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Trial begins for Oskar Groning the 'book keeper' of Auschwitz

I expected the trial to take longer than a couple of months, still glad he has been found guilty but a bit surprised at the shortness of the sentence. I suppose given he is in his 90s it is unlikely he will be released but all the same, 4 years for involvement in such a crime seems on the low side.

I wonder if this will be the last of these trials?
 
Yes, i feel that way.
why? to me still prosecuting auld men for things which happened 70 years ago feels to me more like defeat than victory. all the senior people are long dead, all the officers are long dead, you're now getting people who were in many cases peripheral to the entire process in their own culpability. yes, they were there, yes, what they did deserved punishment: but it seems to me little's gained by making them die in prison after so long. i think the game's no longer worth the candle as the prizes are all dross.
 
why? to me still prosecuting auld men for things which happened 70 years ago feels to me more like defeat than victory. all the senior people are long dead, all the officers are long dead, you're now getting people who were in many cases peripheral to the entire process in their own culpability. yes, they were there, yes, what they did deserved punishment: but it seems to me little's gained by making them die in prison after so long. i think the game's no longer worth the candle as the prizes are all dross.

thats a good point, a lot of the scum who were in charge of it all died after long happy lives.
 
thats a good point, the scum who were in charge of it all died after long happy lives.
i don't think they all had long and happy lives but they were the people whose punishment would really resonate. sending some minor functionary to prison 70 years after the end of the war doesn't to me seem to send the message "we really don't approve of this sort of thing" but more "every now and then we can send down a minor cog, having let so many of the movers and shakers evade us"
 
why? to me still prosecuting auld men for things which happened 70 years ago feels to me more like defeat than victory. all the senior people are long dead, all the officers are long dead, you're now getting people who were in many cases peripheral to the entire process in their own culpability. yes, they were there, yes, what they did deserved punishment: but it seems to me little's gained by making them die in prison after so long. i think the game's no longer worth the candle as the prizes are all dross.
I agree mate, I just like the idea of nazis getting punished.
 
why? to me still prosecuting auld men for things which happened 70 years ago feels to me more like defeat than victory. all the senior people are long dead, all the officers are long dead, you're now getting people who were in many cases peripheral to the entire process in their own culpability. yes, they were there, yes, what they did deserved punishment: but it seems to me little's gained by making them die in prison after so long. i think the game's no longer worth the candle as the prizes are all dross.


The Germans State took some time to prosecute Nazi war criminals and many sentences were later commuted, etc.
 
The Germans State took some time to prosecute Nazi war criminals and many sentences were later commuted, etc.
shurely "the german states". there were of course the nuremberg trials and a series of subsequent trials in east and west germany, not to mention the zionist entity. while sentences may have been commuted no one i believe is suggesting anyone already tried should be retried. it would be nice to have a point to which to respond tho.
 
The Federal Republic let thousands of war criminals off scot free.
as detailed in the brown book https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braunbuch and highlighted by, among others, the red army faction.

HMS.jpg
 
One of the survivors who testified, Eva Kor, a twin who was subjected to Mengle's experiments was on the news yesterday saying she was disappointed that he had been given a prison sentence and would have preferred that he was mate to go into schools and talk to young people. She spoke about how she had forgiven him but she felt forgiveness was a dirty word in this area. I am pleased he was tried, I am pleased he was found guilty but can't say I have much interest in sending a 94 year old man to prison.
 
Always thought he was quite open about his activities in the World at War tv documentary. An admirable if ego serving thing to do.
 
Without meaning to make light of the camps,but these recent prosecutions are little people,administrators and low level functionaries.they have never had any influence or value to the victors.the schleyer scum mentioned above were instrumental in the running of the party apparatus itself.they has a use after the war ended.bean counters didn't.

Again, this does not lesson what they were involved in.
 

I think wibbling on about the children of nazis have gone on to high powered jobs is a bit off
Without meaning to make light of the camps,but these recent prosecutions are little people,administrators and low level functionaries.they have never had any influence or value to the victors.the schleyer scum mentioned above were instrumental in the running of the party apparatus itself.they has a use after the war ended.bean counters didn't.

Again, this does not lesson what they were involved in.

Well the first plan after a great die off was to turn germany into an agrarian economy which would never be able to threaten europe again after the soviet threat ment that was not on rebuilding germany needed managers and anyone who was any good at their job was a Nazi. Short of opening up the camps for another holocaust no easy way to de nazification germany and leave it in any way functioning.:mad: At least another one faces justice.
 
I think wibbling on about the children of nazis have gone on to high powered jobs is a bit off
That link does no such thing - why pretend that a review/precis of a book that demonstrates the half hearted (or, heavily instrumentalised and politicised) pretence of de-nazification and the continued influential state roles that actual high ranking naizis played in the post-war FRG is 'wibbling on about the children of nazis'? Or did you just not bother to read the link? Or did you read it but just didn't understand it at all?
 
Well the first plan after a great die off was to turn germany into an agrarian economy which would never be able to threaten europe again after the soviet threat ment that was not on rebuilding germany needed managers and anyone who was any good at their job was a Nazi. Short of opening up the camps for another holocaust no easy way to de nazification germany and leave it in any way functioning.:mad: At least another one faces justice.

Whose first plan?
 
That link does no such thing - why pretend that a review/precis of a book that demonstrates the half hearted (or, heavily instrumentalised and politicised) pretence of de-nazification and the continued influential state roles that actual high ranking naizis played in the post-war FRG is 'wibbling on about the children of nazis'? Or did you just not bother to read the link? Or did you read it but just didn't understand it at all?

Fifty years after publication of the Brown Book, the upper ranks of today’s military and members of the political establishment are still dominated by a caste whose ancestors were deeply involved in the worst crimes known to humanity. These forces are intent on following in the footsteps of their forebears. really?
 
Fifty years after publication of the Brown Book, the upper ranks of today’s military and members of the political establishment are still dominated by a caste whose ancestors were deeply involved in the worst crimes known to humanity. These forces are intent on following in the footsteps of their forebears. really?
Yes, really. Well done on skipping to the last para and not bothering with the rest though. Good job.
 
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