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What Now for the BNP?

ayatollah said:
For goodness sakes, Pickman's model,get a grip man... read my post a bit more carefully.....The "middle class" Left has been constantly accused by the IWCA of "turning a blind eye" to "sins" by the Muslim community because of , the IWCA contends, a mistaken view that "multiculturalism" provides a " get off behaving badly" card to minority cultural groups. The IWCA is not entirely alone in this view. The BNP obviously say it loudly, and there was a recent article in the Guardian, on the back of the recent "honour killing case" by a black Leftie again saying that too often the broad Left had turned a blind eye to "culture-based crimes" in minority communities. I agree with you that in fact NOONE with any sense on the Left actually thinks that the law should stand aside from dealing with crimes against women like genital mutilation and forced marriage, and I can find no evidence that this has ever been a significant position on the Left ... it is a Straw Man.
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i thought you were above that sort of thing. obviously i was wrong.
 
ayatollah said:
This an important post Delroy Booth. You have IMO identified the very nasty subtext in so many of "Joe's" postings over years on the issue of "grooming " by gangs who are Muslims. He is systematically associating the crimes of a few criminals with some wider "cultural sickness" in the entire Muslim community.
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Ironically, this is exactly how the Catholic Church sounded when initially defending itself against 'excessive intrusion' and the supposed 'anti-Catholic' motivations of the whistle-blowers before the full scale of the scandal began to emerge. I guess you don't call yourself the Ayatollah for nothing.
 
ayatollah said:
I agree with you that in fact NOONE with any sense on the Left actually thinks that the law should stand aside from dealing with crimes against women like genital mutilation and forced marriage, and I can find no evidence that this has ever been a significant position on the Left ... it is a Straw Man.
Click to expand...

The UAF argued that taking a stance on grooming etc was 'playing into the hands of the BNP', Anne Cryer was condemned as 'insensitive' for drawing attention to forced marriages, Jack Straw was accused of 'demeaning a whole religion' when commenting on the grooming issue, while an anti-pimping group in Leeds was accussed of being a 'front for the BNP'.

While not too long back it was yourself on this forum that insisted the grooming issue was all 'got up by the tabloids'.

Even the police admitted they were fully cognisant of the political nature of the inquiry and dragged their feet for years. How many more victims since 2004?

Of course no liberal ever formally says the 'law should stand aside', they are far too weasely to do that. But they definitely don't want to hear about it. Would far prefer it was kept behind closed doors, brushed under the carpet and try to cow into submission anyone who suggests different.

In short, the instinct (Iincluding yours) to smear anyone who dares to even broach the issue cannot be so easily dismissed as unrepresentative can it?

And if that is what it is like for contributors on Urban, imagine the pressure within the Muslim community to stay silent, be quiescent and conform?
 
An article that would apparently bear Griffin out with its soft treatment of the EDL in an establishment, pro-Israel paper.

Some bizarre claims also: "Unlike the NF or BNP, it is almost exclusively working-class, one of the reasons that leads Griffin to suspect there are shadowy forces behind it." This seems to be the exact opposite of what Griffin is saying.
 
At least they still agree with the EDL when it comes to sarnies. BNP plan on demonstrating outside Subway sarnie shop in Sunderland on Saturday for the second time in a month. It's because it sells islamic sarnies or something. Stupid twats.


*just noticed the alliteration in that post, makes me sound like a daily star sub editor:oops:
 
LLETSA said:
An article that would apparently bear Griffin out with its soft treatment of the EDL in an establishment, pro-Israel paper.

Some bizarre claims also: "Unlike the NF or BNP, it is almost exclusively working-class, one of the reasons that leads Griffin to suspect there are shadowy forces behind it." This seems to be the exact opposite of what Griffin is saying.
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As Griffin has painstakingly identified exactly who are the main players and through email extracts extablished beyond plausibility the precise relationships between them there is no 'suspect' in it. Either the people in question don't exist; don't know each other, or have opposite politics to those attributed to them - or - Griffin has established a prima facie case. Any other conclusion just adds to the sense of something being even more seriously untoward. With regard to the expose of Hope not Hate the same standard should be applied.
 
Joe Reilly said:
Interesting to note that the two mentions of the Griffin expose of the EDL in the mainstream press have both been used to attack the BNP. 'The death of the BNP' etc when the more appropriate conclusion and headline should surely have been:'The strange death of the EDL'.
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maybe its a mutual suicide pact?
 
ha ha just reading bones bash the rich (on the toilet actually) and the acrostic is well in keeping with CW tone!
 
A1JZC_SCAAAlEG2.jpg
 
When your weary
Feeling small
When Jeffersons doing your nut
And youve heard it all

Im on your side
When times get rough
And friends just cant be found
Like a bridge that was just a little smaller
Than thought Clive the clown
Like a bridge that couldve been with being taller
Just as his pants turned brown

When your down and out
When your on the street
When you hear the roof cave in
I can hear you shout
(What the fuck!!)

You are a bunch of jokers
There til darkness comes
And embarrasment is all around
Like a bridge blocked by fools to the slaughter
Just let the tyres down
Like a bridge just an inch or too shorter
What Id give for it now

Drive on Silly boys
Drive on by
You gave us laughs galore
And your on your way

So next time you see a bridge
Tell Rodney no!!
Cos youll lose your no claims
And that'd be a blow
Like a bridge that you couldnt get under
I will ease your mind
Like a bridge that caused a top class blunder
Clive your one of a kind.

(c)simon and what the fuckle
 
Spanky Longhorn said:
He's an assistant editor at the New Statesman
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He is a friend of a friend - we talked about the book about a year ago. One of those "oh this guy also knows a bit about fascism!" introductions that are a bit excruciating. He struck me as more sound than you would expect someone who worked at New Statesman to be.

He emailed me this morning and offered to send a copy of the book, which was nice of him. I'm sure I'll disagree with some of it, but he's put the hours in so it should be worth reading... I'll try and put some thoughts on here when it turns up.
 
Walker pleaded guilty to dangerous driving in July and has been given a 6 month prison sentence suspended for 18 months.
 
Daniel Trilling - Blood Nasty People: The Rise of Britain's Far Right (Verso).

It's quite good for a book published by Verso which is 234 pages long (inc 23 pages of index/references).

I'm sure there will be some disagreement about the conclusions drawn and some of the other aspects but it seems to do a good job of tracing the development of the BNP's transformation from "march and grow" to what we have today. It's a good "beginners guide".

Part One of the book basically covers Enoch Powell and the formation of the NF etc up to Beackon's election as a BNP Councillor on the Isle of Dogs in 1993.

The influence of militant fascism on the turn to electoralism is briefly mentioned as a key factor (along with Beackon's success and the FN in France). AFA/IWCA/"Filling The Vacuum" aren't explicitly mentioned, but "Beating The Fascists" is referenced.

Part two covers 1993 up to the 2010 election, with a bit on the EDL tacked onto the end. So we get the Oldham riots, the election of Griffin and Brons to Europe, Dagenham, Question Time, various internal splits, being forced to change the constitution to admit non-white members, the political and media landscape in terms of Islam, immigration, etc.

The conclusion consists of "ten myths about Britain's far right" which he rebuffs.

It's readable and covers most of the ground well. Trilling has interviewed a bunch of people - mainly Griffin and Eddy Butler from the BNP - as well as people on the ground (various bods running community centres, trade unionists, locals) and some politicians and other dignitaries (Blunkett, Hain, Hodge...).

Trilling seems quite keen on Hope Not Hate's campaigning around the 2010 election. Paradoxically he also notes that is counter-productive to call the BNP Nazis.

He also seems to think that the BNP of Nick Griffin is now a spent force (whilst recognising that the issues that lead to its success haven't gone away and are likely to intensify).

As with Owen Jones' "Chavs", the book seems to be aimed at a Guardian reading / left Labour audience. There is a lot of discussion of how the political establishment played into the BNP's hands by ignoring working class needs. There isn't anything on the need for an alternative to the establishment. Owen Jones is overtly romantic about the Labour Party of yesteryear, but Trilling simply identifies how New Labour etc have screwed up. Perhaps this is fair enough as it's a book about the far right, not anti-fascism.

I'll look forward to seeing what other people have to say...

[as I said above, the author is a friend of a friend. I have met him a couple of times over beers and briefly discussed his progress with writing it. Apparently this has merited a thank you at the end and a free copy, which is nice - but it's not like I've had any actual input into it.]
 
butchersapron said:
Any chance of listing the ten myths fozzie? (No rush and no worries if not)
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Well, since you asked...:)

The conclusion consists of "ten myths about Britain's far right" which he rebuffs.
1. The threat has passed
2. The rise of the BNP was a consequence of 'too much' immigration
3. Racism only played a minor role in driving BNP support
4. White people in Britain are discriminated against because of their skin colour
5. 'Tough talk' keeps the far right at bay
6. Anti-racism has been imposed on the white-working class by a politically-correct elite
7. The growth of the BNP and the emergence of the EDL indicate the failure of multiculturalism.
8. The BNP was Labour's problem alone
9. The BNP wasn't fascist
10. 'It couldn't happen here'
 
Fozzie Bear said:
Well, since you asked...:)

1. The threat has passed
2. The rise of the BNP was a consequence of 'too much' immigration
3. Racism only played a minor role in driving BNP support
4. White people in Britain are discriminated against because of their skin colour
5. 'Tough talk' keeps the far right at bay
6. Anti-racism has been imposed on the white-working class by a politically-correct elite
7. The growth of the BNP and the emergence of the EDL indicate the failure of multiculturalism.
8. The BNP was Labour's problem alone
9. The BNP wasn't fascist
10. 'It couldn't happen here'
Click to expand...
Lovely, cheers - that should give us some room to have a proper talk then. We could do them 1 by 1.
 
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