Miraculous new >100 percent efficient electric heater.

[gentlegreen]

Perhaps we ought to have a bullshit kickstarter thread.

But that would mean we end up giving Thunderf00t too much publicity.
Anyway Dave Jones got to this one first.



It's a 200 watt radiator ... ooh toasty ! (for a gerbil if you put it in its cage)
It claims increased efficiency through less "EMFs" among other things LOL
(I think they missed a trick there - could have ensnared a whole lot more idiot punters.)

Oxides and Oxidation

Now with regard to oxidation and efficiency loss. Oxides have a quality of a semiconductor, which means the heater loses efficiency through magnetic fields. Oxides create magnetic fields. According to the theory of Goltz regarding the transmission of magnetic waves, magnetic fields and radio waves have different frequencies come into a resonance with each other, which are observed under the work of most electronic devices, especially heaters.

On any nickel thread, after 1 heating, oxides (uneven) can be observed, which makes the metal heating thread, due to the oxidation, less and less effective with use. As a result at the spots of oxidation, Galvanic effect forms, which lead to formation of parasitic electricity, which in turn forms a magnetic field. Therefore, oxidation of the metal heating threads results in its malfunction with time and any metal heating thread has almost 100% efficiency only during the first working minute. Then the efficiency drops with a geometric progression. This is on the contrary to our graphene based heating element where oxidation doesn't occur.

Update 1: Thank you for the support in the fist 24 hours! · SOLUS — The Most Efficient Radiator In The World

 

[two sheds]

Have been meaning to post something on electric heaters. A neighbour has been considering getting a couple. The sales guys have been promoting chalk- or brick-filled radiators costing several hundred pounds with various claims.Not in the same league as the OP but ...

First claim is that they are more “efficient” than cheap oil-filled Dimplex heaters which sounds to me like just bollocks. Electric heaters are 100% efficient: you put in 1 kW of electrical energy you get out 1 kW of heat. I don’t care what type they are (apart from heat pumps), convector or radiant, surely that has to be true.

I did see that some electric heaters are more “effective” in that they put out some radiant heat as well as convective heat so that they feel warmer for the the same output when someone’s in the room. That I can accept, but both fires were intended for rooms that aren’t usually occupied – spare rooms that tend to go a bit musty because they get cold and damp. The only thing I can think is that radiant heaters would warm up the walls more quickly, but that’s eventually going to just heat up the air like a convection heater, too, and if it’s true in that case why not have a one-bar electric fire?

The idea that chalk- or brick-filled night storage radiators are more efficient also seems bollocks because you have to put in just as much energy to heat up the bricks at night before they can give out the heat during the day. Perhaps cheaper if you’re on Economy 7 tariff (although I hear Economy 7 is more expensive during the day than normal tariff), but still no more efficient.

Still, though, the sales guys are stressing that their chalk- or brick-filled radiators consume less electricity than Dimplex heaters for the same heating effect. And even if that were true, repayment times for a several-hundred-pound electric heater would I have thought lean towards the infinite compared with a forty-quid Dimplex heater.

Or am I misunderstanding something basic?

 

[gentlegreen]

Economy 7 was the only way to save money with an electric (storage) heater.

Personally I use an oil-filled radiator to raise the minimum temperature of my room, then a cheap fan heater to warm just me. Radiant heaters have the advantage of not having a noisy fan, but the "quartz" ones burn out very quickly and halogen tube ones throw out enough light to be annoying.

 

[joustmaster]

Economy 7 was the only way to save money with an electric (storage) heater.

.

Is that still a thing? I must have lived in 20 houses and have never seen it.

 

[mauvais]

Have been meaning to post something on electric heaters. A neighbour has been considering getting a couple. The sales guys have been promoting chalk- or brick-filled radiators costing several hundred pounds with various claims.Not in the same league as the OP but ...

First claim is that they are more “efficient” than cheap oil-filled Dimplex heaters which sounds to me like just bollocks. Electric heaters are 100% efficient: you put in 1 kW of electrical energy you get out 1 kW of heat. I don’t care what type they are (apart from heat pumps), convector or radiant, surely that has to be true.

I did see that some electric heaters are more “effective” in that they put out some radiant heat as well as convective heat so that they feel warmer for the the same output when someone’s in the room. That I can accept, but both fires were intended for rooms that aren’t usually occupied – spare rooms that tend to go a bit musty because they get cold and damp. The only thing I can think is that radiant heaters would warm up the walls more quickly, but that’s eventually going to just heat up the air like a convection heater, too, and if it’s true in that case why not have a one-bar electric fire?

The idea that chalk- or brick-filled night storage radiators are more efficient also seems bollocks because you have to put in just as much energy to heat up the bricks at night before they can give out the heat during the day. Perhaps cheaper if you’re on Economy 7 tariff (although I hear Economy 7 is more expensive during the day than normal tariff), but still no more efficient.

Still, though, the sales guys are stressing that their chalk- or brick-filled radiators consume less electricity than Dimplex heaters for the same heating effect. And even if that were true, repayment times for a several-hundred-pound electric heater would I have thought lean towards the infinite compared with a forty-quid Dimplex heater.

Or am I misunderstanding something basic?

Efficiency of an electric element is 100%, that's true, but as you identify, it's all about where that heat gets transferred to, and when. If you take it as a precondition that a radiator is hot, it has its own efficiency in distribution of that heat to whatever destination you want, e.g. the air.

There is also a vague 'efficiency' that relates to your use case, e.g. if you're on E7 then you want the ideal distribution of stored heat over the high cost period.

 

[gentlegreen]

Is that still a thing? I must have lived in 20 houses and have never seen it.

I suspect gas turbine generators replacing coal has made it less useful to the power companies.

 

[prunus]

Have been meaning to post something on electric heaters. A neighbour has been considering getting a couple. The sales guys have been promoting chalk- or brick-filled radiators costing several hundred pounds with various claims.Not in the same league as the OP but ...

First claim is that they are more “efficient” than cheap oil-filled Dimplex heaters which sounds to me like just bollocks. Electric heaters are 100% efficient: you put in 1 kW of electrical energy you get out 1 kW of heat. I don’t care what type they are (apart from heat pumps), convector or radiant, surely that has to be true.

I did see that some electric heaters are more “effective” in that they put out some radiant heat as well as convective heat so that they feel warmer for the the same output when someone’s in the room. That I can accept, but both fires were intended for rooms that aren’t usually occupied – spare rooms that tend to go a bit musty because they get cold and damp. The only thing I can think is that radiant heaters would warm up the walls more quickly, but that’s eventually going to just heat up the air like a convection heater, too, and if it’s true in that case why not have a one-bar electric fire?

The idea that chalk- or brick-filled night storage radiators are more efficient also seems bollocks because you have to put in just as much energy to heat up the bricks at night before they can give out the heat during the day. Perhaps cheaper if you’re on Economy 7 tariff (although I hear Economy 7 is more expensive during the day than normal tariff), but still no more efficient.

Still, though, the sales guys are stressing that their chalk- or brick-filled radiators consume less electricity than Dimplex heaters for the same heating effect. And even if that were true, repayment times for a several-hundred-pound electric heater would I have thought lean towards the infinite compared with a forty-quid Dimplex heater.

Or am I misunderstanding something basic?

No, you’ve basically covered it all.

<puts on pedant/geek hybrid hat>

While it is certainly true that all the input energy into any device will be eventually turned into heat (meaning that your television is also a 100% efficient heater), for that to be useful in this context it has to stay within the closed system that you want to heat - in this case your house. Radiant heaters that also give off visible light, and hence short wavelength IR (probably), will lose, some of the time, some of that light out through the windows - where it will eventually of course turn into heat, somewhere in the universe, though not in a way that can be considered efficient in terms of heating your house. Some of the sound produced by your TV will similarly escape the house and heat the world, but in normal cases the energy loss will be minimal. If you had a 10kw blue light military laser pointing out through your window then, even though all that 10kw of energy will eventually become heat, it’s mostly going to do it elsewhere so the proportion of it heating your house will be pretty small, and so for the terms you care about, very inefficient. You could always close the curtains to keep the energy in (make sure you have nonflammable curtains.

Tl;dr convection heaters are better for heating your home than military lasers.

 

[gentlegreen]

I liked that idea of taking servers out of data centres and putting them in people's houses as radiators - though I never saw an explanation for what you would do with the heat in the summer...

 

[mauvais]

Tl;dr convection heaters are better for heating your home than military lasers.

Credit where credit's due though, an oil-filled radiator is less use as a ballistic missile defence system.

OTOH, if you get hit by the missile, free heating. Swings & roundabouts.

 

[gentlegreen]

By the way, the last time I handed in a physics essay, to cover every possible energy loss from a kettle, I included the minute energy loss via radiated "RF" - though at 50Hz you would need a massive antenna - even if a magnetic rather than electrostatic one.
I seem to recall it didn't go down well.

 

[two sheds]

I liked that idea of taking servers out of data centres and putting them in people's houses as radiators - though I never saw an explanation for what you would do with the heat in the summer...

Low grade heat to a heat pump for hot water

 

[Gromit]

If it was built by a team from The Apprentice it would give 110% as they always give 110%.

 

[two sheds]

Vilnis Vesma is a long-time business energy efficiency consultant and excellent on many topics (he does tables of degree days for energy monitoring) including the subject of the OP, particularly on scammy type energy efficient equipment sold to businesses.

https://www.vesma.com/tutorial/fuel_gizmo.htm

Every once in a while you will come across somebody peddling fuel-conditioning devices, often containing magnets, that are “guaranteed” to improve the efficiency of your burners. They do not work.

Be careful about letting these people onto site. The less scrupulous ones can be very aggressive and will, when you disprove their claims and instruct them to remove their product, go over your head to your management board and portray you as someone who is not committed to saving energy.

They will offer testimonials; but testimonial evidence in such cases is notoriously unreliable. They may claim that their products are patented, but remember that a patent does not prove that an idea works; it is just a claim of novelty. And then there is the guarantees -- except that they aren't guarantees that the product works. They are money-back offers, i.e., a promise not to leave you worse off than before. The chicken running around our back yard could leave you no worse off than you are now, and without wasting any of your time.

... continues to give some of the theory behind it.

I've seen fuel additives that claim to alter the molecular structure of the fuel whatever the fuck that means.

 

[gentlegreen]

Vilnis Vesma is a long-time business energy efficiency consultant and excellent on many topics (he does tables of degree days for energy monitoring) including the subject of the OP, particularly on scammy type energy efficient equipment sold to businesses.

https://www.vesma.com/tutorial/fuel_gizmo.htm



... continues to give some of the theory behind it.

I've seen fuel additives that claim to alter the molecular structure of the fuel whatever the fuck that means.

Energy management A to Z

Lots of interesting stuff on that site, but it's a website only an engineer could love - and one stuck in the 90s

Dated 2012 ...

 

[Epona]

I liked that idea of taking servers out of data centres and putting them in people's houses as radiators - though I never saw an explanation for what you would do with the heat in the summer...

Having 2 PCs in my south facing sitting room, I can answer that - I rarely need to put the heating on in winter, getting warmth from something that is going to be on and in use anyway is very welcome. In summer, it is very very unpleasant, and airflow through your home becomes a bit of a challenge to provide the best cooling possible.