The Fall - new series on BBC2

[JimW]

Theres is a lot of good stuff in this - its smart, interesting and Scully is great. Interesting feminist subtext around objectification as well. My original moans about hollyoaks look-a-likes and lack of belfast-ness still stand though - and the killer doesn't look 'normal' - he looks (and acts) like a male model.

On the Belfast thing - thought there were some elements that could only happen there - armed police (as standard I mean) so that's a few plot points without getting spoilerish; the "neighbourhood watch" types when our man goes to visit the battered wife; her husband's threats seeming pretty credible etc. Not that I actually have any experience of Ulster bar second hand through family.

 

[renegadechicken]

I turn my brain off and just enjoy, we watched the first three in one hit and are now having a break to watch two more in a row. I am enjoyiung it, but too many ex hollyoakers in it, and killing women has been done to death...why not kill milkmen or summat?

 

[spanglechick]

this is a drama about womanhood, in a lot of ways. the wife, the daughter, the victims, the forensic pathologist, the uniformed policwoman, the prostitutes, the sexually precocious teen, the battered wife, and of course, gillian anderson's character. his attitudes to women, the police's attitudes, the maternity ward... i think in that context, female victims are justified.

 

[felixthecat]

I'm really enjoying this. Good writing, strong characters, well cast.

I can't understand why anyone doesn't like the wife - what a weird comment about her being perfect . Just a working mum doing a difficult job with a husband who's not a lot of help. And I think yer man is a great killer - I hate it when potentially good dramas are spoilt by a murderer who looks like a stereotypical homicidal maniac.

I'm quite glad I've never seen Hollyoaks - would be sad to have this excellent drama series tainted because of it.

 

[trashpony]

Can anyone explain what the point of interspersing GA shagging that other copper with the murderer murdering? I really didn't like that.

His wife saying 'would you like to wash and dress [the baby] and then take some photos' was v creepy

 

[Shirl]

His wife saying 'would you like to wash and dress [the baby] and then take some photos' was v creepy

That's what happens though in that situation.

 

[spanglechick]

i think it was a deliberate echo of what he does, perhaps to shed some light on his motivations?

 

[Shirl]

i think it was a deliberate echo of what he does, perhaps to shed some light on his motivations?

I am too dim to have noticed that

 

[8115]

i think it was a deliberate echo of what he does, perhaps to shed some light on his motivations?

It's a motif. The whole death/ purification thing. I think him saying the hair belonged to his mother, he likes to wash it will turn out to be significant.

It's ok. Gillian Anderson is good, and I like the whole, good looking killer with a caring job. But there's something missing.

 

[trashpony]

i think it was a deliberate echo of what he does, perhaps to shed some light on his motivations?

I got that, just didn't get the bit with her shag and his murder.

It felt to me like they were trying to draw parallels between her fuck and his murder

 

[spanglechick]

I got that, just didn't get the bit with her shag and his murder.

It felt to me like they were trying to draw parallels between her fuck and his murder

yeah - i dunno about that. maybe just juxtaposition - like they always seem to show him working out crosscut with her swimming.

 

[JimW]

i think it was a deliberate echo of what he does, perhaps to shed some light on his motivations?

I'm certain it was an echo, though maybe as a contrast?
On the her sex intercut with his murder/rape - maybe contrasting healthy-but-not-entirely-socially-sanctioned sexual-behaviour with weirdo evil power game criminality? I.e. here's two people stepping outside social norms, one by being straightforward and assertive but consensual, the other by controlling and horrible violent crime. Not really thought that through, I must confess, just a reaction to trashpony's question.

 

[Stigmata]

Good to see a few of the better Game of Thrones actors getting some other work. Although that one copper looks disconcertingly like Eric Cantona.

 

[Nanker Phelge]

I got that, just didn't get the bit with her shag and his murder.

It felt to me like they were trying to draw parallels between her fuck and his murder

There was a scene in ep3 where she's being questioned about her 'relations' with the cop in ep1 when she makes a point about men and women as subject and object. This is an theme throughout the story. In her liason with the cop she was the subject, he was the object , in the killer's actions he is the subject and she is the object.

 

[Nanker Phelge]

repeat post

 

[trashpony]

There was a scene in ep3 where she's being questioned about her 'relations' with the cop in ep1 when she makes a point about men and women as subject and object. This is an theme throughout the story. In her liason with the cop she was the subject, he was the object , in the killer's actions he is the subject and she is the object.

Aha of course

 

[Nanker Phelge]

Aha of course

I made that almost sound like I knew what I was talking about....

 

[Nanker Phelge]

Just realised this is on Netflix US....I'm gonna watch the ending tonight!

 

[JimW]

Just realised this is on Netflix US....I'm gonna watch the ending tonight!

Don't tell us who's done it and spoil it! Though clearly some other murkiness going on too.

 

[Nanker Phelge]

bites tongue!

 

[youngian]

Although that one copper looks disconcertingly like Eric Cantona.

Thanks, I've been curious for weeks who he reminds me of. John Lynch also played George Best in a biopic.
Spoiler-






Very unusual ending by letting the case role over to a second series. Hope they don't arse about and leave it too long.

 

[Badgers]

HUSH

 

[spanglechick]

What, that was it??

 

[twistedAM]

What, that was it??

2nd series?

 

[Nanker Phelge]

What, that was it??

Gillian Anderson actually discussed the ending a few weeks back:

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/news...ll-series-2-a-cliffhanger-is-always-good.html

I felt a little frustrated by it....

 

[susie12]

Not cliffhanger so much as copout. If they hadn't commissioned a second series it would have been a really poor ending. Had serious doubts about this work - the violence was gratuitous and lingering and the supposed parallels between cop and killer were tenuous and didn't work for me at least. Also the juxtaposition others have mentioned - so sex is like murder? No, it isn't.

 

[JimW]

Fair points susie12; I've been more positive than you up to now but that was a very poor way to end it - him going off/going on puts him on equal status with her character IYSWIM which lends weight to what you say about false equivalences drawn which I was willing to think they weren't doing up to now. She should have brought the fucker to justice and season 2 should have had her on a new case. Maybe it will with him lurking as a shadow in the background, but seems like they want to set him on a par with her.

 

[Kaka Tim]

The ending was bollocks. They have a ton of evidence to identify him - his first name, a photofit, where and when he went to college - one media appeal and/or quick chat with the colleges and they would have him within hours. Once his previous victim had come forward any half witted plod would have had enough to nail him.

On top of that - they have his handwriting - they took his DNA and prints when he took himself into the cop shop, why weren't they sampling handwriting as well? And why did he write - instead of type - the letter in the first place?

Gillian Anderson gets better and better and there's some very good writing - but The fall is not nearly as clever as it seems to think it is and its feminist pretentions wrapped around gratuitous sex crime voyeurism is a queasy combination.

 

[Pickman's model]

The ending was bollocks. They have a ton of evidence to identify him - his first name, a photofit, where and when he went to college - one media appeal and/or quick chat with the colleges and they would have him within hours. Once his previous victim had come forward any half witted plod would have had enough to nail him.

On top of that - they have his handwriting - they took his DNA and prints when he took himself into the cop shop, why weren't they sampling handwriting as well? And why did he write - instead of type - the letter in the first place?

Gillian Anderson gets better and better and there's some very good writing - but The fall is not nearly as clever as it seems to think it is and its feminist pretentions wrapped around gratuitous sex crime voyeurism is a queasy combination.

they did sample his handwriting you weren't paying attention

 

[cyprusclean]

She should have brought the fucker to justice and season 2 should have had her on a new case.

I agree with this. I find myself wishing she had caught him. I was looking forward to her proposition of "two hours" discussion alone with her. He appeared to like that idea.

And what are they going to do in Scotland, as a family?

But as you said, maybe the writers want to develop a sort of symbiotic interaction between Gibson and the killer, resulting in a final denouement (sexual maybe?) in some location somewhere. Her flat? Her office?

His commenting on her nail varnish seemed to arouse something in her.