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Terrible flooding in Pakistan Aug 2022

story

story

Changing the facts
Has been mentioned in a couple of other threads but I think it needs a dedicated thread.

I’m putting it in this forum because it seems clear that climate change is a causative factor in the extremity of the flooding. It could just as easily be in World Politics because the government are badly failing their people and that may lead to further develolments.

Either way, this is another story that hammers home how precarious our place is here, and how fragile our systems of governance in the face of elemental dangers.


I remember back in the 80s when climate change was still a novelty hearing that Bangladesh and Pakistan would bear the brunt of the first climate change disasters, and here we are.

www.theguardian.com

Pakistan floods: plea for help amid fears monsoon could put a third of country underwater

Foreign minister urges countries and IMF to help stricken country after climate change minister speaks of climate ‘catastrophe’
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com


indianexpress.com

Floods to cause $4 bn loss to Pakistan’s economy: Report

The monsoon season, which began in June, has lashed Pakistan with particularly heavy rains this year and rescuers have struggled to evacuate thousands of marooned people from flood-hit areas. The crisis has forced the government to declare a state of emergency in parts of the country.
indianexpress.com indianexpress.com

www.nytimes.com

Pakistan Hit by Deadly Floods of ‘Epic Proportions’ (Published 2022)

More than 1,000 have died since mid-June from flooding that a senior official called a “climate-induced humanitarian disaster.”
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com



 
The currenr government are hamstrung by their own internal issue.



Meanwhile, experts say Pakistan's struggling government is in no shape to address the ongoing emergency.
Click to expand...

Mosharraf Zaidi, chief executive of Tabadlab, a think tank in Islamabad, said the national and provincial governments struggle to meet even basic needs. Emergencies or disasters thus appear to go largely unanswered despite some efforts to strengthen resiliency.
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asia.nikkei.com

Pakistan floods hit millions as political storm hinders response

Cash-strapped Sharif government banks on international assistance
asia.nikkei.com asia.nikkei.com





www.ft.com

Pakistan floods kill more than 1,000 and threaten economic recovery

Torrential rain causes widespread damage ahead of crucial IMF decision on $1.2bn financial package
www.ft.com www.ft.com
The floods have added to Pakistan’s financial distress. The IMF’s board on Monday is expected to approve a $1.2bn disbursement to shore up the country’s dwindling foreign currency reserves, which have fallen to about five weeks’ worth of cover for imports. Inflation has soared, with an indicator of “sensitive” items such as food and other essentials last week rising to 45 per cent year on year. Rehman predicted that authorities may be forced to divert development grants and potentially budget funding to manage the fallout. “We’ll have trouble with our import bills and foreign exchange reserves will be impacted because we’ll be importing food now, in a much larger [way],” she said. “Once our trade balance is impacted, the rupee will be further weakened. We’re facing a very tough time ahead.” The government is preparing a UN appeal for humanitarian aid to support affected areas and Prime Minister Shehbaz Sharif met foreign diplomats on Friday to push for more international aid. “The ongoing rain spell has caused devastation across the country,” he said. Investors had feared that Pakistan could follow Sri Lanka in defaulting, though the prospect of upcoming assistance from the IMF — part of a $7bn package launched in 2019 — has largely eased those concerns. China recently lent more than $2bn to Islamabad, while Saudi Arabia has agreed to renew a $3bn deposit at Pakistan’s central bank. Pakistani authorities anticipate more aid from countries including Qatar. The flooding has piled further pressure on Sharif’s government as it faces a sustained political challenge from former prime minister Imran Khan, who was ousted this year in a no-confidence vote. Khan popularity has surged since, as he has pressed for elections, but is on bail after being charged last week with terrorism offences over a controversial speech. Recommended Coal Climate graphic of the week: China coal power generation nears record during heatwave Some policy experts argued that chronic neglect and mismanagement have exacerbated the toll of climate change-induced catastrophic events. Abid Suleri, head of the Sustainable Development Policy Institute think-tank, said “man-made disasters”, such as buildings constructed poorly and in unsafe locations, have added to the damage. “Natural calamities cannot be averted [by any one country] but human catastrophes flowing from them can be avoided,” he said. But Rehman argued that no country could handle such extreme flooding. “If Islamabad were to get 700 per cent extra rain, Islamabad would pack up — as would New York,” she said. “It’s sexy to say it’s a development failure . . . But I’m not sure that’s all there is to the story. It’s just too much water.” Climate Capital Where climate change meets business, markets and politics. Explore the FT’s coverage here. Are you curious about the FT’s environmental sustainability commitments? Find out more about our science-based targets here Get alerts on Pakistan when a new story is published Get alerts Copyright The Financial Times Limited 2022. All rights reserved. Reuse this content (opens in new window) CommentsJump to comments section
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Just watching the news on this, it's mind-blowingly massive news, going to have huge and long term consequences.

The climate stuff is just moving so quickly it's really full-on. The Guardian headline now is about the inevitable sea rise from the melting of the Greenland icecap.
 
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LDC said:
Just watching the news on this, it's mind-blowingly massive news, going to have huge and long term consequences.

The climate stuff is just moving so quickly it's really full-on. The Guardian headline now is about the inevitable melting of the Greenland icecap.
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no, what the guardian's on about it about is the sea rise caused by the melting of the greenland ice thus far. it doesn't say that the melting of all the ice on greenland is inevitable and if you think it does you should go back and read it again. Major sea-level rise caused by melting of Greenland ice cap is ‘now inevitable’ it is the major sea-level rise not the melting of all that ice which is inevitable

if all the greenland ice melted then the sea level would rise about 7 metres (If all of Earth's ice melts and flows into the ocean, what would happen to the planet's rotation? – Climate Change: Vital Signs of the Planet.) not 27cm
 
This highlights how densely populated some of the most vulnerable regions are too, and how vulnerable in terms of no resilient infrastructure. It's horrifying, but then has been all these years we've been told it's coming. Will have to be massive relocations you'd think but how would that happen?
 
JimW said:
This highlights how densely populated some of the most vulnerable regions are too, and how vulnerable in terms of no resilient infrastructure. It's horrifying, but then has been all these years we've been told it's coming. Will have to be massive relocations you'd think but how would that happen?
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there are going to be no relocations in terms of populations being relocated like moving everyone from eg fiji to canada. there's going to be much more migration, people/s just walking north (or south)

it'll be bloody
 
Pickman's model said:
there are going to be no relocations in terms of populations being relocated like moving everyone from eg fiji to canada. there's going to be much more migration, people/s just walking north (or south)

it'll be bloody
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Yep, there have been some quite major state mandated relocations here under the poverty alleviation rubric, e.g. out of the barren karst in Guizhou but even though they involved hundreds of thousands overall would still be a drop in ocean and impossible for smaller polities.
 
A third of the country under water- and it’s not a small place either. Fuckibg hell. And there is a one million page Bitcoin is a great thing thread just up the board a bit.
 
Pickman's model said:
no, what the guardian's on about it about is the sea rise caused by the melting of the greenland ice thus far. it doesn't say that the melting of all the ice on greenland is inevitable and if you think it does you should go back and read it again. Major sea-level rise caused by melting of Greenland ice cap is ‘now inevitable’ it is the major sea-level rise not the melting of all that ice which is inevitable

if all the greenland ice melted then the sea level would rise about 7 metres (If all of Earth's ice melts and flows into the ocean, what would happen to the planet's rotation? – Climate Change: Vital Signs of the Planet.) not 27cm
Click to expand...

Yeah OK, just wrote in a hurry.
 
JimW said:
Yep, there have been some quite major state mandated relocations here under the poverty alleviation rubric, e.g. out of the barren karst in Guizhou but even though they involved hundreds of thousands overall would still be a drop in ocean and impossible for smaller polities.
Click to expand...

I know China is also bearing the burden of catastrophic climate change. We probably need a thread per region at this point. Otherwise each place will just get overlooked in the general hurly burly of news. Each nation will be (not) dealing with it in their own way. I‘d be interested in a China dedicated climate thread.
 
Pickman's model said:
there are going to be no relocations in terms of populations being relocated like moving everyone from eg fiji to canada. there's going to be much more migration, people/s just walking north (or south)

it'll be bloody
Click to expand...

Other parts of Pakistan will soon be, or already are, too hot to remain habitable.

indianexpress.com

Explained: How Jacobabad in Pakistan crossed a temperature threshold too severe for human tolerance

The mixture of heat and humid air from the Arabian Sea has contributed to Jacobabad crossing temperatures of 52 degrees Celsius, which could potentially be fatal for human beings.
indianexpress.com indianexpress.com

Again, the lack of reliable infrastructure for drinkable water, air conditioning etc puts these places at greater risk than other stupidly hot parts of the world like the UAE.
 
SpookyFrank said:
Other parts of Pakistan will soon be, or already are, too hot to remain habitable.

indianexpress.com

Explained: How Jacobabad in Pakistan crossed a temperature threshold too severe for human tolerance

The mixture of heat and humid air from the Arabian Sea has contributed to Jacobabad crossing temperatures of 52 degrees Celsius, which could potentially be fatal for human beings.
indianexpress.com indianexpress.com

Again, the lack of reliable infrastructure for drinkable water, air conditioning etc puts these places at greater risk than other stupidly hot parts of the world like the UAE.
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Yeh obviously. But there's no one swooping in to relocate people to somewhere nicer is there.
 
story said:
I know China is also bearing the burden of catastrophic climate change. We probably need a thread per region at this point. Otherwise each place will just get overlooked in the general hurly burly of news. Each nation will be (not) dealing with it in their own way. I‘d be interested in a China dedicated climate thread.
Click to expand...
Yes, the news out of Chongqing is horrible, longest sustained run of over 40 degree temps, electricity shortages over a broad swathe due to southwest relying heavily on hydro, but obviously the state here has some a much greater capacity to cope in terms of infrastructure and resources.
 
JimW said:
Yes, the news out of Chongqing is horrible, longest sustained run of over 40 degree temps, electricity shortages over a broad swathe due to southwest relying heavily on hydro, but obviously the state here has some a much greater capacity to cope in terms of infrastructure and resources.
Click to expand...


And hydro is failing cos of drought.

We do need a China thread don’t we.
 
Bingoman said:
According to a sky news reporter who is in Pakistan that today's temperature has already hit 50°c
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With the flood water not receding over a third of the land, disease will surely follow.

Someone earlier or elsewhere said that people will just start walking out of such zones, especially if the government can’t or won’t help.








(I was thinking about my dad. In such a situation, as parent, I’ve no doubt he would have had us start walking. I think I would too.)
 
Bingoman said:
According to a sky news reporter who is in Pakistan that today's temperature has already hit 50°c
Click to expand...
really. where? a quick look on bbc weather suggests around 40c might not be off the cards but 50, i can't find a reference to that since may. have you one of those handy links lying about pls?
 
Pakistan are not a bad offender when it comes to global warming. I also understand over a third of Bangladesh is liable to flooding.
Elsewhere there are many island communities that are at risk from being totally wiped out by the rising sea levels yet we think we in the UK have problems.
 
Should we be spending money on developing rockets so that we, humans, can visit the moon for a week or two at a time. Should we be developing and stock piling nuclear weapons? Pakistan thought so....

"Pakistani Prime Minister Zulfiqar Ali Bhutto promised in 1971 that if India could build nuclear weapons then Pakistan would too, according to him: "We will develop Nuclear stockpiles, even if we have to eat grass".

I think we, the human race need to reassess our priorities.
 
Pickman's model said:
really. where? a quick look on bbc weather suggests around 40c might not be off the cards but 50, i can't find a reference to that since may. have you one of those handy links lying about pls?
Click to expand...

There‘s this.

Just quickly, so I’ve not done any background checking, I don’t know who CNA is, and I’ve not watched the whole video.
It says that temperatures were hitting 50 about a month ago, so not concurrent with these floods.

 
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