The lost Telegraph pub, Brixton Hill, SW2

[lang rabbie]

Oops, just realised my previous post lost a crucial bit in cutting and pasting
Now added in bold below:

The club room (did it used to be know genteely as "the music room" or am I imagining it )has a long history of use for gigs, predating even the Basement Jaxx days, and I don't think there is any way that the residents of the new Alexander (sic) Dumas House or elsewhere could legitimately sustain an objection if the music inside was at the same levels of amplification and at the same hours as before.

However , I think they were regularly staying open much later under the new management, and I get the impression there is a new permanent PA installed in the club room - how powerful is it?

I don't recall there being much evidence of any serious structure to the roof of that single storey room, so I suspect it has minimal soundproofing, and any new licensee could possibly get a bit of kudos with the neighbours by installing a bit of rockwool acoustic boarding.

 

[ajdown]

Just because noise keeps you awake is no reason to judge people for having a good time in a club. You are quite frankly ridiculous. Your argument is totally lame. I love the fact that you put the words good time in inverted commas, utterly stupid. You surely are a tight rod.

Pure, utter bullshit.

If I consider a 'good time' to be spending several hours running Naxxramus in World of Warcraft with some guild friends to get some epic drops, why is that a 'frankly ridiculous' way to enjoy myself on a saturday evening instead of clubbing? I'm fairly sure I wouldn't see you leaping to my defense if someone criticised how I choose to spend an evening which actually doesn't affect anyone else in the slightest (although Kel'Thuzad might not like feeling the old cold steel up him)

 

[teuchter]

Pure, utter bullshit.

If I consider a 'good time' to be spending several hours running Naxxramus in World of Warcraft with some guild friends to get some epic drops, why is that a 'frankly ridiculous' way to enjoy myself on a saturday evening instead of clubbing? I'm fairly sure I wouldn't see you leaping to my defense if someone criticised how I choose to spend an evening which actually doesn't affect anyone else in the slightest (although Kel'Thuzad might not like feeling the old cold steel up him)

I'm not saying that your objections are entirely unreasonable, especially if things have got a lot noiser than they used to be, but I can understand (and share to a certain degree) some people's irritation when there are objections to noise from clubs and bars, especially long-established ones.

The thing is that one of the reasons a lot of us live in London (and perhaps particularly Brixton) is the variety of stuff to do at night. That of course is not the only thing that makes London/Brixton good but if you choose to live somewhere like this I think you have to accept that stuff will be happening that will cause disturbance - it's the price you pay for enjoying doing some of that stuff yourself now and again.

So - and it's a totally oversimplified argument, but I'm just putting it as a way of explaining why people might respond negatively to your attitude - essentially, if what you want to do on a Friday night is stay at home and play computer games (and it's fine with me if that's what you want to do) then why live in Brixton, near to a main road with several bars on it?

You say that your choice of entertainment doesn't affect anyone else - true to an extent but if your choice of that lifestyle means you are trying to stop others enjoying whatever they do, then it does.

But just to restate, I don't necessarily think your objections in this particular instance are unreasonable.

 

[ajdown]

if what you want to do on a Friday night is stay at home and play computer games (and it's fine with me if that's what you want to do) then why live in Brixton, near to a main road with several bars on it?

I live in accommodation provided by the organisation I work for. I do not have a choice in where I live, and I certainly can't afford to rent anything in a different area on the salary I get (as I work for a charity).

People live where they do for various reasons - one big bonus for me in living where I do is not the nightlife, but the good range of local shops that enable me to get most of my normal weekly requirements, and a good bus service down the hill to where I can either get to other shops , change to another bus or form of transport to where I can get to other places, or indeed most London terminii to get trains to other locations around the country. Being tucked away in the middle of a quiet estate, 3 buses away from a supermarket, isn't an ideal situation for me either.

You say that your choice of entertainment doesn't affect anyone else - true to an extent but if your choice of that lifestyle means you are trying to stop others enjoying whatever they do, then it does.

I'm really not sure you can say that "wishing to sleep at night for more than just a couple of hours" is really an unusual 'lifestyle choice' especially when working a normal 9-5 job.

As I said, I'm not trying to stop people partying if they wish to, just to stop them from keeping me awake at night. If that wasn't important, why would Environmental Health and other local council bodies exist to stop that sort of thing?

 

[HobgoblinMan]

Pure, utter bullshit.

If I consider a 'good time' to be spending several hours running Naxxramus in World of Warcraft with some guild friends to get some epic drops, why is that a 'frankly ridiculous' way to enjoy myself on a saturday evening instead of clubbing? I'm fairly sure I wouldn't see you leaping to my defense if someone criticised how I choose to spend an evening which actually doesn't affect anyone else in the slightest (although Kel'Thuzad might not like feeling the old cold steel up him)

I said that your dissing of clubbers is ridiculous. Never, not once did I mention what you like to do for fun, therefore I did not criticise you for whatever you like doing. I had no prior knowledge of what you did for a 'good time'. So to accuse me of what you have, re. above, you are an idiot. You clearly and unfairly started to blame people who go clubbing for your noise problems and then look down on them for going clubbing for fun. You did this with absolutely no antagonism, and just launched your unfounded and frankly stupid judgement on people who go clubbing.

The people that do go to clubs are from all different walks of life. Drug users, drug addicts, straight edgers, gays, straights, boring people, interesting people and even World of Warcraft users. To diss people for going to clubs is sooooo out of line. I think you must have a massive chip on your shoulder for being a World Of Warcraft fan, from no doubt, the amount of shit you get for it. And hey, I don't give a shit what you do with your time, it's up to you, I aint gonna diss you, so don't diss people who go clubbing. You should try it sometime, let your hair down and take the rod out. You might learn something... like accepting other people and what they enjoy to do.

 

[ajdown]

I can't think of one good reason why I should want to spend a number of hours in a dark, noisy place, with a load of drunk sweaty strangers.

As I have said, several times, if people want to go clubbing that's their choice - but I choose not to, and at my age I'm rather past that sort of thing anyway.

I've been to a few live concerts, and I did enjoy the music, but I don't find "lively crowds" like that easy to deal with.

 

[teuchter]

I live in accommodation provided by the organisation I work for. I do not have a choice in where I live, and I certainly can't afford to rent anything in a different area on the salary I get (as I work for a charity).

Well, I imagine you have some choice in who you work for.

I'm really not sure you can say that "wishing to sleep at night for more than just a couple of hours" is really an unusual 'lifestyle choice' especially when working a normal 9-5 job.

I didn't suggest that it's OK for noisy late opening to be going on on weekday nights when people have to be going to work the next day.

Also, I didn't say that your chosen lifestyle is an unusual one. Quite the opposite. There is hardly a shortage of places set up for those who like the quiet life.

And like I said, I'm mainly just putting these points forward to explain why people might react to your comments the way they do. Of course there's got to be a point where the level of disturbance becomes unacceptable.

 

[ajdown]

Well, I imagine you have some choice in who you work for.

Yes but as the house sorta comes with the job as 'cheap rent', it's unlikely I would be able to afford somewhere on my own in London.

Sharing with strangers has never been, and never will be, an option I would consider.

Of course there's got to be a point where the level of disturbance becomes unacceptable.

Indeed, and everyone's tolerance levels are different. Mine happens to be fairly low.

 

[Orang Utan]

lolthread

 

[editor]

I passed it on Saturday and it was sad to see all the doors and windows sealed up with metal shutters.

We had some great urban parties there. Look how young everyone looks!

http://www.urban75.org/photos/party/mar03.html

More: http://www.urban75.org/photos/party/index.html

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Just been past it and noticed lights on upstairs.

Noticed a few agents boards outside, so took note of one which was Gilmarc so had a look at their website.

The Telegraph is listed under "bars" and is £75,000 per annum

Curious about the confidentiality bit stating that the staff don't know the place is going to be sold. What staff? Or is the info on their website way out of date?

http://www.gilmarc.co.uk/images/properties_pdf/south/brixton-hill-telegraph-london-sw2.pdf

 

[ajdown]

There are some flats at the Telegraph, accessible from a side door in the passageway that goes through to New Park Road. Not sure if those are the lights you're talking about though.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

There are some flats at the Telegraph, accessible from a side door in the passageway that goes through to New Park Road. Not sure if those are the lights you're talking about though.

Saw lights on on the top floor at the front and it looks like floor underneath may have tenants as well as there's blinds up

 

[lordnoise]

Crikey Minnie not a lot gets past you does it ? I'm afraid to dry my undies on my balcony on the Sabbath now

 

[zeedoodles]

My old local (were going back 15 years) and the venue I used for the first 2 or 3 Urban 75 parties (must be 10 years ago this year) Happy memories of that place and some great nights spent there. 75k sounds cheap to be honest (but then I have been in NZ for the past 4 years so am well out of touch)

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Crikey Minnie not a lot gets past you does it ? I'm afraid to dry my undies on my balcony on the Sabbath now

Loads gets past me. I probably only noticed because it's now dark in the evenings so the lights were noticeable

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

I went in that Green Market shop again today.

It really is a fantastic shop. I've not actually bought anything, but it's just full of weird and wonderful stuff. Saw some old cameras, binoculars and an ancient looking iron in a box today

 

[billythefish]

Not sure if anyone's seen this old cine film footage - but it's an amazing incarnation of the Telegraph from 1975 that recently popped up in my Friends Reunited memory thread.
(hope the link works).

http://www.friendsreunited.co.uk/brixton-hill-1975/Memory/70fb7fa9-3d49-4475-afb5-a0640004c867

 

[CH1]

Not sure if anyone's seen this old cine film footage - but it's an amazing incarnation of the Telegraph from 1975 that recently popped up in my Friends Reunited memory thread.
(hope the link works).

http://www.friendsreunited.co.uk/brixton-hill-1975/Memory/70fb7fa9-3d49-4475-afb5-a0640004c867

Amazing - its like something out of Metropolis by Fritz Lang. Did they start taking their clothes off later - reminds me of one of those illicit WAGS meetings in the 70s (Wimbledon Area Gay Society)

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Not sure if anyone's seen this old cine film footage - but it's an amazing incarnation of the Telegraph from 1975 that recently popped up in my Friends Reunited memory thread.
(hope the link works).

http://www.friendsreunited.co.uk/brixton-hill-1975/Memory/70fb7fa9-3d49-4475-afb5-a0640004c867

Thanks for that

Big change of shops since then

Shame it's so grainy. Would be nice to see what shops they were

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

What lovely arched entrances The Telegraph had

Nice car out front as well

 

[Voley]

My old local (were going back 15 years) and the venue I used for the first 2 or 3 Urban 75 parties (must be 10 years ago this year) Happy memories of that place and some great nights spent there.

Still the best parties I've ever been to. The novelty of going to a party where you'd never met anyone but already knew them quite well was quite a thing at the time. Obviously I can barely remember fucking any of it but it was very good fun at the time.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

George Canning

 

[editor]

Here's photos from the urban parties, back in the day

Urbanites 9: Telegraph, 22nd March 2003
Urbanites 8: Telegraph, 14th December 2002
urbanites 2: Telegraph, Brixton Hill November 2001
urbanites 1: Telegraph, Brixton Hill Sept 2001

 

[editor]

Here's how it looks today:

 

[equationgirl]

It's a beautiful building editor

 

[leanderman]

Now with the front area sealed off by unlovely fence panels, protecting a play area

 

[editor]

I was just researching this pub for an article and came across this triumphant article of the bar's death throes in 2010:

When the hearing started, the applicants put in their request for a licence to open until 4am on week nights and 6am at weekends. Afterwards, local councillors Steve Reed and Florence Nosegbe joined a group of residents to make the case that this was entirely inappropriate in a residential area. They also pointed out that people who had shown such contemptuous disregard for their neighbours were hardly the right people to run a club in the area. The Committee agreed and slapped restrictions on the pub that means they have to close at 11pm on weeknights and 12 midnight at weekends. The residents were delighted at this real example of local democracy in action as the council put the needs of residents above the money-making plans of a group of club promoters who didn’t seem to care what trouble they cause ordinary people living alongside them.

And reader comment:

It's a bit of a shame becuase it seems many people had a lot of fun in that club.

There has been a pub in that location for more than 125 years, whereas the flats nearby were built recently - they knew where they were buying!

We love Brixton Hill: People power closes Telegraph 'rave club'

 

[Rushy]

Eh (to the comment)? No one was complaining about the 125 year old pub use. They were complaining about it carrying on as a nightclub until 6am.

Had some fun nights in there. But it suffered from being a bit too large and needed a big crowd not to feel very empty, as I recall.

 

[299 old timer]

From my rather vague memory there were complaints by local residents about the noise going back to the 1970s. The landlord kept this Alsatian on the roof that used to bark at all hours of the day and night