what happened to all the 90s political scenes?

[xslavearcx]

When i first got into politics it seemed inextricably linked to being into a particular music scene or what not. Like for instance, there was the anti-criminal justice act thing which seemed to co-incide the concerns of ravers, road protesters and lots of other groups.

It seemed that 'lifestylism' was a bigger part of politics and that there were thriving drop out subcultures going on.

For me, its all kinda like a haze of crusties, hunt sabs, ravers, ALF types, environmentalists, and all sorts. There was a big aspect of direct action too.

Looking back on it, i think analytically it sucked, and perhaps had something to do with the collapse of the tradional left, maybe in the post soviet union end of history era single issue type things was where a lot of political opposition was articulated.But at the same time, anecdotally, it seemed that there was a lot of passion in circulation and that people were really up for taking big risks of their own personal lifes for the sake of some political goal.

That kinda scene seems to have died a death. On another thread the question came up as to why the shift from that kinda situation to this kind we have now, and it was suggested to start a thread on that. SO here it is. Thoughts?

 

[stuff_it]

Just going to repeat my post from the other thread:

IMHO there was a lot of youthful energy in the 90s that isn't around on the scene these days. Yes you still get the usual crown and a fair few people, but generally I think many people are much less politically inclined than they used to be and many of the more 'normal' people that would have also got involved back in the 90s are staying away. Whether this is due to genuine lack of interest, lack of funds or other side effects of the current economic and political climate I'm not sure. Probably a bit of both.​

 

[chilango]

I've got lots to say about this. But it'll have to wait till tomorrow.

In he meantime have a read of this: http://libcom.org/library/kill-chill-aufheben-4

 

[xslavearcx]

article looks interesting. and long. looking forward to hearing your thoughts on this!

 

[stuff_it]

I have to say I think the rave end of the movement has been adversely affected by the huge number of musical genres, which has split up that end of the scene into tribes that never meet.

Someone should really go around and re-introduce them all. *cough*

 

[xslavearcx]

yeah same with the hardcore (as in the punk derivative) scene. Now the kids are into all sorts of different -cores. Back in the day one could have a toughguy madball type band playing beside a overtly emo band.

 

[sihhi]

Things that are weaker maybe non-existent as a 'movement' now compared to then:
anti-CJA, anti-fox hunting, anti-live animal exports, anti-animal testing, anti-custody deaths police monitoring, anti-roads, protests and support for Irish republicanism, squatting, using Stonehenge at solstice --

any others?

 

[xslavearcx]

Things that are weaker maybe non-existent as a 'movement' now compared to then:
anti-CJA, anti-fox hunting, anti-live animal exports, anti-animal testing, anti-custody deaths police monitoring, anti-roads, protests and support for Irish republicanism, squatting, using Stonehenge at solstice --

any others?

think that pretty much covers it!

 

[Sweetpea]

I'm joining this thread against my best judgement. I was involved in a lot of stuff in the 1990's which I didn't think was political; just the 'right' thing for me to do at the time. In fact I joined U75 (under a long lost user name) in around 2000 because a fair bit of what I was doing involved Brixton (both because it was my home but also because of the RTS/Cooltan/squat link). However, I became/still am wary of some of the discussions about left ideology that made/makes me feel excluded because I can't define working classness or the difference between a trot and some other thing that never really applied to my life.
I'd love to have a place to discuss some of my experiences without being 'bullied'. I know this is a 'serious' forum but is there any room for anecdotal memories..

 

[xslavearcx]

I'd love to have a place to discuss some of my experiences without being 'bullied'. I know this is a 'serious' forum but is there any room for anecdotal memories..

well im coming at this from an anecdotal angle more than anything else, my first experience in an overtly poltical situation was in the M77 road protest as a teenager.

 

[stuff_it]

I'm joining this thread against my best judgement. I was involved in a lot of stuff in the 1990's which I didn't think was political; just the 'right' thing for me to do at the time. In fact I joined U75 (under a long lost user name) in around 2000 because a fair bit of what I was doing involved Brixton (both because it was my home but also because of the RTS/Cooltan/squat link). However, I became/still am wary of some of the discussions about left ideology that made/makes me feel excluded because I can't define working classness or the difference between a trot and some other thing that never really applied to my life.
I'd love to have a place to discuss some of my experiences without being 'bullied'. I know this is a 'serious' forum but is there any room for anecdotal memories..

TBH I will probably have to keep quiet about some stuff.

 

[Sweetpea]

well im coming at this from an anecdotal angle more than anything else, my first experience in an overtly poltical situation was in the M77 road protest as a teenager.

Brilliant! I didn't know about the M77, yet Claremont Road and the Westway (and Newbury in between) was an important part of my life. I will read up on the M77 or, even better, maybe you can swap tales with me. I read so much about 'oral history' projects but hear very little about these times (maybe my fault). But after Audrey started destroying the Ruskin archive I don't know where to look.

 

[xslavearcx]

TBH I will probably have to keep quiet about some stuff.

yeah i think in the context of all the spying thats going on in the internet i should keep quiet about my comedic three stooges esque attempts at 'direct action' too lol

 

[Sweetpea]

yeah i think in the context of all the spying thats going on in the internet i should keep quiet about my comedic three stooges esque attempts at 'direct action too lol

Do you think they really care anymore? (not sarky, I just feel so out of the loop these days, surely I am a spent force and not worth their attention).

 

[ska invita]

i think we shouldnt play down peoples desire to kick up a fuss in the streets today - we've had student fee actions, motivated by a genuine and desperate hope to overturn a policy, the summer riots triggered by police violence - actions coming together on the big trade union walk to the park - UKUncut - there was a string of stuff around the City since 2008, occupy wasnt an irrelevance .... I think there is some cultural element to it (the illegality of the rave scene, anti-road stuff etc) that provided a strong base, which maybe isnt there as much now, but thats not fatal I dont think.

Speaking for me its more a case of effort-to-outcome - wanting to get involved in something that will really have an effect, not just for a day. Whats the point of repeating something that you know can only achieve so much? I dont think actions like todays are pointless, but I do want a lot more.

I think theres a lot of thinking about new tactics and options going on out there - theres no silver bullet. And like xslavearcx says, elements of the past sucked. Passion is there I think, but I think theres a slight pause here in the UK as people try to work out what next and how best to achieve it. No bad thing.

I know this is a 'serious' forum but is there any room for anecdotal memories..

go for it sweetpea - what is it you want to say?

 

[xslavearcx]

Brilliant! I didn't know about the M77, yet Claremont Road and the Westway (and Newbury in between) was an important part of my life. I will read up on the M77 or, even better, maybe you can swap tales with me. I read so much about 'oral history' projects but hear very little about these times (maybe my fault). But after Audrey started destroying the Ruskin archive I don't know where to look.

tbh, it was more just because it was near where i stayed that i was doing my nosey round there with some friends back in those days. Apparently though it was one of the first sites where 'green' and 'red' first came together. Rosie Kane MSP of SSP came out of the M77 road protests. I did get into the AR scene for a bit when older though...

 

[Sweetpea]

Actually really that's a serious question. We had personal surveillance, not just FIT, the buggers used to sit outside the house, back in the day. When will I be able to 'Reclaim my Past'?

 

[xslavearcx]

Do you think they really care anymore? (not sarky, I just feel so out of the loop these days, surely I am a spent force and not worth their attention).

Don't really know. i remember that GANDALF thing being huge back in those days. i think the attention has definately shifted elsewhere though...

 

[Sweetpea]

See now I'm lost; 'green and red'. We wanted to rave and I wanted my child to be safe in the street. The Criminal Justice Bill brought me into contact with many more ideas than just leaving me the fuck alone could have ever done.

 

[xslavearcx]

Actually really that's a serious question. We had personal surveillance, not just FIT, the buggers used to sit outside the house, back in the day. When will I be able to 'Reclaim my Past'?

well thats one of the things that interests me. I would like to still get into activism sort of stuff. but my background is more in that past rather that say being a member of the SWP or something. so it does kinda prompt the question as to the relationship between that particular scene and being in the left now. I think ska has indentifed some similiarities between then and now in their post there.

 

[xslavearcx]

I think there is some cultural element to it (the illegality of the rave scene, anti-road stuff etc) that provided a strong base, which maybe isnt there as much now, but thats not fatal I dont think.

its actually the cultural element im particularly interested in but tbh, might more be to do with nostalgia rather than any particular political insight id be wanting to derive from it.

 

[xslavearcx]

See now I'm lost; 'green and red'. We wanted to rave and I wanted my child to be safe in the street. The Criminal Justice Bill brought me into contact with many more ideas than just leaving me the fuck alone could have ever done.

maybe the fact taht it was 'issue based' rather than tied to a particular ideological framework meant that people were more likely to participate in such things rather than the usual suspects of lefties?

 

[Sweetpea]

See now I'm lost; 'green and red'. We wanted to rave and I wanted my child to be safe in the street. The Criminal Justice Bill brought me into contact with many more ideas than just leaving me the fuck alone could have ever done.

 

[Sweetpea]

oops sorry for the double post and delays. The dongle isn't always great. I live 'on the road' now, I had to give up the horsebox (nod to stuff it)

 

[twentythreedom]

Kill the Bill

 

[stuff_it]

Do you think they really care anymore? (not sarky, I just feel so out of the loop these days, surely I am a spent force and not worth their attention).

I really do wonder. There was a lot of police attention back in the day - probably partially down to the lull in international terrorism with the decline in IRA attacks. Well a lull compared to how it is now anyway.

 

[stuff_it]

Kill the Bill

I remember it well. I <post hidden> and then <post hidden> but the best bit was when <post hidden>.

 

[twentythreedom]

I remember it well. I <post hidden> and then <post hidden> but the best bit was when <post hidden>.

exactly

 

[Sweetpea]

I really do wonder. There was a lot of police attention back in the day - probably partially down to the lull in international terrorism with the decline in IRA attacks. Well a lull compared to how it is now anyway.

yep, I must say it did feel like a fuss about nothing, knickers in a twist over a couple of people enjoying the sun coming up. Over the years I've found out about a lot of other stuff: anarchism, how shareholders in road building companies were linked to the government. Seems naive now but like I said we just wanted to dance and be left alone.

 

[xslavearcx]

if only this thread was done in a zine format rather than internet it would be much better.