Support the French Rioters!

[pidgeonhead]

are you thick or something?

the vast majority of the people who have been rioting are FRENCH, born in FRANCE. but, no, for you, by the sounds of things, they're IMMIGRANTS, doubtless because of the colour of their skin. didn't have to scratch very hard to find some unpleasant undercurrents in yr thought.

I think you understood my point very well indeed, and trying to pin some kind of racist issue on me is a little sad, don't you think?

After all, I have clearly had more association with the boer than you have.

The "vast majority" were NOT born in France, a great many of them were born in North Africa. I would estimate around half were born outside France.

In your world, does merely mentioning Africa really make me a racist?

Because, and please check my posts, I don't recall using the word immigrant, nor did I refer to the colour of anyone's skin.

Are you sure you want to continue this line of questioning?

Because I assure you, you will find no evidence of racism here.

Perhaps you're just mad because you know I'm right.

 

[Pickman's model]

I think you understood my point very well indeed, and trying to pin some kind of racist issue on me is a little sad, don't you think?

After all, I have clearly had more association with the boer than you have.

The "vast majority" were NOT born in France, a great many of them were born in North Africa. I would estimate around half were born outside France.

In your world, does merely mentioning Africa really make me a racist?

Because, and please check my posts, I don't recall using the word immigrant, nor did I refer to the colour of anyone's skin.

Are you sure you want to continue this line of questioning?

Because I assure you, you will find no evidence of racism here.

Perhaps you're just mad because you know I'm right.

where do you get your figures from? because i think they're bollocks. and just what did you mean by

they're used to trading one oppressive regime with another,

?

 

[Pickman's model]

Because, and please check my posts, I don't recall using the word immigrant, nor did I refer to the colour of anyone's skin.

i never said you did say immigrant. it was very fucking clear what you meant, that the vast majority of those rioting were immigrants: which is just what has been pushed by the bbc, among others. now you say that half of the people rioting were immigrants - are the other half, then, used to changing one oppressive regime for another?

 

[sihhi]

I would estimate around half were born outside France.

What d'you base this on?

 

[Pickman's model]

What d'you base this on?

guesswork from the ouija board.

 

[Pickman's model]

pidgeonhead

i don't see how you can argue i've got the wrong end of the stick. to my mind there's no other complexion to y'r post than the one i put on it. it's perfectly clear what you meant - more's the pity - as many of y'r other posts have been thought-provoking in a banal sort of way.

 

[Sorry.]

None of them ever have or ever will have anything to do with anarchism, mainly because they are from religious communities. etc.

I'll only quote this bit, because the rest was mostly repetition.

As an anarchist, I am happy to organise with the religious, and in fact have done in the past. Most anarchists I know would also be happy to organise with the religious.

I hope this clears up any confusion/ignorance on your part, and you can go on to a productive member of this electronic community, without making further asinine remarks.

Thankyou.

 

[Taxamo Welf]

pickmans pls pls don't bother, the fact that we do reflects badly on us
If a tory comes on line and has genuine questions, if a nazi comes on line even - but twats that think they know it all already and keep repeating themselves are not worth the bother

 

[Pickman's model]

i won't, then.

 

[undesirable]

Quote:that the vast majority of those rioting were immigrants: which is just what has been pushed by the bbc, among others.Quote

Nah it appears that most news channels have gone as far as to say that the rioters are all muslims, and not just your average muslim but muslim extremists!! This is pretty audacious. I dont doubt that muslims were involved in the rioting but its not someones faith which dictates whether they rioted or not but rather the conditions of their existence. If theres a riot in Italy is it a Catholic riot, instigated by catholic fanatics?! Ive never gone for the whole 'its a war on islam' thing, and still dont as its foundationless tripe, but some of the stuff thats been reported on these riots, particularly newsnight has been absolutely, unbelievable bollocks.

 

[Clintons Cat]

If the rioting continues, and the French army is sent in, I've no doubt that people will be shot, and that those arrested will be tortured and banged up for lengthy sentences. I think that a picket of the French embassy is a very good way to show that the eyes of the world are on France.

Remember what happened to an earlier generation of Algerian protestors during the 1950/60s in France? Beaten, tortured and disappeared. A peaceful protest is one way we can try to stop the French state doing this again.

yeah,i was kind of puzzled that given the interior ministers comments seem to harken back to that period,that there has been little mention of that in the press,most of the commentators have been ignoring that murky part of frances past altogether,prefering instead to make superficial comparisons and contrasts between british style multi-cultralism and french style notations of egalitarianism.

How one can draw meaningful comparisons between the two political systems/ideologies w/r race relations without examining the practical implementation of those policies and an examination of how in 1961 the police,government,judiciary and media conspired to prevent those responsible for being held to account for their actions is beyond me.

 

[sihhi]

Still continuing

Lyon Saturday early evening

Police fired tear gas at rioters who were throwing rocks and bins. The rioting began in the Place Bellecour where riot police had gathered to prevent exactly this kind of disturbance.

http://www.dehavilland.co.uk/webhos...D=15089225&ServiceID=8&filterid=10&searchid=8

 

[butchersapron]

Does everyone know that this PH is PK? I've been away for the week and may have missed this.

 

[sihhi]

Place Bellecour is the historic tourist centre of Lyon.
http://www.virtourist.com/europe/lyon/25.htm

French security forces fired tear gas to disperse youths in Lyon on Saturday in the first sign of unrest in a city centre after more than two weeks of civil disturbances in outlying suburbs of towns and cities.

Ten people were arrested in France's second city after 50 youths attacked stalls and damaged vehicles, police and witnesses said, adding that the situation later calmed down.

After violence rose slightly on Friday, the 16th night of clashes, regional authorities for the first time declared a curfew for minors in Lyon, a city of 1.2 million southeast of Paris.

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/new...7Z_01_YUE042397_RTRUKOC_0_UK-FRANCE-RIOTS.xml

 

[butchersapron]

Keep 'em coming please sihhi (or any other posters who spot anything of interest).

 

[In Bloom]

Riots have broken out in Lyon as protestors clash with the police in the city centre after a curfew was introduced.

Hmm, the implication here seems a lot more overtly political. Does anybody know if events in Lyon were called by any particular political group?

 

[soulman]

Probably old news for some but the renacted 'state of emergency' law was used to ban all public meetings in the Paris area tonight.

 

[sihhi]

Keep 'em coming please sihhi (or any other posters who spot anything of interest).

My mostly self-taught (ie not very good) French tells me that there's some kind of police work-to-rule in Seine-Saint-Denis (a region of Paris) called by police trade union "Allaince 93" in protest against the fact that 5 of their number were suspended for their actions on 7th November in the La Corneuve estate-suburb.

http://permanent.nouvelobs.com/societe/20051112.OBS4954.html

 

[pidgeonhead]

As an anarchist, I am happy to organise with the religious, and in fact have done in the past. Most anarchists I know would also be happy to organise with the religious.

Except the ones who oppose religion.

Or do they just hide the fact that they oppose the people they're trying to organise?

Not that these riots are motivated by religion, but the fact that anarchists seem desperate to stick their black and red flags over anything that appears to be public disorder should set alarm bells ringing among the people actually doing the rioting.

The last thing these kids want is a little bunch of supposedly working class cyber-anarchist dreamers trying to hijack their cause, I'd imagine!

 

[General Ludd]

Except the ones who oppose religion.

It's quite possible to work with people with whom you don't agree completely on everything.

 

[lostexpectation]

Sarkozy heckled

Sarkozy was booed, heckled and near jostled as he inspected police barricades in central Paris

I coudln't find anynews reports apart from " a woman heckled him telling him to resign".

They've placed parents of pre-teens arrested on watch and sent them on parenting courses.

http://translate.google.com/transla...fe=off&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools
Tf1 is a half decent place to view one source of many.


There must be more attampts to quell the disturbances by non-police anyone got stories on them.

 

[888]

Does everyone know that this PH is PK? I've been away for the week and may have missed this.

Really? He seems slightly too intelligent for PK, though I note the same weird hysteria against anarchists.

 

[Taxamo Welf]

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blahblah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

You have earned yourself a place back on ignore my dove!
Pickmans, and everyone else making decent arguments against this big silly - i suggest you do the same

 

[rednblack]

Really? He seems slightly too intelligent for PK, though I note the same weird hysteria against anarchists.

typical cowardice on his part though

 

[In Bloom]

Except the ones who oppose religion.

Or do they just hide the fact that they oppose the people they're trying to organise?

Opposing an idea and opposing the person holding that idea are two completely different things. Though I suspect you already knew that.

Similarly, seeking to organise with somebody and act in solidarity with them is completely different from trying to organise them as though they're some passive tool to be manipulated into fulfilling ones own ends.

 

[soulman]

Press release from the Mouvement Immigrante de Banlieues (MIB) - http://www.urban75.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=3807904#post3807904

 

[In Bloom]

On a side note, I can't see any reference to the actual event referred to in the OP after it actually happened, how did it go?

 

[JHE]

There were a few reports earlier. See, for example, posts 358 and 366.

It seems it was a bit of a non-event, with only about a dozen people turning up to show their solidarity with the rioters in France. They were met by a larger number of plod.

I'm glad they didn't burn any schools, clinics, workers' cars or people.

 

[Taxamo Welf]

those as herbert would say, it would have been 'more interesting' if they had.

 

[montevideo]

I'm glad they didn't burn any schools, clinics, workers' cars or people.

just as a matter of interest several people have emphasised buring workers cars is a bad thing. I'm assuming from this burning rich peoples/bosses cars would be an valid form of riot expression?