Brexit or Bremain - Urban votes

[Puddy_Tat]

So how does that translate to a remain?

only as a vote against the 'even more crap' option

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Electoral dynamics show us that the most usual outcome of a change of leader of a governing party part-way through a term (Cameron's resignation will happen if "leave" wins) is that the electorate give the new leader the benefit of the doubt, even if the wider party has been shafting the electorate left, right and centre. AFAICR, the only time this hasn't happened in the 20th and 21st centuries, is when Brown took over from Blair, and that was at least partially due to several years of monstering of Brown by the media.

Callaghan too.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

Callaghan too.

and Douglas-Home

 

[littlebabyjesus]

and Douglas-Home

And Major only scraped in.

What there is, though, is plenty of precedent for changing leader and not calling an early election. Quite the reverse with Callaghan, Major and Brown - they clung on in there to the full term even before there were fixed terms.

 

[Puddy_Tat]

And Major only scraped in.

as much (i think) to his surprise as everyone else's...

 

[Dogsauce]

Doesn't the parliament Act basically mean they don't have the ability to call a snap election? Or can it be repealed?

Conjecture: Any post-Brexit election is likely to have a strong UKIP showing, since they will be keen to dictate the terms of the UK exit, and any sign of feet being dragged on 'shutting the door' to immigration (which businesses will oppose) will be highlighted in a campaign strategy. If there isn't an election until 2020 then there will be plenty for UKIP to get cross about as the EU extraction process may not have got that far by then, and they could claim 'the public' aren't getting what they asked for.

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

Corbyn missed a trick in pretending to be a remainist. He should have stuck to his old beliefs and won back a few of the Labour voters that have abandoned them for UKIP.

 

[DotCommunist]

Corbyn missed a trick in pretending to be a remainist. He should have stuck to his old beliefs and won back a few of the Labour voters that have abandoned them for UKIP.

it was decided at the party conference and he's said he wants to be a consensus leader. After all his unity and compromise building stuff it would look well shit if he just trampled over the will of the wider party, the one that elected him

would make him look a massive bullshitter

 

[two sheds]

Still a shame though - we could have had the headlines 'Stalinist corbyn shows true colours'

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

Corbout!

 

[Ax^]

Hmm so the day is upon us..

tbf wales, north Ireland and Scottish voters should really vote to remain in EU

so you want English independence

how about a No to that

 

[redsquirrel]

Absolute twaddle, danny la rogue and steeplejack have already demolished the Scotland point. Wales, while on average more remain than England, is still very much split. Even if it wasn't there's no basis for saying that independence is anything but a select minority position in Wales.

The three Wales EU Ref polls this year (all YouGov)
Date Remain Leave
30 May – 2 June 2016 41% 41%
7–11 April 2016 38% 39%
9–11 February 2016 37% 45%

 

[Ax^]

I just think that line at the end of Boris sign off to the debate thing was the wankiest thing I've heard in ages

"lets make this Our independence day"

oh do fuck off

 

[Wilhelmina.Trav]

I fear for the UK if we leave. It's enough we have the Torries in power..... It's going to be a sad day if we leave......

Evey

 

[Ax^]

just listen to the 10 seconds of that


Oh Fuck off, you Big Lamp



*shakes fist at sky*

 

[realitybites]

Whatever you vote, whether a vote to leave or to remain,
do you think this choice is generally indicative of your overall state of happiness & contentedness ?

 

[two sheds]

yes

 

[not-bono-ever]

...

 

[weltweit]

Whatever you vote, whether a vote to leave or to remain,
do you think this choice is generally indicative of your overall state of happiness & contentedness ?

No happiness I don't think is an issue. I voted remain, among other reasons, because more and more people in my personal life and my work life are continental Europeans and I personally feel more and more European as the years go by, and I think this is a good thing for me and for the country.

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

I can't wait for this day to be over.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

No happiness I don't think is an issue. I voted remain, among other reasons, because more and more people in my personal life and my work life are continental Europeans and I personally feel more and more European as the years go by, and I think this is a good thing for me and for the country.

If there is a vote to leave the EU none of us will stop being European!

With my head in my hands - Louis MacNeice

 

[bi0boy]

I can't wait for this day to be over.

Well you'll have to.

 

[YouSir]

No happiness I don't think is an issue. I voted remain, among other reasons, because more and more people in my personal life and my work life are continental Europeans and I personally feel more and more European as the years go by, and I think this is a good thing for me and for the country.

Are you under impression that they'll be towing the country away if we vote Leave? Parking it by North America or something? We'll still be European.

Although with that said if they could park us somewhere in the Caribbean that'd be good.

 

[ItWillNeverWork]

Well you'll have to.

Bloody EU and it's linearity-of-time regulations!

 

[weltweit]

If there is a vote to leave the EU none of us will stop being European!

With my head in my hands - Louis MacNeice

You are quite right "EU" and "European" are not the same thing.

And anyhow it isn't my main reason for voting remain, I have many reasons, but I don't feel this issue about EU inward migration that many in the right wing leave campaign have been attempting to scare us with.

Are you under impression that they'll be towing the country away if we vote Leave? Parking it by North America or something? We'll still be European.

Although with that said if they could park us somewhere in the Caribbean that'd be good.

Gillian Duffy (that woman who had a part in Gordon Brown's downfall) said on the BBC website "I don't want to be European!" I think, sadly, despite your and Louis MacNeice's correct protestations, a lot of leave voters have been / will be voting with that thought in mind.

 

[realitybites]

No happiness I don't think is an issue. I voted remain, among other reasons, because more and more people in my personal life and my work life are continental Europeans and I personally feel more and more European as the years go by, and I think this is a good thing for me and for the country.

I'm not sure.. Don't you ever just find there are times when you just get out of the wrong side of bed?
And do you never just think what could happen when a huge slice of the UK population are getting out of the wrong side of bed night after night
and whatever they vote on has nothing to do with what the referendum is really touting but is more to do with something tacit and personal.
'

 

[weltweit]

I'm not sure.. Don't you ever just find there are times when you just get out of the wrong side of bed?
And do you never just think what could happen when a huge slice of the UK population are getting out of the wrong side of bed night after night
and whatever they vote on has nothing to do with what the referendum is really touting but is more to do with something tacit and personal.
'

I was discussing the debate recently with a Leave voter who was of the opinion that our parents generation would have voted leave. Initially, because they went through WWII to keep Britain free I thought that might be true, but the more I think about it I concluded that I could have persuaded many of them to welcome more European cooperation, more working together, less isolationism, and ultimately less war.

 

[Louis MacNeice]

I was discussing the debate recently with a Leave voter who was of the opinion that our parents generation would have voted leave. Initially, because they went through WWII to keep Britain free I thought that might be true, but the more I think about it I concluded that I could have persuaded many of them to welcome more European cooperation, more working together, less isolationism, and ultimately less war.

Whoa there! You're at it again the EU and Europe are not the same thing. We can be out of the EU (and against the EU's fortress Europe) without being go it alone isolationist war mongers.

Louis MacNeice

 

[butchersapron]

I was discussing the debate recently with a Leave voter who was of the opinion that our parents generation would have voted leave. Initially, because they went through WWII to keep Britain free I thought that might be true, but the more I think about it I concluded that I could have persuaded many of them to welcome more European cooperation, more working together, less isolationism, and ultimately less war.

Yes, with your noted powers of persuasion. Leaving aside the absurd conflations and question begging of the rest of the post.

 

[brogdale]

Just in case any of you need any further help making up your mind....this is flying from the garden of Tom Brake's garden in 'sought after' South Wallington...