Sheffield university occupied for gaza

[Sadken]

Hang on, you were the one who posted it up to refute the claims that the students had tried to minimise disruption - no ones been daft enough to claim that there's been no disruption. You were the one who misread what it said and you were the one who cut off the bit that actually demonstrated that you were wrong and that efforts had been made to minise disruption.

Yeah, well served.

The uni is occupied - the university authorities will not put on lectures during an occupation - the students are disrupted.

Causation. Dickhead.

A show of solidarity when you have no way of affecting real change for those you are showing solidarity to is just hitching a ride on their sympathy wagon and riding it all the way to Pushing My Own Agenda Ville - the agenda here being "Aren't we brilliant and isn't everyone else crap?" We all feel bad for Palestine but we can't do anything and, even if we could, Sheffield fucking University is hardly the best place to start is it?

Like, belboid, you seem to do an awful lot of solidarity showing, you know? What good has it done anyone that you were showing solidarity to?

Things like this are an easy option for those outraged by the events to say "well, I've done my bit...gave it my best shot etc." and then go to bed misguidedly feeling like they've done a good, as opposed to a completely stupid and pointless, thing.

 

[butchersapron]

Back track fast or slow - try and change the subject, pretend you weren't replying to In bloom's post that

Given that the occupiers have not prevented anybody from getting in or out of the building, and have gone out of their way to make sure that lectures and seminars can continue, whose study have they disrupted?

despite including it in your reply, deny you misread the report, deny you cut the end off, the bit that said the exact opposite of your own post. And then deny you did a massively embarrasing post saying 'You got served' as if your series of mistakes were a great victory that definitely would not be followed up by even more embarassing attempts to cover your tracks once you'd realised how you'd fucked up. That would be cool if you could do that.

 

[Sadken]

Lol. Alright, you got me, you win! Hoorah for you guys! They'll be dancing in the streets of Gaza tonight and no mistake!

Back to work for me I reckon.

 

[belboid]

You plum. The second quote (quoted non-chronologically) was pretty clearly a question before I had had a chance to read the full thing. Numpty.

lol you think that backs you up??!! wow, good luck finishing infant school.

Three lecture theatres being occupied, lectures being allowed to continue (by the students), and that equals 'an entire university taken over and disrupted'

You couldn't make it up. Except, of course, sadken just did!

 

[butchersapron]

Have we too just been served belboid?

 

[belboid]

chicken, no chips

 

[butchersapron]

Me, you and IB, blown overboard by the sheer ferocity of Ken's servage:

 

[e19896]

The uni is occupied - the university authorities will not put on lectures during an occupation - the students are disrupted.

Causation. Dickhead.

A show of solidarity when you have no way of affecting real change for those you are showing solidarity to is just hitching a ride on their sympathy wagon and riding it all the way to Pushing My Own Agenda Ville - the agenda here being "Aren't we brilliant and isn't everyone else crap?" We all feel bad for Palestine but we can't do anything and, even if we could, Sheffield fucking University is hardly the best place to start is it?

Like, belboid, you seem to do an awful lot of solidarity showing, you know? What good has it done anyone that you were showing solidarity to?

Things like this are an easy option for those outraged by the events to say "well, I've done my bit...gave it my best shot etc." and then go to bed misguidedly feeling like they've done a good, as opposed to a completely stupid and pointless, thing.

No it is not, get it right this si from someone who has been there much of the day from 8am and much of yesterday, Sheffield Uni have closed it down, not the ocupation and from what i got a load are in suport, you sad fucker..

One more thing those involved are very much long term commited people been involved with Sheffield Uni for some years, this is just getting things going agine and this time i say well done to each and evryone involved takes some bollocks knowing the curcumstance, of them in all probality being kicked out due to the fact they decide to show soldaraty with people in ocupation.

Must be, what a sad wanker you are..

 

[Azrael]

I have no direct involvement in this either, but don't you find your two statements a little contradictory? This is a largely symbolic occupation, tho one that hopes to achieve some real, limited, gains.

How do my two statements contradict each other? I don't think Sheffield deserves to be disrupted for "symbolic" reasons.

As for disrupting lectures, what do the fire regs and so on have to say about the occupation. I trust the students checked all this out before making their claim that the university is free to lecture.

If they are free to lecture, then let’s treat the students to some astro-physics and mathematics lectures. 24/7, if possible.

Did you read the OP at all?

Sure did: the bit about arms companies comes low down the list, and isn't even in their numbered demands. It could be argued that Sheffield Uni can't be held responsible for what sovereign governments do with the arms once they're sold, but since the demands go way beyond a call for an end to said partnerships, that's by the by.

If the students want Sheffield Uni to cut off their relationship with said companies, let's see the economics. They need to produce a detailed breakdown of revenue received, and propose alternative sources of income to make up the shortfall. Otherwise it's just slogans.

 

[belboid]

what a lot of waffly meaningless crap. Having to distance yourself a tad from your original statement I note.

As to why the mention of arms companies, its n there to show the link between Sheffield uni & the bombing of Gaza. Quite simple really

 

[Azrael]

Asking for an economic breakdown of the university's relationship with the arms companies is hardly waffly!

 

[belboid]

still crap tho

 

[Azrael]

How, exactly? If the students want the university to change who it does business with, it's for them to come up with a viable alternative.

 

[belboid]

But they (for some reason) aren't calling for links with those arms companies to be broken. So your point is utterly worthless.

 

[Azrael]

So the one (indirect) link between Sheffield Uni and the actions of the Israeli government isn't on the agenda? And if the students don't want it changed, why raise it?

But if that's the case, fine: if the students don't want the arms deals broken off, we're right back to my original contention that Sheffield Uni have done nothing to deserve this disruption!

 

[belboid]

You really should read the links (or even just the actual posts oin the thread) you know. Most of your questins and comments are dealt with already you know. One might lamost think you didn't really give a toss about any of the issues involved, and just want to have an e-shout at silly students.

The fact that the occupation doesnt demand a breaking of the contracts with the arms companies in no way at all means that the university have done nothing to 'deserve' the occupation.

 

[Azrael]

The fact that the occupation doesnt demand a breaking of the contracts with the arms companies in no way at all means that the university have done nothing to 'deserve' the occupation.

So what else has Sheffield Uni done to deserve it? All I've seen so far is a claim that it's "symbolic", which is very weak justification.

The students want the university run "democratically", but their own union, presumably democratically elected, wants nothing to do with their occupation. They want SU to set aside "corporate interests", but haven't provided an alternative funding plan. Neither have they gone into detail about the funding of scholarships for Palestinian students.

If asking for the hard facts behind slogans amounts to an e-shout, then so be it.

 

[belboid]

dear me. There doesn't need to be anything else. You haven't asked for 'hard facts', you've come up with specious drivel that actually has no bearing on the case in point.

 

[In Bloom]

Sure did: the bit about arms companies[...]isn't even in their numbered demands.

Demand number 6:

Initiate a programme in partnership with students of divestment and
ending links with the arms trade.

 

[Azrael]

dear me. There doesn't need to be anything else. You haven't asked for 'hard facts', you've come up with specious drivel that actually has no bearing on the case in point.

Standard code for "haven't got an answer" is this. If you consider asking for viable alternative investments to be "specious drivel" there's little point debating this one with you.

Demand number 6:

Ah, now this has me. Mea culpa.

OK, so they've got a legit greivance with SU. Now, I'd like to know what steps the students took to persuade SU to disinvest in arms companies before they occupied the lecture theatres. I'd also like to see them provide the viable alternatives I mentioned before. None of this appears on their blog. Perhaps e19896, who seems to be involved with the occupation, has the details?

 

[Das Uberdog]

Occupation stands as a valid campaigning tactic in itself, not just as a 'last resort'. It's participative, collective and truly democratic - something impossible to fully attain through so-called 'legitimate' means.

 

[Zachor]

Fuck me is this still going? Haven't the riot squad gone in yet.

What a great campaign. Spoled Bastard Student Lefties for Hamas.

 

[belboid]

cos everyone in Gaza is a Hamas supporter aren't they?

You should pay it a visit and see for yourself

 

[Zachor]

cos everyone in Gaza is a Hamas supporter aren't they?

You should pay it a visit and see for yourself

I might well pay it a visit when I'm there thats if I have time after visiting the WB. I fully accept that not everyone in Gaza is a licker of Hamas knob in fact the average Gazan is a victim of Hamas fascistic policies. Its because I care about the lives of the average Gazan that I supported Operation Cast Lead. It can't be pleasant for the average Gazan who only wants to keep his head down and get on with life to be ruled by scum like Hamas who only took power in a coup. The only way that Gaza can be rescued is I'm afraid to destroy Hamas and groups like them.

Misguided 'useful idiots' in Western universities such as those behind the univeristy 'occupation' do the average person in areas like Gaza no favours whatsoever by allowing themselves to be used by groups like Hamas.

 

[belboid]

Are you really this fucking thick? (duh, daft question!)

Do try and tell us how this occupation in any way whatsoever supports Hamas. How helping five students gain an education, something denied to them by your beloved Israeli state, is supporting Hamas. It doesn't, not even the right-wingers at Sheffield Uni are claiming that! Only a very very silly boy would claim such a thing.

 

[Zachor]

Are you really this fucking thick? (duh, daft question!)

Do try and tell us how this occupation in any way whatsoever supports Hamas. How helping five students gain an education, something denied to them by your beloved Israeli state, is supporting Hamas. It doesn't, not even the right-wingers at Sheffield Uni are claiming that! Only a very very silly boy would claim such a thing.

I would definitely be in favour of having Palestinians coming here as part of an educational project so long as it was cross community and an equal number of Israeli's were included as well. I'm all in favour of lessening tensions and bringing peace but there are better ways to do it than having students manipulated by supporters of Hamas into becoming propaganda tools for a fascist group.

 

[belboid]

There are hundreds, if not thousands, of Israeli students here already. Palestinian students are not allowed to travel.

And you have failed to show why these students are being 'manipoulated' by Hamas, it's just your idiotically lazy way of whining, and refusing to face the actual issue.

 

[Zachor]

There are hundreds, if not thousands, of Israeli students here already. Palestinian students are not allowed to travel.

And you have failed to show why these students are being 'manipoulated' by Hamas, it's just your idiotically lazy way of whining, and refusing to face the actual issue.

Apols for spelling error. The students with a quite correct feeling about wanting to do good for the Gazans is being exploited by groups connected to Hamas.

 

[baldrick]

I would definitely be in favour of having Palestinians coming here as part of an educational project so long as it was cross community and an equal number of Israeli's were included as well.

presumably you're not aware that there are a significant number of Israeli students at Sheffield uni already?

and the rest of your post is just nonsense.

 

[Zachor]

presumably you're not aware that there are a significant number of Israeli students at Sheffield uni already?

and the rest of your post is just nonsense.

I'm not aware that there a number of Israeli students at Sheffield but I know there are a fair few over here.

What I'd like to see are more consensus building projects where students from Gaza plus students from the poorer areas of Israel are given education help together overseas. It will help to reduce tensions and violence far more than an ego wank occupation by a bunch of middle class wadicals.