People getting racially abused because of the referendum result

[NoXion]

No, but I think that the ruling elite is clever enough to give us just enough bread and circuses to keep the majority quiescent.

Nope, the contradictory yet insatiable demands of capital will pretty much ensure that they will have to squeeze as much short-term benefit as they can at the expense of what is sensible and sustainable in the long term. Which means that any bread and circuses that are given out will get taken back eventually.

 

[phildwyer]

The first people to die in revolutions are always the revolutionaries. And I do mean always. That in itself ought to be enough to dissuade the armchair enthusiasts, but it seems that folly springs anew with each generation.

 

[8ball]

The political circuses will be enough to distract most for the time being.

This one was something of a cock-up on that front - the political circus was stirring the pot rather than working as a distraction.

 

[phildwyer]

Nope, the contradictory yet insatiable demands of capital will pretty much ensure that they will have to squeeze as much short-term benefit as they can at the expense of what is sensible and sustainable in the long term.

That "pretty much" is a nice touch.

 

[NoXion]

That "pretty much" is a nice touch.

Did you have an actual point to make?

 

[phildwyer]

Did you have an actual point to make?

Just that the qualification undermined the confidence with which you stated your main point. Tbh I wish you were right. But here's the problem with yer bloody revolutions:

 

[coley]

Nope, the contradictory yet insatiable demands of capital will pretty much ensure that they will have to squeeze as much short-term benefit as they can at the expense of what is sensible and sustainable in the long term. Which means that any bread and circuses that are given out will get taken back eventually.

"Eventually" that is the key word, most doing the squeezing will have retired comfortably by the time the penny drops, and they will then be replaced by the next bunch of short sighted bastards who will be hopefully thinking they can survive before the brown stuff hits the extraction equipment, kicking the can down the road!
They all do it, and keeping our rage and anger within limits is the supreme test of your average politician, rather than look for solutions to social ills.
But violence on the streets is no answer, a political movement that will bring the current order to a standstill is much more effective, how to achieve that? Haven't a clue.

 

[DotCommunist]

Just that the qualification undermined the confidence with which you stated your main point. Tbh I wish you were right. But here's the problem with yer bloody revolutions:

a point made by a counter-revolutionary who suspiciously remained healthy while the terror ate his mates a grass?

lol, keep on truckin phil, I'm off to watch cartoons and dream of the barricades

 

[NoXion]

Just that the qualification undermined the confidence with which you stated your main point. Tbh I wish you were right. But here's the problem with yer bloody revolutions:

Cavemen will eat unicorns?

Consider it an acknowledgement that I'm not omniscient. In any case, care to name any substantive social change that wasn't accompanied by conflict of some kind?

"Eventually" that is the key word, most doing the squeezing will have retired comfortably by the time the penny drops, and they will then be replaced by the next bunch of short sighted bastards who will be hopefully thinking they can survive before the brown stuff hits the extraction equipment, kicking the can down the road!
They all do it, and keeping our rage and anger within limits is the supreme test of your average politician, rather than look for solutions to social ills.
But violence on the streets is no answer, a political movement that will bring the current order to a standstill is much more effective, how to achieve that? Haven't a clue.

So when this hypothetical political movement manages to "bring the current order to a standstill", what precisely do you think that the reaction of the "current order" will be? Do you think that they will meekly stand aside and allow said political movement to forge a new society? Or will they instead attempt to violently assert their authority?

 

[seventh bullet]

I won't be around to see it, but from my armchair I salute my prole brothers and sisters who'll not be very nice to those members of the ruling class who resist the creation of a new society, and also not be very nice to those traitors who support and defend them.

 

[Lurdan]

This picture, taken at an Armed Forces Day parade in Romford on Saturday, has been circulating a fair bit.

There's an interesting blog post here by the guy that took it.
diamond geezer

One of the official civic party, a tall balding gentleman in a grey suit, stopped to chat to the t-shirt wearer. Not only did they seem to get on well, but the dignitary smiled and put his arm around the man's shoulder before moving on.

 

[dessiato]

This picture, taken at an Armed Forces Day parade in Romford on Saturday, has been circulating a fair bit.

There's an interesting blog post here by the guy that took it.
diamond geezer

Nice. He makes good points.

 

[Pickman's model]

The first people to die in revolutions are always the revolutionaries. And I do mean always.

Tell that to the Swiss guards not to mention e.g. the Romanovs.

 

[Pickman's model]

Just that the qualification undermined the confidence with which you stated your main point. Tbh I wish you were right. But here's the problem with yer bloody revolutions:

Perhaps you should be mentioning this to people like farage and johnson.

 

[chilango]

Wonder how many here have experienced revolution?

 

[Pickman's model]

Wonder how many here have experienced revolution?

Everyone except Phil will over the coming weeks and months.

 

[rutabowa]

None of this is the fault of the non-racist part of the Leave or Remain voters.

No you're right it's not... it would be good if all the leaders of the remain campaign could come out and unequivocally condemn it though.

edit: i meant to say "leaders of the leave campaign"! tho both really.

 

[J Ed]

No you're right it's not... it would be good if all the leaders of the remain campaign could come out and unequivocally condemn it though.

It seems to be being ignored by everyone, the only MPs I have heard say anything about it are Jess Phillips and Warsi

 

[phildwyer]

a point made by a counter-revolutionary who suspiciously remained healthy while the terror ate his mates a grass?

It was Danton, n'est-ce pas? Not sure how you can call him a counter-revolutionary, and he certainly didn't remain healthy.

Or do you have another source?

 

[phildwyer]

Wonder how many here have experienced revolution?

If they had, they wouldn't be here.

 

[phildwyer]

Cavemen will eat unicorns?

It's Saturn devouring his children. Often used to illustrate Danton's famous dictum about revolutions.

Consider it an acknowledgement that I'm not omniscient. In any case, care to name any substantive social change that wasn't accompanied by conflict of some kind?

Well, even getting out of bed in the morning is "accompanied by conflict of some kind." But there have been plenty of substantive social changes that haven't involved armed conflict.

In sharp contrast, there has never been a violent revolution that didn't descend rapidly into tyranny--with the single exception of the American.

So when this hypothetical political movement manages to "bring the current order to a standstill", what precisely do you think that the reaction of the "current order" will be? Do you think that they will meekly stand aside and allow said political movement to forge a new society? Or will they instead attempt to violently assert their authority?

Who is "they?" I don't think there is a "ruling class" any more. I think it's a pure conflict of capital versus labor, no classes involved.

 

[phildwyer]

Tell that to the Swiss guards not to mention e.g. the Romanovs.

Tell it to the Bolsheviks. How many Old Boshies were still around by 1940? If the civil war didn't get them, the purges did. Same with the citoyens of France--they either got a republican haircut or ended as Napoleonic cannon-fodder.

 

[CNT36]

Tell it to the Bolsheviks. How many Old Boshies were still around by 1940? If the civil war didn't get them, the purges did. Same with the citoyens of France--they either got a republican haircut or ended as Napoleonic cannon-fodder.

1940 is a long time after 1917. The Russian Revolution must have been considerably less bloody than I'd been led to believe.

 

[phildwyer]

1940 is a long time after 1917. The Russian Revolution must have been considerably less bloody than I'd been led to believe.

I was being generous. Few of the original revolutionaries made it past 1920.

 

[krtek a houby]

The best way to 'educate' a neo-Nazi is with a pick axe handle.

Please elaborate how this would help?

 

[Libertad]

Please elaborate how this would help?

The only good fascist is a dead fascist.

 

[krtek a houby]

The only good fascist is a dead fascist.

Have you killed any, yourself? There does seem to be quite a few about. If so, how did you kill them? Was a pick axe involved or a magic wand?

 

[krtek a houby]

Police investigate 'racist' graffiti on building in Hammersmith

 

[Libertad]

Have you killed any, yourself? There does seem to be quite a few about. If so, how did you kill them? Was a pick axe involved or a magic wand?

I've maimed a few in my time but I'm willing to up my game.

 

[Pickman's model]

Tell it to the Bolsheviks. How many Old Boshies were still around by 1940? If the civil war didn't get them, the purges did. Same with the citoyens of France--they either got a republican haircut or ended as Napoleonic cannon-fodder.

By 1940 the Romanovs had been in quicklime for 22 years.