Re-opening Schools?

[8ball]

At it's most basic, they are told to stop moving and sit still when they should be learning through sensory exploration, movement and play.

Makes sense, cheers.

 

[nagapie]

Makes sense, cheers.

And now they even have to take a test in Year 1. It's so bonkers you couldn't make it up.

 

[8ball]

And now they even have to take a test in Year 1. It's so bonkers you couldn't make it up.

Management dogma leaking everywhere. The idea that the only benchmark of value is heaps of measurement data.

I think kids are fine with learning reading at that age, but the regimentation is the issue.

 

[nagapie]

Management dogma leaking everywhere. The idea that the only benchmark of value is heaps of measurement data.

I think kids are fine with learning reading at that age, but the regimentation is the issue.

I don't mind if kids want to learn to read at 5 but it shouldn't be part of the curriculum.

Testing is not only dogma, it's also big business.

 

[8ball]

I don't mind if kids want to learn to read at 5 but it shouldn't be part of the curriculum.

Testing is not only dogma, it's also big business.

I started learning at about 3 at the latest. But I was a bit weird.
What would be in a curriculum if not even including reading (and I mean any reading) by age 5?
It sounds more like a "curriculum" as conventionally done is something that could be largely done away with.

 

[nagapie]

I started learning at about 3 at the latest. But I was a bit weird.
What would be in a curriculum if not even including reading (and I mean any reading) by age 5?
It sounds more like a "curriculum" as conventionally done is something that could be largely done away with.

Play, play indoors, play outdoors and then play some more. Everything you need to know can be learnt through play. Sure some kids can learn to read early, that's fine, their parents can teach them.

 

[8ball]

Play, play indoors, play outdoors and then play some more. Everything you need to know can be learnt through play. Sure some kids can learn to read early, that's fine, their parents can teach them.

Yeah, I was taught by my Nan. I was ill a lot so didn't play outside as much as other kids. So not typical.

 

[Dogsauce]

My place (large primary, stand-alone academy) won’t be back on 1st June, as it doesn’t provide enough time to prepare, there’s a lot of physical things to be done before we are ready, then staff need to be made familiar with the new infrastructure and routines. Current plans point towards kids getting back in a week later. We’re having to spend quite a lot of money on getting the school ready, barriers, paper towel dispensers, all kinds of signage etc. Everything works in little cells, playground divided up into different areas. Fortunately all classrooms have an external door so easier than it will be for a lot of places.

No idea how many kids will be coming back in, currently we have between six and fifteen kids per day as keyworker provision, from 400 kids normally. After school and breakfast clubs won’t be up and running as these are done by an external company who have basically said they won’t be back at it until September (which also affects the summer holiday club they run). Not sure how many parents will be ‘freed up’ for working by these arrangements, a lot of schools will be similar, some are only doing a couple of days a week for some age groups. Makes you wonder what the point of it all is.

 

[planetgeli]

Just a quickie on this 'must get back to school' thing. I've just been informed that in the hubs that have been opened for the last 7 weeks in my county, for key workers and vulnerable pupils, the teachers have been directly told they are not allowed to teach anything as this would be giving an unfair advantage over non-attending pupils.

So just childcare then.

I'll come back to the alternative education syllabus in a bit.

 

[Thora]

I started learning at about 3 at the latest. But I was a bit weird.
What would be in a curriculum if not even including reading (and I mean any reading) by age 5?
It sounds more like a "curriculum" as conventionally done is something that could be largely done away with.

There’s a whole big long early years curriculum, and even a whole reading curriculum, with the actual learning letter sounds as a tiny bit on the end. Physical development, social & emotional development, communication skills, learning skills, creativity, technology, the natural world, community, maths, literacy.

 

[Thora]

Just a quickie on this 'must get back to school' thing. I've just been informed that in the hubs that have been opened for the last 7 weeks in my county, for key workers and vulnerable pupils, the teachers have been directly told they are not allowed to teach anything as this would be giving an unfair advantage over non-attending pupils.

So just childcare then.

I'll come back to the alternative education syllabus in a bit.

Yes, it’s always been childcare. Not just because it’s unfair but because it’s impractical - what can a teacher teach to a group of 10 4-11 year olds from a couple of different schools who might be only doing odd hours or half days, and the teacher is in odd days or weeks on/off.
They’ve been doing the same home learning other kids do at home or vaguely educational activities, games and sport.

 

[Gramsci]

Scientists warn 1 June is too early for schools to reopen in England

Independent Sage committee says more time is needed to set up coronavirus track and trace

www.theguardian.com

Saw this in Guardian today.

In summary says it being rushed. Track and Trace need to be up and running. Local up to date info needed on infection rates. Some schools in rural area with low infection rates could open sooner.

“It is clear from the evidence we have collected that 1 June is simply too early to go back. By going ahead with this dangerous decision, the government is further risking the health of our communities and the likelihood of a second spike,” Prof King said.

The Independent SAGE group will have online public discussion this Friday. Details in the link to Guardian.

The Independent SAGE group is as name suggests independent of the government one.

 

[Gramsci]

The Independent SAGE group also suggests using playing fields for example as outdoor schools. Any teachers here have views on that? How would that work?

 

[Pickman's model]

The Independent SAGE group also suggests using playing fields for example as outdoor schools. Any teachers here have views on that? How would that work?

let's hope any playing fields used are level

 

[nagapie]

The Independent SAGE group also suggests using playing fields for example as outdoor schools. Any teachers here have views on that? How would that work?

What playing fields? Oh you mean the ones that were sold off

 

[Gramsci]

Funnily enough, the last couple of days I've started some reading about curriculum hierarchy - vocational, indeed any practical subject, are regarded as "lower status" across the West and have been for a long time.

Some suggest this down to some Platonic or Cartesian distinction between mind and body, between physical and mental labour.

My own angle is that it's more to do with Bourdieu's idea of status being linked to "distance from necessity" i.e. a marker of status is the ability to engage in activity further from meeting immediate needs.

Just as Russian criminals in the labour camps would grow their finger nails long to display that they didn't need to engage in physical work - they had the means to not do so - so the middle-classes can study subjects such Maths or Physics whose purpose is credentials for entry into future study - an investment whose returns are deferred far longer than, say, a Plumbing course.

The higher up you go, the more pronounced this becomes with archetypical subjects of privilege being things like Classics

Thats interesting. Back in 70s I passed 11plus and common entrance exam for local public school. So got in free under the old Direct Grant system. Majority who went came from the Prep school.

First term senior teacher gave my class a pep talk. His exact words were "We weren't at this school to end up as dustmen but to beome the person who told dustmen what to do." It was a hangover from imperialism. Working class needed someone to tell them what to do.

I would however add for the ruling class the cultivation of the body separate from any notion of physical work was important.

Sport was big part of the curriculam. Cricket and Rugby. Not Footballl as that was working class. The Senior Prefects were all from the schools Rugby and Cricket teams. Head Boy was usually Captain of the Schools cricket team. Important part of learning to join the ruling class. The cultivation of the body and mind Id say was the object. But not for physical labour.

 

[Dogsauce]

Yes, it’s always been childcare. Not just because it’s unfair but because it’s impractical - what can a teacher teach to a group of 10 4-11 year olds from a couple of different schools who might be only doing odd hours or half days, and the teacher is in odd days or weeks on/off.
They’ve been doing the same home learning other kids do at home or vaguely educational activities, games and sport.

Ours are just in the main hall and practical room/ICT suite, no classrooms are in use. Running it a bit like an after school club, they’re doing PE with Joe Wicks, making things, charging round the playground like loons. When there is as few as six kids in some days then hard to do anything structured across different age ranges.

Kids do seem to be loving it though, especially having the fairly large playground to themselves. I reckon there will be some strong bonds of friendship being forged amongst this little gang, plus maybe closer bonds with teaching staff too. Not really much social distancing going on from what I see, just kids being kids.

 

[chilango]

Thats interesting. Back in 70s I passed 11plus and common entrance exam for local public school. So got in free under the old Direct Grant system. Majority who went came from the Prep school.

First term senior teacher gave my class a pep talk. His exact words were "We weren't at this school to end up as dustmen but to beome the person who told dustmen what to do." It was a hangover from imperialism. Working class needed someone to tell them what to do.

I would however add for the ruling class the cultivation of the body separate from any notion of physical work was important.

Sport was big part of the curriculam. Cricket and Rugby. Not Footballl as that was working class. The Senior Prefects were all from the schools Rugby and Cricket teams. Head Boy was usually Captain of the Schools cricket team. Important part of learning to join the ruling class. The cultivation of the body and mind Id say was the object. But not for physical labour.

I was reading about sports, class and school last month!

 

[Mattym]

Just a quickie on this 'must get back to school' thing. I've just been informed that in the hubs that have been opened for the last 7 weeks in my county, for key workers and vulnerable pupils, the teachers have been directly told they are not allowed to teach anything as this would be giving an unfair advantage over non-attending pupils.

So just childcare then.

I'll come back to the alternative education syllabus in a bit.

Yes, we've also been told to do consolidatory work only for that exact reason.

 

[20Bees]

I was one of three from my primary school who passed the 11+ in 1967, we went to three different grammar schools. My elder sister had learned shorthand, which fascinated me, and on asking whether shorthand and typing were core or optional subjects I was told we didn’t go to grammar school to become secretaries - so, no. In 1971 my school merged with two secondary moderns to form a giant comprehensive. Y11s stayed on their O level curriculum with the same teachers but all the secondary kids using the building and grounds. We were despised and derided, I was so upset by it all that I refused to go into 6 th form and went straight into a clerical job, staying until I was married and pregnant. All grammar school did for me was make me feel guilty, weird and friendless. Not much change 50 years on...

 

[flypanam]

My wife’s school has said that classes will be three hour longs, with pods of 15 kids with no toilet breaks to cut down on moving between classes.

 

[Aladdin]

I started learning at about 3 at the latest. But I was a bit weird.
What would be in a curriculum if not even including reading (and I mean any reading) by age 5?
It sounds more like a "curriculum" as conventionally done is something that could be largely done away with.

My brother could read at 2 and a half.
When he went to school he was reading encyclopedias.
He spent his days in school playing in the sand pit and messing with water. The teacher thought he had learning difficulties because he point blank refused to sit and listen to her playing her recorder.
She called in my parents who sat there and started to laugh. They called the brother into the meeting and handed him a book. Of course he read it and then he explored it.
Teacher apologised and it was quickly realised that he had been bored shitless and that messing with sand and water was far more educational in his mind than anything the teacher was doing.

 

[Aladdin]

My wife’s school has said that classes will be three hour longs, with pods of 15 kids with no toilet breaks to cut down on moving between classes.

Rough...no toilet breaks? Kids tend to need toilet breaks.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

3 hour classes?

fucking hell...

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

just do a normal lesson and then stick on a movie...

 

[flypanam]

Rough...no toilet breaks? Kids tend to need toilet breaks.

She’s just got clarification. Toilet breaks will be allowed as long as there are members of staff to accompany the children to the jacks and ensure they use the hand sanitisers. But the 3 hour class is staying.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

how on earth are you going to have enough people for accompanied toilet trips? maybe if you have a bunch of TAs i guess.

The 3 hour thing is painful.

maybe just have the kids stay and the teachers move about when possible.

 

[nagapie]

how on earth are you going to have enough people for accompanied toilet trips? maybe if you have a bunch of TAs i guess.

The 3 hour thing is painful.

maybe just have the kids stay and the teachers move about when possible.

Surely it's going to be more difficult for the students! This doesn't sound legal.

 

[philosophical]

Once one kid goes to the bog, they will all get the idea to do so, it will be a toilet chain reaction.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

That happens enough as it is.

Mind you I hear plenty of schools have harsh bog protocols nowadays