Spanish Political News
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Favelado
J'adore South Shore
PSOE looking for an anti-PP pact. Things may be moving a bit. Howeverm, they don't want to bend on a Catalan referendum because it's "unconstitutional". It's being referred to as a "Portuguese" pact.
So it's down to who's willing to bend, Iglesias or Sánchez. Errejon's just been on telly (must have finished his homework and been allowed out) to say Podemos "don't rule out any type of deal" but I think it would be against Podemos's best interests to give ground to PSOE on a referendum.
PP are pissed off though, so a good day all in all.
So it's down to who's willing to bend, Iglesias or Sánchez. Errejon's just been on telly (must have finished his homework and been allowed out) to say Podemos "don't rule out any type of deal" but I think it would be against Podemos's best interests to give ground to PSOE on a referendum.
PP are pissed off though, so a good day all in all.
JHE
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It's very difficult to see how an anti-PP government can be put together.
1. Ciudadanos and Podemos seem incompatible:
Ciudadanos have said that, because of differences over economic policy, they could not abstain if Podemos is part of the deal. In other words, they'll vote against the installation a government based on a PSOE-Podemos deal.
2. The question of a Catalan referendum is a major stumbling block in the way of a PSOE-Podemos deal:
Both Sánchez and his alleged rival for the leadership of PSOE, Díaz, the President of Andalucia, seem adamantly opposed to a Catalan referendum. Their refusal to accept the Catalan right to self-determination, and by implication the right of any other peoples within Spain (notably the Basques), is a sticking point. Iglesias has indicated that agreeing to a referendum is a condition of doing a deal and even if he were inclined to put that policy on hold (which I doubt), I don't think he would be able to. Podemos votes and MPs come disproportionately from Catalonia, Galicia, Valencia and the Basque Country. In Catalonia, Galicia and Valencia Podemos stood not exactly as Podemos but as part of alliances which include people for whom the right to national self-determination is crucial. In the Basque Country, where Podemos came first in votes, they got lots of those votes from people who might otherwise have voted for the (now peaceful) radical Basque Nats. These people can't easily park the question of a Catalan referendum without accusations of being traitors.
1. Ciudadanos and Podemos seem incompatible:
Ciudadanos have said that, because of differences over economic policy, they could not abstain if Podemos is part of the deal. In other words, they'll vote against the installation a government based on a PSOE-Podemos deal.
2. The question of a Catalan referendum is a major stumbling block in the way of a PSOE-Podemos deal:
Both Sánchez and his alleged rival for the leadership of PSOE, Díaz, the President of Andalucia, seem adamantly opposed to a Catalan referendum. Their refusal to accept the Catalan right to self-determination, and by implication the right of any other peoples within Spain (notably the Basques), is a sticking point. Iglesias has indicated that agreeing to a referendum is a condition of doing a deal and even if he were inclined to put that policy on hold (which I doubt), I don't think he would be able to. Podemos votes and MPs come disproportionately from Catalonia, Galicia, Valencia and the Basque Country. In Catalonia, Galicia and Valencia Podemos stood not exactly as Podemos but as part of alliances which include people for whom the right to national self-determination is crucial. In the Basque Country, where Podemos came first in votes, they got lots of those votes from people who might otherwise have voted for the (now peaceful) radical Basque Nats. These people can't easily park the question of a Catalan referendum without accusations of being traitors.
What does evidence, good reason or actually happening have to do with it?
J Ed
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So it turns out the re-hashing of the anti-Podemos smear that the party is funded by Iran is politically-motivated nonsense. Very interesting that in the denials Iglesias calls the Iranian government a wretched regime. You don't get that sort of moral clarity from your Livingstones or your Galloways or even your Corbyns.
J Ed
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I thought that this response he made in 2014 to nasty comments about his decision to go on RT and to continue his programme Fort Apache after it was sold to HispanTV (the Spanish-language equivalent of PressTV) was pretty good. He compares it to Bolshevik cooperation with Germany during WW1. He even goes on to say that he does not approve of the fact that on HispanTV the female presenters have to wear hijab. I think that this is miles better than the sort of kowtowing that parts of the UK Left do to Putin and the Iranian regime.
J Ed
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a la Portuguesa
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
It's a tough one isn't it? If the parties don't come to an agreement and more elections are needed, they all look a bit useless, which reinforces an image problem politicians already have. But if Podemos enter in government, for how much longer can they claim to be a party of change? They'll become part of the system and inevitably diluted by it. A PSOE/Podemos/IU coalition would be many times better than a PP government and we could expect the Ley Mordaza to be binned pretty quickly. Iglesias of course talked about anti-corruption measures and also spent a good amount of time on making sure that public media was free of the interference of recent years too. He said a lot of things that I really like.
I wonder if Catalans will be understanding about a referendum being dropped as they knew PSOE would never go for it, or if they'll see it as betrayal by Podemos.
I wonder if Catalans will be understanding about a referendum being dropped as they knew PSOE would never go for it, or if they'll see it as betrayal by Podemos.
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
Vicepresidente vallecano mola.
Threshers_Flail
Well-Known Member
It has to be a betrayal doesn't it? Especially as the Catalans came out strongly in support for Podemos.
It is a tricky one. There's nothing like getting into coalition with a party you recently derided as part of 'la casta' to take the wind out of your calls for change. With the world economy looking likely to tank very shortly I think it would have been better to stick to opposition for a few years and get a bit more experience and traction with the electorate.
but, why does he continue to do so anyway, working for what is basically a propaganda channel,
of course, as is all media.
J Ed
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Yeah, essentially that. The state broadcaster in Spain is even more biased in favour of the government than the BBC is for the Tories, for a very long time Iglesias couldn't really get on TV even.
J Ed
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He looks like a depressed and inexplicably right-wing geography teacher.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
The anti-Corb
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
Iglesias is very good at creating political moments and seizing the initiative. Today really had a sense of momentum about it after his press conference. It took most people unawares and within a few hours Rajoy was on the back foot, having to mumble nonsense about how he wasn't putting himself forward but also that he was. Obviously the media have been on Iglesias's back saying that he's "demanding the vice-presidency" to try and discredit him but it was a good chess move.
Riklet
procrastinación
Can Spain hope to challenge Belgium on the no-government record?
Looks pretty likely currently!
Oh btw Facist symbols, statues and street names are being got rid of currently in Madrid. Calle de los Caidos de la división azul looks like it will soon be joining Waffen SS Strasse in a bin or facist's personal collection.
Looks pretty likely currently!
Oh btw Facist symbols, statues and street names are being got rid of currently in Madrid. Calle de los Caidos de la división azul looks like it will soon be joining Waffen SS Strasse in a bin or facist's personal collection.
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J Ed
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PSOE have presented a programme that looks like it is specifically designed to attract the left into coalition
Pedro Sánchez presenta un programa de Gobierno con un claro guiño a la izquierda
It includes bolstering welfare including payments of between 50 and 150 euros per child to families which earn less than 17,000 euros a month, new negotiations with Brussels over national debt payments, the legalisation of euthanasia, measures to end the revolving door between politics and big business, electoral reform, a jobs programme and liberalisation of abortion law.
Pedro Sánchez presenta un programa de Gobierno con un claro guiño a la izquierda
It includes bolstering welfare including payments of between 50 and 150 euros per child to families which earn less than 17,000 euros a month, new negotiations with Brussels over national debt payments, the legalisation of euthanasia, measures to end the revolving door between politics and big business, electoral reform, a jobs programme and liberalisation of abortion law.
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
The Spanish Thatcher has resigned. Not personally owning up to the corruption she is almost definitely guilty of, but "taking responsibility" for it. Aguirre is vile and this is great news.
Aguirre dimite y aumenta la presión sobre Rajoy por la corrupción
Aguirre dimite y aumenta la presión sobre Rajoy por la corrupción
JHE
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According to Aguirre, she sent Rajoy a message telling him she had decided to resign and he responded by saying he understood. Has he? It seems to me there's a v clear message in her resignation. If the President of PP Madrid should take responsibility for corruption in PP Madrid and resign, the President of PP nationally should...
Praps he understands, but takes a different view.
Praps he understands, but takes a different view.
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