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Rugby Union 2017-18

Paul Rees's column thhis week is worth a read I think.

Scotland’s leap ahead shows the way forward for Wales and South Africa | Paul Rees

Especially this paragraph.

"Wales is trying to build from the bottom upwards after, in terms of the grassroots, a wasted decade under the old WRU regime when all that mattered was the top. It had the effect of coating a stale cake with icing sugar and, abetted by a compliant media which would not ask awkward questions and a smart choice of national head coach in Warren Gatland, the governing body got away with it."

And yeah I agree with bendeus , short to medium term we're fucked. A new coaching set up would be nice though.
 
Paul Rees's column thhis week is worth a read I think.

Scotland’s leap ahead shows the way forward for Wales and South Africa | Paul Rees

Especially this paragraph.

"Wales is trying to build from the bottom upwards after, in terms of the grassroots, a wasted decade under the old WRU regime when all that mattered was the top. It had the effect of coating a stale cake with icing sugar and, abetted by a compliant media which would not ask awkward questions and a smart choice of national head coach in Warren Gatland, the governing body got away with it."

And yeah I agree with bendeus , short to medium term we're fucked. A new coaching set up would be nice though.
Bloody hell. Yes, that para pretty much sums it up nicely.
 
And although I'm not a Llanelli fan I think it's tragic and frankly bizarre that Scott Williams is leaving to join the Ospreys.
Wondering if Pivac, who is on record as saying Tim Cymru players are a liability in terms of season long consistency due to regular lack of availability has looked at his three Welsh qualified centres and deduced that SW is the most expendable of them all in terms of overall gameplan and skill set. Foxy the better 13 and Parkes the better 12. You therefore want a quality NWQ to be available as backup through the season, including international windows
 
Wondering if Pivac, who is on record as saying Tim Cymru players are a liability in terms of season long consistency due to regular lack of availability has looked at his three Welsh qualified centres and deduced that SW is the most expendable of them all in terms of overall gameplan and skill set. Foxy the better 13 and Parkes the better 12. You therefore want a quality NWQ to be available as backup through the season, including international windows

Yeah it makes sense in a very hard-nosed way but I think it's a shame that a player should leave his boyhood club to join the local rivals. Even more so when the club he's joining is self imploding.
 
Yeah it makes sense in a very hard-nosed way but I think it's a shame that a player should leave his boyhood club to join the local rivals. Even more so when the club he's joining is self imploding.

Yeah. The last sentence is most telling. However, a scenario in which Pivac has basically told him he superfluous to requirements and has offered him a wage that reflects this, while at the same time being offered serious wedge by an Ospreys side desperate for a decent 13 does seem to be a very plausible scenario.
 
Yep. I'm now even more intrigued to see who Pivac brings in next term as Barclay and Beirne are massive players for them.

You bothering watching the game Saturday?
 
Yep. I'm now even more intrigued to see who Pivac brings in next term as Barclay and Beirne are massive players for them.

You bothering watching the game Saturday?
Pivac is also on the WRU's three-man shortlist to replace Gatland. I'd be pretty happy to see him as head coach with Wellies masterminding attack
 
Pivac is also on the WRU's three-man shortlist to replace Gatland. I'd be pretty happy to see him as head coach with Wellies masterminding attack

Yeah they'd do a good job with a decent forwards coach, not sure if Scarlets fans would be too happy about that mind!
 
gutted I missed the Wasps game - sounds like it was a cracker, and with it, we're up to 5th. Top 4 by the end of the year!
 
Abject second half performance. Still, I guess that side was essentially Wales A and as such did pretty well, even if it was against perennial whipping boys, South Africa
Perennial? its only the 4th time we've ever managed it!
 
In fairness they have been perennial whipping boys if you only started counting from last year.
 
I quite enjoyed the game today. Thought boks deserved it though. Clearly better team second half. Have to admit never heard of that Hadleigh fella. He played well. Was impressed by amos today as well.
 
Is it because he isnt getting picked regularly for the Scarlets thats what I read
Think it's as simple as the fact that SW is a better 13 than he is a 12 but he's not as good a 13 as Foxy (few are). He can full in admirably at 12 but Pivac seems to think that Parkes is the superior inside centre (I'd agree), which leaves SW playing second string.

At the Os, with their longterm problems at outside centre, Scott would be the first name on the teamsheet. The move makes sense for all parties, tbh
 
Grandma Death - c&p'd this from Gwlad, who in turn must've done the same from the Times or the Rugby paper. It's McGeechan's take on Wales' current predicament and why our lack of dynamic ball carriers is a serious impediment to our getting anywhere with the current crop of players. Well worth a read (his bizarre assessment of Steff Evans having had a good series notwithstanding):

“The biggest tactical development in the game in the last four or five years has been the evolution of big, mobile ball-carrying front five players, particularly locks. New Zealand, as ever, led the way. Brodie Retallick and Sam Whitelock were rampaging away in the wide channels, sucking in defenders and offloading to team mates, long before the last Rugby World Cup. The rest of the world is finally catching up.

The first change of thinking in terms of the mobility of the pack was actually the concept of a ‘front four’ and a ‘back four’. Now, though, it is more like four working pairs. You need everyone in that front five to be mobile. The only way you can really develop as an international team is to have such players emerging from your system.

When you look at the strength in depth that England have in that department these days, you can see why they are starting to really put teams away. In the second row alone they have Maro Itoje, Courtney Lawes, Joe Launchbury, George Kruis. Having those big mobile ball-carriers spread across the field, working in tandem with their backs, gives an attacking team so many more options.

Having those big mobile carriers also encourages teams to make the most of the second most important tactical development of the last few years: the second decision-maker at 12.

Mauro Itoje in action
Much of England's recent success has come from the versatility of their forwards CREDIT: ASHLEY WESTERN/GETTY IMAGES
Look at the way the Lions were able to hurt New Zealand in the summer when they got the Conor Murray-Jonathan Sexton-Owen Farrell combination sorted at 9-10-12. Look at England with Ben Youngs, George Ford and Farrell.

With a good scrum-half, decision-makers at 10 and 12 and big mobile forwards all over the place, you have so many more weapons. You don’t have to just play it tight and work off ruck ball.

You can play inside or outside the 9, 10 and 12 channels. That is effectively six different running channels. You can spread it wide and cause mayhem in the wide channels.

The reason I mention this is because I feel that these two areas – the big mobile carriers in the front five, and the 9-10-12 axis – are probably the two areas in which Wales are still looking for the final answers after an autumn series in which they fired only intermittently.

The decision to drop Jamie Roberts – an outstanding servant for Wales for so long – was the right one in my opinion. A clear sign that Warren Gatland wanted to go a different route at 12. He had noted the benefits of playing a second playmaker while on Lions duty in the summer. And he was wanting to give it a try. I thought Owen Williams – who made his name as a 10 – played well against Australia and New Zealand, and he has certainly emerged as an option in that role.

But there is only a limited amount that you can do with that system unless you have the rest of the players across the field to capitalise. Wales currently don’t. Alun Wyn Jones is a warrior. A leader. A defensive totem. And one of the first names on the teamsheet. But a mobile ball-carrying lock, capable of operating in the wide channels, he is not. Wales just don’t appear to have them. They don’t have a Mako Vunipola, a Joe Launchbury, an Iain Henderson.

Toby Faletau in action
Wales' back rowers are second to none, but what about their front five? CREDIT: KEVIN BARNES/GETTY IMAGES
Their first-choice back row – Sam Warburton, Justin Tipuric and Toby Faletau – is world class. And they certainly have depth in the backs.

I thought Hallam Amos and Steff Evans had fine autumns, and with Liam Williams to return at full-back and Jonathan Davies at 13, their cupboard is pretty full. Dan Biggar kicked very well again on Saturday.

Hadleigh Parkes had a good debut. But they just don’t have the mobile and powerful front five. That limits what they can do on the field in an attacking sense.

If there is one area which I think will have frustrated Warren this autumn it would have been the lack of tries, the lack of a cutting edge on the pitch. Cutting edges appear when you have threats all over the pitch, threats who can make big yards. Saturday’s entertaining, if nerve-jangling, win over what is, let’s face it, a poor South Africa team was a case in point. Yes, they scored three tries but they came from horrendous Springbok defensive errors.

That lack of personnel has meant Wales, of all the home nations, probably pushed on the least this autumn. Scotland have got real momentum now, Ireland showed what a good team can do against the Springboks, England won all three of theirs and have a clear system.

Wales, I feel, are still trying to redefine their game.

Wales players walk a lap of the pitch after their victory over South Africa
Have Wales made enough progress this autumn? CREDIT: KEVIN BARNES/GETTY IMAGES
Having the Georgia game second up probably wasn’t ideal because Gatland changed almost the whole team to keep his first-choice players fresh for the All Blacks. It meant he sacrificed that continuity that you need to develop tactically, to build momentum.

But even had he selected his first-choice team, I’m not sure he currently has the players at his disposal to develop the type of game that other countries are now playing.

Wales are not a million miles away. But until they can find those mobile ball carriers in the front five and settle on a system at 9-10-12, their progress will be slower simply because your tactics have to follow the strengths of your best available players.”

Our current ball carrying options up front are Rob Evans, Owens and Faletau. That's it. Compare that to England's riches and weep.

E2A: Paul Rees also highlighting carrying as a significant weakness in today's Graun online: Victory over Springboks must not lull Wales into false sense of security | Paul Rees
 
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The Cipriani/England media talk a bit earlier than usual this season :D

Rugby union: talking points from the weekend’s Premiership action
Over played the Danny Care handing that article. He was off form today. Went to the stoop and Cooney was everything Care is meant to be. I like care but he was conservative today, granted the conditions were shite, but he limited his game to passing. We were defending two back but Gilroy is weak going backwards, Care could have dinked a ball into space but didn’t. Still great win for us and some of our dodgy fans.
 
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