Windows 7 yea or nay?

[ExtraRefined]

I bought a low end laptop with Vista preinstalled, and it runs like an absolute dog.

From boot, it takes about 15 minutes to stabilise and become usable. I tend to get it started, then use my iPhone until it's stopped thrashing.

Have you removed all the shite cheap laptops inevitably come installed with? Autoruns is helpful here. It's true that vista on 1GB is not ideal though.

Another consideration for 7 v XP is that XP is going out of support in 4 years - if you are still using it then you will absolutely have to reinstall at that point due the the lack of security updates from then on. It's also possible that an unpatchable flaw will be discovered before 2014, as has happened with NT4 and 2k.

 

[Throbbing Angel]

I really like W7, much prefer it to XP. Never used Vista but decided on 7 after reading about battery life enhancements/power usage.

on a netbook though? probably better of with Xp or linux dess

I suppose it depends what you use the netbook for mainly - if browsing, linux

Oh, if you do go for 7, make sure that if you need XP software compatibility you buy something higher up the chain than Home Premium
I now have some stuff that I can't use because I wasnae aware of this issue - assumed backwards comp. was standard these days with Windows, main issue for me is Palm sync software which I used for my PDA and Alphasmart Dana

you can work around it with VMware by installing an older OS into a virtual machine but is a bit of a faff, but free

 

[keybored]

Another consideration for 7 v XP is that XP is going out of support in 4 years - if you are still using it then you will absolutely have to reinstall at that point due the the lack of security updates from then on. It's also possible that an unpatchable flaw will be discovered before 2014, as has happened with NT4 and 2k.

I think it's testament to what a great OS (as Windows goes) XP is that MS had to extend support for another 4 years. Either that or they finally realised what a fucking dog Vista is (they'll be admitting it was "a mistake", the same as they did with ME).

Windows XP does not come with SATA drivers unless you hack the disk to include them. You need to press F8 in the install sequence and have them on a floppy disk and a floppy is all XP will read them in from, no usb stick. Who has a floppy drive these days?

Of course it does, just less of them on older releases (without service packs). The laptop I'm posting from is SATA, the PC I can see over there is SATA. I installed XP SP2 on both myself (laptop came with Vista which I formatted out of the box, PC came with no OS). No 3rd party drivers or hacking required. XP still mightn't recognise the SATA controllers on some older motherboards which is what I assume Bob meant.

As for your defending Vista, you must be trolling.

 

[Idaho]

Can I get Win 7 for free on account of Vista being so shit?

I didn't mind Vista, until I actually tried to do some technical things.

 

[Xanadu]

On my desktop bought two and a bit years ago, I didn't need to install any SATA drivers for Windows XP. I think my BIOS has some special compatibility modes though.

 

[Bob_the_lost]

Windows XP does not come with SATA drivers unless you hack the disk to include them. You need to press F8 in the install sequence and have them on a floppy disk and a floppy is all XP will read them in from, no usb stick. Who has a floppy drive these days?

As keybored points out most motherboards have SATA driver support as standard. There was a period while SATA was being phased in that some motherboards didn't support it natively, despite having the connectors, when you did have to use a floppy to install the OS. For the record I didn't have a floppy drive that worked even then. It was a relatively short lived bug / problem and restricted to a fraction of the market for ~6 months.

W7 might have fixed that problem too so it can be installed on old hardware that doesn't have the drivers but I'd be slightly surprised if it had since it's a BIOS problem.

 

[Meltingpot]

Can I get Win 7 for free on account of Vista being so shit?

I think the least Microsoft should have done is offer Windows 7 free to people who had a Vista licence.

 

[grit]

I think the least Microsoft should have done is offer Windows 7 free to people who had a Vista licence.

Lets not go nuts

Vista after a service pack or two actually turned out ok. People have short memories it was the exact same situation when XP released.

E2A: It always seems that people discount just what a fucking huge task it is to build an OS.

 

[Pingu]

another yes here.

have been using windows 7 for a while and its faster and more stable than vista. on my laptop batterylife has dipped but other than that again no problems.

runs soundly and does everything i want it to .. which tbh is pretty much all i want from an O/S

my solaris machine is faster and just as stable but then its not as user friendly, has less device support and wont play my games.. it fucking rocks at running my dbms stuff though

 

[Sunray]

I think it's testament to what a great OS (as Windows goes) XP is that MS had to extend support for another 4 years. Either that or they finally realised what a fucking dog Vista is (they'll be admitting it was "a mistake", the same as they did with ME).



Of course it does, just less of them on older releases (without service packs). The laptop I'm posting from is SATA, the PC I can see over there is SATA. I installed XP SP2 on both myself (laptop came with Vista which I formatted out of the box, PC came with no OS). No 3rd party drivers or hacking required. XP still mightn't recognise the SATA controllers on some older motherboards which is what I assume Bob meant.

As for your defending Vista, you must be trolling.

Ahh what you have done is switched your oldie worldy SATA controller to IDE mode in the BIOS, which works fine on XP. XP out of the box, does not come with standard SATA drivers. Vista does.

Otherwise why have people made these websites

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Install-Windows-XP-On-SATA-Without-a-Floppy-F6-47807.shtml

And can someone tell me what is wrong with Vista. I found it nothing but a nice improvement to XP. I really couldn't see what people were moaning about apart from the slow network issue which they fixed in SP1.

 

[Bob_the_lost]

Ahh what you have done is switched your oldie worldy SATA controller to IDE mode in the BIOS, which works fine on XP. XP out of the box, does not come with standard SATA drivers. Vista does.

Otherwise why have people made these websites

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Install-Windows-XP-On-SATA-Without-a-Floppy-F6-47807.shtml

And can someone tell me what is wrong with Vista. I found it nothing but a nice improvement to XP. I really couldn't see what people were moaning about apart from the slow network issue which they fixed in SP1.

And the slow HD copy process and the high performance demand and the bugs and the UAC implementation...

 

[existentialist]

The basic rule is this. NEVER install an MS operating system until Service Pack 2 has come out.

That rule has held me in pretty good stead since about 1995

 

[keybored]

Ahh what you have done is switched your oldie worldy SATA controller to IDE mode in the BIOS...

No, I never. There was never any need to.

Otherwise why have people made these websites

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Install-Windows-XP-On-SATA-Without-a-Floppy-F6-47807.shtml

If you read even the first few paragraphs of your own link properly:

SATA hard drives have become more and more appreciated tending to substitute the IDE drives due to the increasing speed they offer. Motherboard manufacturers started to implement the new standard years ago, when the technology was young and expensive. Now, as the SATA HDD prices have lowered to a level where anybody can afford to choose a SATA enabled HDD instead of an IDE one, a great migration has been observed among the common computer users.

They choose to install Windows and applications on SATA drives because they provide more speed which determines the system to run smoother. Thus, for those owning older mainboards with SATA support an extra step is required while attempting to install Windows XP. Windows XP does not provide drivers for *all* the SATA controllers, therefore, during the installation procedure, the user must insert a floppy with the drivers that came in the package along with the motherboard.

Not a big deal, not much effort, but the funny thing is that a great number of people passed on their floppy drives. Under these circumstances, no floppy means the impossibility to install Windows XP on SATA (on some mainboards).

 

[souljacker]

People saying "it's brilliant" might also want to say similar.

OK, AMD dual core 64 bit with 2gb memory and Redon 4790 GPU running 64 bit ultimate edition.

Works an absolute treat. Looks lovely and works perfectly (except for my aforementioned games issue, which was firewall related and now fixed).

I particularly like the action centre. It tells me what issues need sorting without bitching at me or making the PC unusable until I've dealt with it. I like the new explorer with the libraries (although thats a vista thing isn't it?). I also like the search facility.

I rate it rather highly, thanks.

 

[jontz01]

If you read even the first few paragraphs of your own link properly:

Under these circumstances, no floppy means the impossibility to install Windows XP on SATA (on some mainboards).

It's by no means impossible, you just need to build an xp disk with the SATA drivers included. While you're doing this it's also a bonus to be able to include all the service packs to the ISO build. It's entirely possible, I did it last night while working on an Acer Aspire 5315. I think this was also mentioned by Sunray in a previous post.

 

[dessiato]

dessiato - You might want to say what spec (memory & CPU) your netbook is.

People saying "it's brilliant" might also want to say similar.

That way it's possible some the advice might be relevant to your hardware

Good point. The netbook is a Packard Bell Dot using an Intel Atom processor, 1GB memory, and 160GB hard drive. There is no CD/DVD drive from which to load any software.

 

[EastEnder]

Good point. The netbook is a Packard Bell Dot using an Intel Atom processor, 1GB memory, and 160GB hard drive. There is no CD/DVD drive from which to load any software.

A USB CD/DVD drive is invaluable in such circumstances.

 

[keybored]

It's by no means impossible, you just need to build an xp disk with the SATA drivers included. While you're doing this it's also a bonus to be able to include all the service packs to the ISO build. It's entirely possible, I did it last night while working on an Acer Aspire 5315. I think this was also mentioned by Sunray in a previous post.

I know, you're not reading the posts Like it says in the link, it's only on some older mainboards you'll have to faff around with slipstreaming, or if you are using an old XP install CD. The ones I used included SP2 so there were no problems for the machines I installed them on.
There were issues with SATA drivers when XP was first released, these were addressed. The only time it'll be an issue now is with a handful of motherboards and unless you have no access to a floppy drive or another machine to rebuild an install CD, you can get round it.

 

[jontz01]

ok fair enough...

 

[oicur0t]

I've got it running on 1gb quite happily on one install and also whacked it on an old HP laptop (spec unknown). Both installed without a hitch, even in a custom build. It even used wireless drivers for a usb dongle, that were not available from the manufacturer.

I won't say I think it offers anything over any other version of windows except that it's snappier, easier to use and works better. Which may sound like a lot, but makes you think, 'why didn't Vista work?'

 

[EastEnder]

I won't say I think it offers anything over any other version of windows except that it's snappier, easier to use and works better. Which may sound like a lot, but makes you think, 'why didn't Vista work?'

Vista didn't work because MS forgot to ask "the people". If only they'd consulted extensively with primary school children & housewives, Vista would've been perfect.

 

[ovaltina]

A USB CD/DVD drive is invaluable in such circumstances.

It's possible to install it from a USB flash drive too, that's what I did. There's a programme you can download for free that makes it v easy (can't find it now but a bit of googling should bring it up).

eta: here it is: http://maketecheasier.com/updated-boot-and-install-windows-7-from-usb-flash-drive/2009/09/12

 

[stupid dogbot]

I'm just having my first real proper play with 7, on a work laptop.

And I really like it.

 

[Private Storm]

It's possible to install it from a USB flash drive too, that's what I did. There's a programme you can download for free that makes it v easy (can't find it now but a bit of googling should bring it up).

Installed it last night from a flash drive, very simple. Remember to unplug the drive after 1st reboot otherwise you'll be stuck in a never ending loop of installing

 

[Sunray]

I know, you're not reading the posts Like it says in the link, it's only on some older mainboards you'll have to faff around with slipstreaming, or if you are using an old XP install CD. The ones I used included SP2 so there were no problems for the machines I installed them on.
There were issues with SATA drivers when XP was first released, these were addressed. The only time it'll be an issue now is with a handful of motherboards and unless you have no access to a floppy drive or another machine to rebuild an install CD, you can get round it.

This works as you have your motherboard set to legacy (IDE) mode for the SATA controller.

I have my SATA controller set to AHCI (Full SATA mode) to improve performance. I know for certain that XP has never had support for AHCI unless you install the correct AHCI drivers for the SATA controller. This is one of the reasons you should go to Vista/Window 7 as that has much better AHCI support, you will need ACHI drivers installed for TRIM support on SSD's. ACHI is especially useful for laptops as it enables finer grain power management.

http://komku.blogspot.com/2007/10/why-ahci.html

 

[Cloud]

Windows XP does not come with SATA drivers unless you hack the disk to include them. You need to press F8 in the install sequence and have them on a floppy disk and a floppy is all XP will read them in from, no usb stick. Who has a floppy drive these days?

The bios on most motherboards from the last two years support SATA so it's not a problem. It's exactly the same as an install using an IDE.

 

[Jambooboo]

Good point. The netbook is a Packard Bell Dot using an Intel Atom processor, 1GB memory, and 160GB hard drive. There is no CD/DVD drive from which to load any software.

I've stuck Windows 7 on a similary specced Acer Aspire One; it's certainly no slower than when I had XP on it - if anything it's a bit snappier.

Were it not for that I picked up a few copies of Windows 7 on pre-release for about £40, then I doubt I'd stuck a copy on my netbook though.

 

[grit]

I didnt know how much I wanted to get rid of XP until I installed 7. Its wonderful I even ended up buying a license out of my own pocket for one of my work machines.

 

[Riklet]

I'm still on Vista, and definitely planning on upgrading in the next month, I do like Vista, and think the criticisms levelled at it are a bit OTT really, once tweeked it works rather smoothly for me... still, why not have the benefits of W7 without the hardware draining bloatage of Vista. I definitely find I don't get amazing gaming performance on my laptop (certainly not a gaming one) cos Vista is busy sucky sucking resources away in the background

Is there still a free trial of W7 then? I think the stuuuudent deal for £30 is over now, but shall try and get W7 on the cheap/free anyway, so just need to decide between Ultimate and Pro n find somewhere that isn't requiring me to sell organs in order to get it. I don't think i've ever (directly) paid for an OS, so as a first, it better be worth it!

 

[grit]

It may have been released nearly 10 years ago, but XP/SP3 is closer (under the surface) to Win7 than it is to original XP.

Eh got any links to back that up?