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Wrongful Arrest

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diddums

Member
so i was on the 133 bus going up Brixton hill tonight around 7.30pm and they stopped the bus and came on looking for a black guy in a green jacket because allegedly there had been a robbery somewhere and the robber got onto a bus.
I'm just thinking that if i had been wearing a green jacket then i would probably have been taken off the bus for a private chat and/or arrested just because i am black and wearing a green jacket.
What are my rights in this situation ?
Replies appreciated only from people who don't believe that this is a sensible way for police to act
 
That's a tricky one. If you substituted 'murder' for 'robbery', a lot of people would think that they ought to follow the lead.

As long as they follow such leads bearing in mind that a) their information might well be wrong, and b) their information is not sufficient for them to arrest anyone without further evidence, from their point of view, I would think that it's not necessarily an unreasonable thing to stop a bus if they think someone's got on it. Problem as ever is not so much this, but the way the police act, which often involves forgetting a), or it not even occurring to them.

That said, being taken off the bus and questioned - you have no right to stop that, and no redress really. Being arrested - they would need to show grounds for arrest. Being black and wearing a green jacket would not be sufficient grounds for arrest. If I were arrested on such grounds, I would certainly consider it wrongful arrest.
 
diddums said:
Replies appreciated only from people who don't believe that this is a sensible way for police to act
Click to expand...
What is a sensible way for police to act when they have information a black man in a green jacket got on a bus going up Brixton Hill after committing a robbery?

And also maybe imagine the pov of the person who's been robbed.
 
why on earth is it ok for me to be taken off a bus and be questioned ? I didn't get on the bus for fun i had somewhere to go to which wasn't to a police station or police van to be questioned about a crime i didn't commit. If it was murder 'id be even more upset that i was being accused of such a crime just because i was wearing a green jacket and black .
 
tbf, you'd be searched as well as questioned. I didn't say it was ok. I said that you would have no redress. The police can stop and search anyone they suspect of a crime, and if they say you 'match the description' of someone reported of a crime, that's sufficient grounds. It's happened to me and it's not pleasant. It's also not the end of the world. What would, and should imo always, be wrong would be to be stopped purely on the basis that you match the racial description of the reported person, especially somewhere like London, but such things can be used by racist coppers anywhere.
 
diddums said:
why on earth is it ok for me to be taken off a bus and be questioned ? I didn't get on the bus for fun i had somewhere to go to which wasn't to a police station or police van to be questioned about a crime i didn't commit.
Click to expand...
Sounds like a terrible inconvenience for you. I'll try again:
What is a sensible way for police to act when they have information a black man in a green jacket got on a bus going up Brixton Hill after committing a robbery?
Click to expand...
 
great idea "london_calling", if the description was a black guy in a dark jacket you are suggesting its ok for them to round up all 15 or so black guys with dark jackets on the bus and take them to a station for questioning ??? If i'm the only person on this forum that things that this is poor practice then i'm not going to engage with this forum any more.
As i said im only interested in comments from people who agree that this is stupid and can answer my question . If you cant then dont post !
 
diddums said:
why on earth is it ok for me to be taken off a bus and be questioned ? I didn't get on the bus for fun i had somewhere to go to which wasn't to a police station or police van to be questioned about a crime i didn't commit. If it was murder 'id be even more upset that i was being accused of such a crime just because i was wearing a green jacket and black .
Click to expand...
but you weren't.
 
this is a pisspoor thread because unless diddums has something else to tell us there was neither stopping and searching, nor questioning and most definitely not a wrongful arrest (at least, not the wrongful arrest of diddums).
 
diddums said:
If i'm the only person on this forum that things that this is poor practice then i'm not going to engage with this forum any more.
As i said im only interested in comments from people who agree that this is stupid and can answer my question . If you cant then dont post !
Click to expand...

You're taking the piss aren't you?
 
diddums said:
great idea "london_calling", if the description was a black guy in a dark jacket you are suggesting its ok for them to round up all 15 or so black guys with dark jackets on the bus and take them to a station for questioning ???
Click to expand...
He hasn't suggested that.
 
diddums said:
so i was on the 133 bus going up Brixton hill tonight around 7.30pm and they stopped the bus and came on looking for a black guy in a green jacket because allegedly there had been a robbery somewhere and the robber got onto a bus.
Click to expand...
If the police intelligence was that a black guy in a green jacket had got on your bus and you fitted that exact description, then what would you expect them to do? It's all down to the amount of intelligence they got and the seriousness of the crime. If they hadn't acted when they found someone fitting the description, they'd face accusations of not being interested in helping victims in Brixton.

Don't get me wrong: I fucking hate being hassled by the cops, but so long as they were polite and gave you a reason why they were talking to you (which, to be fair, is more than they've done with me on several occasions) then maybe you've just got to accept it, annoying though it is.
 
editor said:
If the police intelligence was that a black guy in a green jacket had got on your bus and you fitted that exact description, then what would you expect them to do? It's all down to the amount of intelligence they got and the seriousness of the crime. If they hadn't acted when they found someone fitting the description, they'd face accusations of not being interested in helping victims around Brixton.

Don't get me wrong: I fucking hate being hassled by the cops, but so long as they were polite and gave you a reason why they were talking to you (which, to be fair, is more than they've done with me on several occasions) then maybe you've just got to accept it, annoying though it is.
Click to expand...
but there's no indication they DID talk to him, he's just got the hump
 
This has happened to my partner, except he was dragged off the bus. There's not a lot you can do if they are legitimately looking for someone who fits your description, but this does often seem to be a remarkably convenient excuse for harrassing someone. Ask for a receipt recording the incident, including the stated reason for stopping you. Follow it up at your local copshop.
 
diddums said:
If i'm the only person on this forum that things that this is poor practice then i'm not going to engage with this forum any more.
As i said im only interested in comments from people who agree that this is stupid and can answer my question . If you cant then dont post !
Click to expand...

Well fuck-off then.
 
ymu said:
This has happened to my partner, except he was dragged off the bus. There's not a lot you can do if they are legitimately looking for someone who fits your description, but this does often seem to be a remarkably convenient excuse for harrassing someone. Ask for a receipt recording the incident, including the stated reason for stopping you. Follow it up at your local copshop.
Click to expand...
They do have to give a receipt now, which they never used to. tbh there's no chance ever of redress just for being stopped, unless you keep receipts of a series of stops that equal harassment. Outside London, that might conceivably be an issue.

Truth is, they make up excuses for stopping you after they've stopped you half the time. This happened to me. "Oi, black/crusty person, what are you doing here?" is the real reason.

In the scheme of things, though, the case outlined in the op doesn't seem like an egregious case of copper cuntiness.
 
If it happens to you a lot, it becomes quite a big deal. And yes, the point of keeping receipts is to show that harrassment is taking place. There's been a few cases recently based on just that. Which is why the coalition is dismantling the system of receipts currently in place.

The fact that sometimes these stops are justified does not mean that they are not misused, nor that it isn't a problem for those who are inappropriately targeted.

Take the case of Ken Hinds, who won a judgment against the British Transport police last year after being arrested for observing a youth getting arrested. It later emerged that, despite his work with police to tackle gang violence and monitor stop-and-search, Hinds had been stopped over 100 times in the last 20 years. If name data is dropped from the forms, it would be impossible to verify experiences like this.

The recording of stop-and-account was introduced in 2005 because of community concerns about the abuse of police powers that emerged during the Stephen Lawrence inquiry. These concerns have not gone away. Only last year, the Equalities and Human Rights Commission found black people were six times more likely and Asian people twice as likely to be stopped and searched as white people. Evidence that the plans are wrong may come from the police themselves. Several forces, including the Metropolitan police – the biggest user of stop-and-search – have decided to keep using the full stop-search form and to hold a public consultation on its recording. This decision recognises the importance of community scrutiny and the operational value of stop data.

With only about one in 10 stop-searches ending in arrest, ensuring fewer, more effective, interventions would be one more efficient option. Detailed data is crucial to this end because it provides the basis for rigorous oversight and scrutiny.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/feb/01/police-stop-search-data-equality
Click to expand...
 
Of course. I thought I had said that. I was kind of replying to the op, who, if not a troll, is certainly not someone who is used to this kind of thing. Someone who's been systematically harassed by the police doesn't talk like the op talked, tbh.
 
spring-peeper said:
I can't believe people actually posted on this thing.

I thought the policy was not to feed the trolls.......
Click to expand...


People just can't help themselves.
I include my self in that.
:rolleyes: at us all :)
 
The person who this happened to refused to get off the bus to go have "a friendly chat" as the policemen suggested.i support him with . I don't know what happened next as i left the bus and got on another. From what i am reading above you basically have no rights apart from getting a receipt . What are you supposed to do with such a receipt ? I have had these receipt things before after being searched at tube stations (usually on way to work) and built up a nice collection before we moved offices. I think that such harassment profile based on someones skin and jacket colour is ridiculous. Why on earth should i waste my time helping police with enquiries if this is the best that 21st century detective work can produce. I read on another more useful website that only about 20% of people arrested are actually charged. I cant help but wonder if most of the posters above would feel so supportive or that its just a minor inconvenience after spending the night in a police cell after you had explained to the police bus raiders that it couldn't possibly have been you
 
Targeting people based on the description of a suspect is indeed awful. At the very least the Racist Police Bus Raiders should have detained an equal number of black and white men wearing different coloured jackets. And some women too. You should file a complaint.
 
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