skiving little fucker

[poster342002]

She has consistently fought for the interests of the membership and involved herself in high profile campaigns-as well as forcing through high profile motions for debates within the union at a national level.

So how does becoming one of the bosses advance any of the above cause, then?

That's what makes me sick about the left in Britain today: it seems nigh-on saturated with bosses. The very people who's job it is to make working class people's life a pain in the arse.

 

[poster342002]

Oh, dear, it's the "equality of outcome" rather than "equality of opportunity" argument

Give me the justice of Equality of Outcome over the sick joke that is the Equality of Opportunity to climb the ladder and stand on someone else anyday.

 

[Jografer]

I'm not going into a derail abotu what a post-capitalist socuiety (fat chance of getting near one with today's attitudes), but in the meantime peopel don't have to go out of their way to help the system beyond what they have to do just to keep afloat.

... no, of course not...

 

[Jografer]

Doesn't stop them getting on a twisted little power-trip and creating untold misery for the person working for them, though.

... what, all of them.....

 

[Donna Ferentes]

When I've seen enough instances of those "partial ways" actually having no effect at all, how can you blame me?

Because other people do find they have an effect. And because if you have nothing constructive to suggest yourself then it's pitiful to blame other people for trying something else. You're always condemning other people but offering nothing yourself. What do you think that looks like from outside? Do you think people say "well thank you sir for your wisdom, do you have anything to add"?

 

[Jografer]

If you've read ANY of my posts elsewhere, you'd know I certainly was no swappie-supporter ...

... no, you certianly are one of a kind... not of this world really....

 

[poster342002]

... what, all of them.....

Enough of them. And the ones that don't won't condemn or take action against the ones that do.

When push comes to shove when a harrassed member of staff makes a complaint they all stick together, close ranks and deny everything.

 

[Jografer]

The weird thing about Mondragón, by the way, is the period when it developed.

As with Credit Unions is Ireland, where they were created to fill a gap/provide a service, rather than to 'compete' within the capitalist system...

... I think...

 

[Donna Ferentes]

You'd like to know, though, wouldn't you? What did Franco have to say?

 

[poster342002]

... no, you certianly are one of a kind... not of this world really....

Try speaking to a few more at the bottom of the pile - you'll find I'm far from alone. A common refrain (which I actually heard from a shop worker a few months ago) is that the managers "think they own you".

There is a deep, slowburning, seething resentment amongst those of us under the boot of the bosses. At the moment we're all isolated, atomised adn withotu any union - but one day that may change.

 

[Jografer]

Unfortunately, most workplaces simply don't care about losing staff. There's a large supply of people outside the door who will take the job the day after someone's left. In the scheme of things, it's small change to most large organisations - and probably considered cheaper to keep losing lower-grade, easily-replacable staff than to set about rectifying their dysfunctional organisations root-and-branch.

Interesting perspective, shame it's a load of bollocks...

Which jobs are you talking about, that can be done equally as well by some-one off the street in their first day as by somebody who has a few years training & experience.....

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Which jobs are you talking about, that can be done equally as well by some-one off the street in their first day as by somebody who has a few years training & experience.

Very few, but at the same time there's a lot of managers who act as if they could be. You often spend a lot of time trying to get the bastards to understand that you can't just cut all the corners and that certain things do need to be done.

 

[Jografer]

You'd like to know, though, wouldn't you? What did Franco have to say?

Not sure what you mean with the first bit..

I thought the Mondragon co-ops were similar in that they filled a vacuum post-civil war, & also that the RC church were heavily involved.

 

[poster342002]

Which jobs are you talking about, that can be done equally as well by some-one off the street in their first day as by somebody who has a few years training & experience.....

You're talking to the converted, so I suggest you ask those abusive employers that very question and why carrying on the way they do doesn't seem to bother them.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Not sure what you mean with the first bit.

It related to the second bit! Given that Franco shot every communist he could lay his hands on, it's really odd that he allowed co-operatives to exist. If there was one thing that irked the Francoists more than anything else, it was collectivisation.

 

[poster342002]

Given that Franco shot every communist he could lay his hands on, it's really odd that he allowed co-operatives to exist. If there was one thing that irked the Francoists more than anything else, it was collectivisation.

Perhaps like with Stalin's "collectivised farms", they weren't quite what it said on the tin?

 

[A Dashing Blade]

Give me the justice of Equality of Outcome over the sick joke that is the Equality of Opportunity to climb the ladder and stand on someone else anyday.

The sad thing is that I believe you really do believe the turgid drivel you're spouting rather than you're attempting to make some bizarre post-ironic comment on knee-jerk, reactionary left-wing views.

 

[poster342002]

The sad thing is that I believe you really do believe the turgid drivel you're spouting rather than you're attempting to make some bizarre post-ironic comment on knee-jerk, reactionary left-wing views.

I note that none of your above post actually refutes anything I said.

 

[A Dashing Blade]

You're talking to the converted, so I suggest you ask those abusive employers that very question and why carrying on the way they do doesn't seem to bother them.

Seems to me you were asked a direct (and, in the context of your comments) very relevant question which you refused to answer.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Perhaps like with Stalin's "collectivised farms", they weren't quite what it said on the tin?

Yeah but the thing is, Franco wasn't really noted for his generosity of his approach or his lack of suspicion.....

 

[A Dashing Blade]

I note that none of your above post actually refutes anything I said.

Monsieur Garf Le Chat has already done that far more eloquently than I ever could.

 

[Jografer]

It related to the second bit! Given that Franco shot every communist he could lay his hands on, it's really odd that he allowed co-operatives to exist. If there was one thing that irked the Francoists more than anything else, it was collectivisation.

I thought it was the involvement of the RC church that 'spared' them, if that's the right way to put it, but, yes, suprising...

 

[Donna Ferentes]

I thought it was the involvement of the RC church that 'spared' them, if that's the right way to put it

Quite possibly, but there were more than a few Basque priests shot during the Civil War.

 

[poster342002]

Yeah but the thing is, Franco wasn't really noted for his generosity of his approach or his lack of suspicion.....

Nor was Stalin. I suspect similar motives were at work.

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Nor was Stalin. I suspect similar motives were at work.

Oh, Gawd.

 

[Jografer]

Quite possibly, but there were more than a few Basque priests shot during the Civil War.

Hmm, that's the problem with looking for reasons why Franco didn't just send in his goons..... none of them add up totally.....

 

[Grandma Death]

So how does becoming one of the bosses advance any of the above cause, then?

Is it all people in authority you have a problem with?

The very people who's job it is to make working class people's life a pain in the arse.

Your textbook wadical replies are really fucking boring-has anyone ever told you that?

 

[GarfieldLeChat]

Your textbook wadical replies are really fucking boring-has anyone ever told you that?

dear god yes endlessly... it's like a rik stuck record...

 

[Jografer]

dear god yes endlessly... it's like a rik stuck record...

... and it's not as if it was a very good record in the first place...

 

[Donna Ferentes]

Your textbook wadical replies are really fucking boring-has anyone ever told you that?

But has anybody told you that the term "wadical" is rather more boring and just as unoriginal?