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Finally playing Oblivion (SPOILERS)

Citizen66 said:
Yes but IIRC they then stay at that level. So if they're super tough you can return in a bit after you level again or have a better sword and have another go. Levelling caps ends up a bit like taking on Pakistani kids with spy drones...
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I thought that was Skyrim, where the dungeon's level is fixed at your level when you enter? IIRC Oblivion just keeps on levelling with you, especially the roaming NPCs and monsters, which really bug me.

As for nuking them with predator drones, that's what the whole point! I like it in games like Morrowind where I can train ni a Rocky-style montage, buy some kit and then stroll around the dungeon one-shotting zombies like they were mud crabs.
 
Random said:
I thought that was Skyrim, where the dungeon's level is fixed at your level when you enter? IIRC Oblivion just keeps on levelling with you, especially the roaming NPCs and monsters, which really bug me.

As for nuking them with predator drones, that's what the whole point! I like it in games like Morrowind where I can train ni a Rocky-style montage, buy some kit and then stroll around the dungeon one-shotting zombies like they were mud crabs.
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I'm talking about your mod, which turns it into that by the sounds of it. What is the point in weakening the mobs to the extent that you gain no xp from them?

I guess this was always going to be an issue in a sandbox open world. In WoW they deal with it by assigning regions to levels. Trickier to deal with in complete open world. That's why I always thought the Oblivion system was fine.

Actually you may be right. Just never found it an issue with oblivion. :hmm:
 
Citizen66 said:
I guess this was always going to be an issue in a sandbox open world. In WoW they deal with it by assigning regions to levels. Trickier to deal with in complete open world. That's why I always thought the Oblivion system was fine.
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Come off it! Games like Morrowind dealt with it fine. There are zones, dungeons, castles, all sorts of clues as to how deadly an area is. If you go toddling up Red Mountain when you're level 5 you should get badly mauled by vampires.

As to not getting xp, that's not a problem in Elder Scrolls. I've been levelling up my armour and block skills by letting monsters take swings at me.Maybe I should also carry a dagger, or a spoon, so I can take a few swings at the monsters and level up blade, too. Or I can always pay for training.
 
I've never got to level 50 in Skyrim, not past 48 I think. I end up levelling to 100 everything that I use in combat, so perhaps archery and one-handed for example, maybe sneak too, then my armour of choice, then smithing and enchanting too... after that, the only way to continue to gain levels is to start levelling things I don't want to use with this character. I usually swap out and start wearing some of the opposite type of armour, maybe start trying to heal myself with restoration magic or start summoning atronachs in battle, but it's never that good. There are some quests that don't open up until you're higher levelled. I believe there's a quest in Dragonborn that you have to be level 81 to access. Never gonna happen.

By level 48 I don't ever really feel the need to level anyway, since I can do everything I need to, my armour rating is awesome and my enchantments do everything I need to keep me from harm and help me do damage. But without levelling and without being able to place a couple more perks where I want them, it starts to get a bit boring. I use the Deadly Dragons mod, which spawns dragons more or less around your level (although you can choose to de-level them, but I don't fancy a level 70 dragon when I'm fresh out of Helgen), but sometimes they will be a few levels higher, and yes, they are deadly. One thing that mod adds though is the ability to convert dragon souls into perk points. Since you'll be seeing dragons a hell of a lot more often with that mod you'll have more souls than you know what to do with. You can alter in the menu how many souls you want it to take to convert to 1 perk point, which is a nice level of control to have. Or you can never convert a single soul if you don't want, it's up to you. But, for those times when the levelling is going really slowly and you've just got to get that perk in lightfoot, it's quite handy.
 
Vintage Paw said:
I believe there's a quest in Dragonborn that you have to be level 81 to access. Never gonna happen.
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Jesus! I used to spend a lot of money on trainers in Morrowind; steal all the soul gems in the mages guild then pay to get a quick start to my skills. Not trying this in Oblivion, partly because I'm not rich enough, partly because until I installed the level cap mod there seemed to be little point in levelling, especially since I could possibly make myself weaker.

Don't you get to a point in Skyrim where you're loaded and can pay to get your skills to 100?
 
You can take the money from some trainers back again if they are also available as followers.... but of course that would be morally dubious.... >_>
 
Citizen66 said:
I'm talking about your mod, which turns it into that by the sounds of it. What is the point in weakening the mobs to the extent that you gain no xp from them?
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Because in TES games, you don't gain XP for killing an enemy (or amount of XP determined by the level of that enemy) which is the norm in many RPGs, you gain Skill Points from successfully using skills, and the skill points that you accrue feed in to your overall level. In Skyrim, if you hit an enemy with a 1-handed weapon, you will gain skill points in 1-handed regardless of whether that blow kills the enemy or you run away screaming right afterwards - you get points for the action, not the outcome. I can hit a skeever, or hit a draugr deathlord, and get skill points. The skill points feed into character level so that when I have achieved x number of skill increases, I will gain a level, regardless of the level of enemies I have been killing. It's the same in both Oblivion and Morrowind.

The main problem in Oblivion comes if you level any skill that isn't directly combat related - say you go on a shopping trip to sell loot, and end up gaining a level because you get loads of skill points in barter on that shopping trip - the levelled enemies will have increased in strength and gear while you have just increased your personality and barter skills, so next time you are out on the road the randomly generated bandit you meet will be wearing rare glass armour and take 100 slashes of your blade to kill, whilst dealing a large amount of damage to you in one hit - and a mudcrab will have higher health and take more effort to kill than a mudcrab that you meet at level 1. This is plainly wrong, a mudcrab should be a mudcrab, they should be a bit tricky early game, but come level 50 you should not be still trying to avoid them because they have got progressively nastier.

The levelling system in OB is so flawed that you would (IMO) be ill-advised to play without mods to a) remove attribute metagaming from level-ups, and b) to delevel mob spawns (and by that, I mean removing the levelled-list spawn/gear element from the game) - not so that they are all easy, but so that a mudcrab has the same number of health points regardless of whether you are level 1 or level 50, and is easier to kill at level 50 (not more difficult, which in some cases is possible), and so that bandits wear normal easy to come by armour rather than rare and highly expensive gear that costs more than the house you just bought.
 
But in theory you are more able to afford that rare glass sword that makes you more even with the bandit because merchants charge you less and you make more money from selling loot than the guy who advanced his 1hd.

In Skyrim i prefer making my own kick ass stuff through smithing and enchanting rather than barter and shops.
 
Gromit said:
But in theory you are more able to afford that rare glass sword that makes you more even with the bandit because merchants charge you less and you make more money from selling loot than the guy who advanced his 1hd.

In Skyrim i prefer making my own kick ass stuff through smithing and enchanting rather than barter and shops.
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In Skyrim this is true, and I think the game used a fairly reasonable system for levelling of enemy encounters - perhaps I shouldn't have referred to Skyrim in my post (I only referred to it to talk about how skill points/levels were attained, since more people have played Skyrim than the earlier games).

Oblivion's system is pretty broken, and is the worst out of the entire series. Seriously you can kill a mudcrab with 2 hits at level 1, and at level 10 it takes 3 or 4 hits, because the mudcrabs you meet at a higher character level have more health points, so are harder to kill. That is plainly ridiculous. It's also fairly ridiculous having bandit mobs start out in low level armour and get more geared up as your level increases - spawning in the same places just with higher health and better gear, it's so noticeable, and it's a cheap and lazy way of providing challenge to a higher level player - and isn't at all fun, it actually gets less fun as the game progresses. I'm not talking about dungeon mobs, this is just the stuff you meet walking along the roads.
 
Epona said:
The main problem in Oblivion comes if you level any skill that isn't directly combat related - say you go on a shopping trip to sell loot, and end up gaining a level because you get loads of skill points in barter on that shopping trip - the levelled enemies will have increased in strength and gear while you have just increased your personality and barter skills, so next time you are out on the road the randomly generated bandit you meet will be wearing rare glass armour and take 100 slashes of your blade to kill, whilst dealing a large amount of damage to you in one hit - and a mudcrab will have higher health and take more effort to kill than a mudcrab that you meet at level 1. This is plainly wrong, a mudcrab should be a mudcrab, they should be a bit tricky early game, but come level 50 you should not be still trying to avoid them because they have got progressively nastier.
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Sorry, yes you're right, I forgot all of that. I think it's very character specific, or perhaps quest specific. It was something that really hamstrung me when I was playing as a mage but not so much as a thief (with sneak and invisibility) and also not so bad if you start off doing warrior quests and do a lot of fighting and gain armour upgrades etc but I do remember it being problematic for some characters now you mention it. IIRC.
 
ARSE!

I've avoided the main quest on purpose, not done a single stage. But then I fast travel into Kvatch, on the way to researching the Grey Prince's family tree and there's an Oblivion Gate opened up. And when I'm saving civilians, one of them seems to be the Septim heir... Have I accidentally short-cut my way into the MQ? Like when I was randomly exploring vaults in Fallout 3 and accidentally found my Dad in a virtual reality machine.
 
Random said:
Have I accidentally short-cut my way into the MQ?
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Well you now only have 1 MQ mission to go if thats what you mean.






Psych!

Winding you up sorry, I forget what part of the quest that is but remember there is plenty left to go.

p.s. I thought the heir was a priest you had to rescue. Was he in a gate? If so is it that one in the town way up north?
 
Gromit said:
p.s. I thought the heir was a priest you had to rescue. Was he in a gate? If so is it that one in the town way up north?
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Yes, he's one of a bunch of people sheltering in a church. Anyway, he can bugger off. I'm not talking to him. Just hope this doesn't mean more Oblivion Gates suddenly opening up all over the place.
 
Random said:
Yes, he's one of a bunch of people sheltering in a church. Anyway, he can bugger off. I'm not talking to him. Just hope this doesn't mean more Oblivion Gates suddenly opening up all over the place.
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There are millions of them that will open up all over the shop. The only MQ ones you need worry about are the ones right outside major cities. The rest are just for levelling and loot.
 
Gromit said:
There are millions of them that will open up all over the shop. The only MQ ones you need worry about are the ones right outside major cities. The rest are just for levelling and loot.
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Oh pants. Well I'm going to ignore them as much as possible
 
I never did the main quest in oblivion. I don't like the idea that I'm completing the game; I just play until I get bored or distracted by something else.
 
I'm thinking of starting this again for the xbox one, so no mods or owt.

Fancy playing as a nord warrior type character as i like swords and things. :thumbs:

Any recommedations/hints before I start?
 
Rosemary Jest said:
I'm thinking of starting this again for the xbox one, so no mods or owt.

Fancy playing as a nord warrior type character as i like swords and things. :thumbs:

Any recommedations/hints before I start?
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i) Create a custom class
ii) Google "efficient levelling" even if you only use it partially
iii) Bretons kick ass
iv) Sacks of grain can be used as safe non-respawning storage (until you can afford a house)
v) I was looking for a skill levelling sheet off tinternet - it seems to have been taken down, but I can send you a copy if you can't find one you like
 
Cheers for the pointers, I've avouded the main quest so far as I hate the oblivion gates, but i'm up to level 6 and am nearly finished the Arena quest. :thumbs:

I forgot how great the music and atmosphere is, even better than Skyrim, and I love Skyrim.

The world also seems deeper, with more to do. The quests also seem a bit more varied and interesting compared to Skyrim.

It really is a great game, isn't it?

I haven't even missed the better graphics as Skyrim doesn't look that much better, and I tthink I like the stylised graphics a bit more.
 
Yeah, once I got into it the graphics weren’t an issue for me.

And I highly recommend being a slacker re: the main quest.

My custom class name is “Procrastinatr”.

In my mind she never believed what Joffrey said.
 
Though at the moment I’ve been distracted by Crysis 2 on the 3D telly.

That really is a graphics bonanza.
 
8ball said:
Yeah, once I got into it the graphics weren’t an issue for me.

And I highly recommend being a slacker re: the main quest.
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I've just been to Bruma and am going to find some daedric artifact for the jarl.

Still a great game, atmos still drawing me in :thumbs:
 
Rosemary Jest said:
Cheers for the pointers, I've avouded the main quest so far as I hate the oblivion gates, but i'm up to level 6 and am nearly finished the Arena quest. :thumbs:

I forgot how great the music and atmosphere is, even better than Skyrim, and I love Skyrim.

The world also seems deeper, with more to do. The quests also seem a bit more varied and interesting compared to Skyrim.

It really is a great game, isn't it?

I haven't even missed the better graphics as Skyrim doesn't look that much better, and I tthink I like the stylised graphics a bit more.
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I do think, despite any complaints I may have made on this thread or elsewhere, that it is a fantastic game and a lot of fun. My complaints are that it's not completely perfect. But it is fucking good, and I love it :D
 
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