seem fine to you, but you and Splash aren't operating in isolation.

Through your approach of 'naming and shaming' you're in danger of permanently damaging the perception of Brixton businesses to get involved in any business / corporate support to charitable projects in the local community. That may mean that they won't engage with a more effective charity currently working in the area.

Your attempt to 'promote a debate' comes across to me as just headline grabbing and based solely on your need to make money for BS. It doesn't take into consideration the fact that there are many other organisations whose reputation might be damaged by your bull in a china shop tactics.

Incidentally, can you tell me what the legal objects of BS are, as written on your Memorandum and Articles of Association?
many thanks
snowy

Thanks for information which we will look at. We will publish the our aims etc on our web site. I cant see how a debate about these issues can be described as headline grabbing but there you are. The planned debate is not about Splash in particular, its about community engagement in general.

 

[asami]

I have been called a japser. It is very racist term. I did not know it was also a family name.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

The debate on all these issues will take place and you should come along. As for the descent into personal insults Ill choose to ignore these as will most.

you came here to a debate board to spam us without permission debate now stop running away from the issues raised... rather than putting them off to an environment you can control that's not what this place is for...

I don't think there's been a descent in to personal slanging as yet... other than to say you're making a pigs ear from a PR pov which isn't a personal attack but a clear and obvious observation. but again who are you to tell others how they may react to your tactics... when were you given the monopoly on others emotions...

 

[Lee Japser]

If my personal and political agenda is clear can you please spell it out for everyone?

And, if business support is so strong, why do you feel the need to start a debate?

The public debate is going to be had and you should come along if you have things to contribute. The deeply personal nature of your comments speak volumes. Maybe you would like to articulate them at in a public setting as part of the debate given your strength of feeling we would be happy to accommodate.

 

[Lee Japser]

you came here to a debate board to spam us without permission debate now stop running away from the issues raised... rather than putting them off to an environment you can control that's not what this place is for...

I don't think there's been a descent in to personal slanging as yet... other than to say you're making a pigs ear from a PR pov which isn't a personal attack but a clear and obvious observation. but again who are you to tell others how they may react to your tactics... when were you given the monopoly on others emotions...

Really ? Not personal I disgree. Comments on tactics are fine by me but some of the statements have been outrageous. In any event the public debates will take place and you should come along.

 

[snowy_again]

Thanks for information which we will look at. We will publish the our aims etc on our web site. I cant see how a debate about these issues can be described as headline grabbing but there you are. The planned debate is not about Splash in particular, its about community engagement in general.

Thanks Lee, I suggest you pay particular attention to the areas marked in red which are the legal requirements involved. Ignoring them, would put you and your fellow directors at risk of legal action.

Secondly, I'm not asking for an explanation of the BS 'aims', I'm asking for the exact wording on your legal document. If you're taking grants from LCF, then I'm sure someone's got the M&A to hand. You also don't seem to update the website too often, so do you want to tell us a date by which you will:

a) provide details of the broadened aims of BS
b) provide the legal objects of the organisation (so other businesses can have a clearer idea of what you are legally allowed to do)
c) tell us when you'll correct the history of the inception / development of BS and those involved.

Any comment on the knock on implications for other charities working with local businesses? Bluntly put, IMO you're in danger of pissing on other people's chips.

 

[gabi]

What is there to debate? What sound systems are playing? How much red-stripe will cost?

It's a one-day street party. Nothing more nothing less. A chance to get smashed and see old friends.

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

Really ? Not personal I disgree. Comments on tactics are fine by me but some of the statements have been outrageous. In any event the public debates will take place and you should come along.

nope we don't do insinuation on this board quotes and references citing them not vague nondescript no detail claims...

what exactly are you contributing to this community board other than spamming it by the way should we name and shame you as trying to use the popularity and press attention this place receives to further your orgs aims? why did you feel it's perfectly ok to come here and break the posting FAQ's without first even having the dignity to approach the sites owner or it's community... again who are you to wander in and dictate terms to us? and who are you to attempt to hijack the popularity of this site for your own ends?

stop wriggling and address the issues which are being put to you you came to us we didn't come to you, you attempted to use the site and it's contributors for your own promotional purposes you can't get upset if the sites regulars then get a bit miffed at your manner of doing this...

stop telling me to turn up to your event and address these issues now, spammer...

 

[Lee Japser]

Thanks Lee, I suggest you pay particular attention to the areas marked in red which are the legal requirements involved. Ignoring them, would put you and your fellow directors at risk of legal action.

Secondly, I'm not asking for an explanation of the BS 'aims', I'm asking for the exact wording on your legal document. If you're taking grants from LCF, then I'm sure someone's got the M&A to hand.

Any comment on the knock on implications for other charities working with local businesses? Bluntly put, IMO you're in danger of pissing on other people's chips.

Yes we will do so. In relation to M&A yes we will put them up as soon as. As for the knock on effect it will be interesting to see to what extent there is broad engagement with community groups. The anecdotal feedback I get from community groups is this is minimal for all sorts of reasons so the debates will be an opportunity to explore further.

 

[Ted Striker]

Really ? Not personal I disgree. Comments on tactics are fine by me but some of the statements have been outrageous.

Like the accusations of racism?

 

[Lee Japser]

nope we don't do insinuation on this board quotes and references citing them not vague nondescript no detail claims...

what exactly are you contributing to this community board other than spamming it by the way should we name and shame you as trying to use the popularity and press attention this place receives to further your orgs aims? why did you feel it's perfectly ok to come here and break the posting FAQ's without first even having the dignity to approach the sites owner or it's community... again who are you to wander in and dictate terms to us? and who are you to attempt to hijack the popularity of this site for your own ends?

stop wriggling and address the issues which are being put to you you came to us we didn't come to you, you attempted to use the site and it's contributors for your own promotional purposes you can't get upset if the sites regulars then get a bit miffed at your manner of doing this...

stop telling me to turn up to your event and address these issues now, spammer...

Thats another question for another day. I have been as response as I can. If you don't want to attend the debate than thats up to you we will produce a report that will no doubt prompt further discussion.

 

[Rushy]

The public debate is going to be had and you should come along if you have things to contribute. The deeply personal nature of your comments speak volumes. Maybe you would like to articulate them at in a public setting as part of the debate given your strength of feeling we would be happy to accommodate.

You have made it personal to the extent that even your own board directors are posting on here distancing themselves personally from your 'controversial approach'. You have made it about "The Man" but you still can't see it!

I would be happy to attend a debate in which you also participated but not one initiated or chaired by you (or Splash, whilst you are chair). You know how to find me if such a debate comes about.

 

[snowy_again]

Yes we will do so. In relation to M&A yes we will put them up as soon as.

Go on Lee, give us an exact date by which its done. Or is that me trying to coerce you?

 

[The Octagon]

Real people and the internet shouldn't mix

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

Thats another question for another day. I have been as response as I can. If you don't want to attend the debate than thats up to you we will produce a report that will no doubt prompt further discussion.

no it's a question of why you came to the board and spammed our community...

do you think you can just foist your concept of what should happen on other regardless of their wishes?

this isn't looking hopeful for any kind of debate if you're not capable or willing to debate them now is it?

so try again and this time try doing the one thing you've entirely failed to do with this performance so far and engage and respond...

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

Real people and the internet shouldn't mix

he should expect us...

 

[Puddy_Tat]

I'm something of an outsider here, but as someone who has been involved in voluntary organisations and has worked for small businesses

a) not getting involved with one particular non-profit organisation on the strength of one mailshot does not necessarily mean that a business is failing "to ensure it is engaging with the community"

b) most businesses can not afford to say yes to every single charity / community organisation that asks for money / help in kind

c) engagement is a two-way street. If said non-profit organisation's reaction to not getting a response to the single mailshot is to start "naming and shaming" then it's not really going to encourage any chance of engagement in the future.

 

[Rushy]

Go on Lee, give us an exact date by which its done. Or is that me trying to coerce you?

You're being unfair. I don't think you appreciate how much a small operation like theirs has to deal with on a daily basis with limited resources, budgetary constraints and other priorities.

Give them a day or two before you start naming, shaming and calling for a debate.

 

[Gramsci]

Rushy your is a distinctly personal and political agenda and thats obvious form your comments, Point of information we are still getting offers of support from local traders. The Board of Brixton Splash is united in our joint commitment to tackle the issues raised. We will continue to do so with or without your specific support. There are many other organisations working in this field you can choose to support and we would certainly encourage you work with them.

According to the post by Jo #252 naming and shaming is a "controversial step and on a personal level from a PR background probebaly not one I would have taken".

I take your point about getting support from some traders. In light of Jo- a Director of BS- comment will you now not "name and shame" those business that do not give a contribution after the event? But only name those who have contributed.

Also can you clarify if the "naming and shaming" of traders was discussed and agreed by the Board of BS?

Jo says she is a Director of BS. Was she told about the "naming and shaming" of traders? Was she told that you would be writing a piece on your Blog and on Brixton Blog?

 

[Lee Japser]

I have named a small number of local businesses that chose not to support Brixton Splash this year. This was not meant as a criticism and listening to feedback and general concerns we will not now be publishing a list of these business.

I understand that many small businesses and medium sized businesses have many competing demands on their resources. Brixton has some great businesses all at the heart of the community. This has become more evident as a consequence of recent debate. To those businesses who have chosen not to support Brixton Splash, we would hope that they would consider supporting the sponsoring of other local events and organisations that deal with the mentoring young people seeking to get into employment and or considering starting their own business through the many such programmes working in central Brixton.
Small businesses are a ital part of the local community and can stimulate growth and opportunities, and we urge everyone to support local traders as much as possible – especially, but not only, those who sponsor the Splash.

How to encourage and support local business are engagement in supporting local community initiatives remains an issue that we intend to return to later in the year. Thank you and do come and enjoy this years Splash.

 

[editor]

I have named a small number of local businesses that chose not to support Brixton Splash this year. This was not meant as a criticism and listening to feedback and general concerns we will not now be publishing a list of these business.

That's definitely a positive step.

 

[colacubes]

I have named a small number of local businesses that chose not to support Brixton Splash this year. This was not meant as a criticism and listening to feedback and general concerns we will not now be publishing a list of these business.

I understand that many small businesses and medium sized businesses have many competing demands on their resources. Brixton has some great businesses all at the heart of the community. This has become more evident as a consequence of recent debate. To those businesses who have chosen not to support Brixton Splash, we would hope that they would consider supporting the sponsoring of other local events and organisations that deal with the mentoring young people seeking to get into employment and or considering starting their own business through the many such programmes working in central Brixton.
Small businesses are a ital part of the local community and can stimulate growth and opportunities, and we urge everyone to support local traders as much as possible – especially, but not only, those who sponsor the Splash.

How to encourage and support local business are engagement in supporting local community initiatives remains an issue that we intend to return to later in the year. Thank you and do come and enjoy this years Splash.

Glad you're not going to publish the list I really think you'll get more engagement and support for the future by not doing so.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

I fear this debate is less a real debate but more a publicity event in disguise.

no matter what happens at the event large turn out can be claimed as a success.


there is no way of telling at this point but the lack of ansers now and a continual push for the event does raise alarm bells

apologies if this fear is misplaced. it's just you never can tell with a lot of these things

 

[Rushy]

Edited due to crossed posts:

Well done Lee for recognising the error of your ways - even if you have a strange way of admitting it.

Brixton Blog article complete with references to this thread here: http://www.brixtonblog.com/businesses-hit-back-in-brixton-splash-row/5897

 

[Gramsci]

The public debate is going to be had and you should come along if you have things to contribute. The deeply personal nature of your comments speak volumes. Maybe you would like to articulate them at in a public setting as part of the debate given your strength of feeling we would be happy to accommodate.

Thing is Lee social networks are getting more and more used. See the Arab Spring etc. I see you use Blogs ,Twitter and this site to promote your views. Fair enough. Rushy is entitled to express his forthright opinions here without being told to do it in a "public setting..we would be happy to accomodate". Which comes across to me as somewhat intimidating comment. His comments here are just as valid here as done face to face. This is the new world of social network that you use to its full extent. So I think Rushy is entitled to use it as well.

And I am saying this as someone who has not always seen eye to eye with Rushy on other issues on Urban

 

[Rushy]

Thing is Lee social networks are getting more and more used. See the Arab Spring etc. I see you use Blogs ,Twitter and this site to promote your views. Fair enough. Rushy is entitled to express his forthright opinions here without being told to do it in a "public setting..we would be happy to accomodate". Which comes across to me as somewhat intimidating comment. His comments here are just as valid here as done face to face. This is the new world of social network that you use to its full extent. So I think Rushy is entitled to use it as well.

And I am saying this as someone who has not always seen eye to eye with Rushy on other issues on Urban

I almost shed a tear, Gramsci! [** sniff**]

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

I fear this debate is less a real debate but more a publicity event in disguise.

no matter what happens at the event large turn out can be claimed as a success.

there is no way of telling at this point but the lack of answers now and a continual push for the event does raise alarm bells

apologies if this fear is misplaced. it's just you never can tell with a lot of these things

are you suggesting that a firebrand might come here start a flame war to encourage people to traipse off to their traffic untroubled site in the hopes it will drum up interest in the glowing rave underpants which they're selling... never.

Surely we should have a rule against that kind of thing... some where when people sign up so they're aware of it before they can post sort of thing... make em agree in some kind of terms or conditions...

 

[snowy_again]

Where does one buy such undergarments?

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

Where does one buy such undergarments?

we will never know there's rules against us being told...

 

[claphamboy]

I have named a small number of local businesses that chose not to support Brixton Splash this year. This was not meant as a criticism and listening to feedback and general concerns we will not now be publishing a list of these business.

At last, shame it took so long for you to wake-up to your mistake.