Is it fraud to apply for a job with an Anglicised surname?

[Helen Back]

We have a French-sounding surname with an apostrophe in it and Mr Back is finding it hard to get job interviews even after applying for loads of jobs. We're beginning to suspect it might be because of the non-English surname. If he answers a job advert under the surname Smith or something just to get an interview, and then gives his real name later when it matters, is this fraud?

We hear so many stories of people with non-English surnames not getting interviews until they give an English name we're kind of worried that's what's happening to us.

 

[maomao]

I don't think an employer would be impressed by changing surname after an interview though this is exactly what my wife found and why she started using my surname in certain circumstances. Do you have another name he could semi-legitimately use? Your pre-married surname perhaps? You don't need a deed poll to use another name.

 

[killer b]

I'm not sure european sounding surnames are particularly affected by this problem are they? I think it's mostly surnames that might indicate you're a different skin colour to your prospective employer...

 

[Epico]

Wouldn't it throw up more problems when his prospective new employer tried to obtain references or perform background checks?

 

[Helen Back]

Wouldn't it throw up more problems when his prospective new employer tried to obtain references or perform background checks?

No, the idea is to just get an interview. Once through the door he'll use the real name.

 

[Clair De Lune]

He could change his name by deed poll for under £20

 

[Badgers]

I had an application a Daniel from Nigeria.

His real name was Tololupe.

At the interview he said everyone here calls me Daniel as it is easier when speaking with customers and colleagues.

No harm in that.

 

[The39thStep]

Can't see how it would be deemed fraud tbh.

 

[killer b]

How would you explain this though? 'actually my name is Dave D'urton not Dave Smith, but I thought you might not give me an interview because you're probably racist, so I gave a different name to get through the door.'

 

[kebabking]

I'm sceptical that a European sounding/looking surname is a blocker - if he's also got a 'forrin' sounding forename then that might be putting some off because of all the fuss about work visas and the like - employers aren't going to research each case, they're just going to lob anything that looks like it might be hassle in the bin - it its Andy or Dave I rather doubt that's the problem.

 

[maomao]

How would you explain this though? 'actually my name is Dave D'urton not Dave Smith, but I thought you might not give me an interview because you're probably racist, so I gave a different name to get through the door.'

'I use my partner's name most of the time but my bank account and some of my ID is in my old name.'

 

[Elpenor]

Plenty of people have a different name for employment purposes eg women retaining their maiden name, by the time you are at the referencing stage you can say - “professionally I am Joe Bloggs, legally I am Joe De Bloggs”

 

[bimble]

I've got a helluva weird surname but an obviously European one and i'd say yep it has caused issues, quite a lot. I think mainly people just don't like seeing a thing they think they can't pronounce, makes them feel uncomfortable. Can you just remove the apostrophe ? (Nobody ever gets to see my umlaut unless i know them really well)

 

[Sue]

A lot of people anglicise their first names for pronunciation reasons -- I've quite a few East Asian friends who do this -- but I think the surname thing would be a bit weird. I'm also not sure a French-sounding name would be a problem (have you seen how many French people there are in London?) Could be that unfortunately it's just really hard to get a job at the moment.

 

[killer b]

have you seen how many French people there are in London?

Not sure that quite follows - there's lots of Nigerians in London too, but I bet a Nigerian surname is a barrier to getting an interview in lots of places.

 

[skyscraper101]

I have no problem at all with someone using an Anglicised name to get an interview. I'm interviewing the person, not the name.

While I hate the fact that it even may be necessary, I'm nevertheless all for a world where employers have no option to judge people prior to interview based on anything other than their professional credentials.

 

[Sue]

I have no problem at all with someone using an Anglicised name to get an interview. I'm interviewing the person, not the name.

While I hate the fact that it even may be necessary, I'm nevertheless all for a world where employers have no option to judge people prior to interview based on anything other than their professional credentials.

TBF, where I work, CVs and pre-interview tests are anonymised and it's only just before the interview that you even know a candidate's name. Not perfect as obviously the recruitment people do the initial sift so have access to all their details (and of course there can be indicators of nationality, for example, in their CV) but it's a start.

 

[Elpenor]

I think a decent employer should be more concerned about right to work than surname.

 

[Helen Back]

I had an application a Daniel from Nigeria.
His real name was Tololupe.
At the interview he said everyone here calls me Daniel as it is easier when speaking with customers and colleagues.
No harm in that.

So, as an employer(?) what would you think of someone who initially applied under a different surname?

 

[Johnny Doe]

So, as an employer(?) what would you think of someone who initially applied under a different surname?

I've interviewed and employed people who a different name on their ID than on the CV. No big deal at all

 

[Helen Back]

TBF, where I work, CVs and pre-interview tests are anonymised and it's only just before the interview that you even know a candidate's name. Not perfect as obviously the recruitment people do the initial sift so have access to all their details (and of course there can be indicators of nationality, for example, in their CV) but it's a start.

So a name that starts with something like De' or Le' is still going to catch someone's eye.

We're going to try and use a hyphenated name on the next few applications and see what happens. So, [my maiden name]-[current surname]. That might work. Plus, hyphenated names sound dead p(oh)sh, an' all, innit, so there is that.

 

[Helen Back]

I've interviewed and employed people who a different name on their ID than on the CV. No big deal at all

Ah, that's interesting. What were their reasons for doing that, if I may ask?

 

[Johnny Doe]

Ah, that's interesting. What were their reasons for doing that, if I may ask?

I didn't ask. Lots people go by something other than there given name. I wouldn't over think it

 

[Storm Fox]

I have no problem at all with someone using an Anglicised name to get an interview. I'm interviewing the person, not the name.

While I hate the fact that it even may be necessary, I'm nevertheless all for a world where employers have no option to judge people prior to interview based on anything other than their professional credentials.

Yes, but you are a good person, and if someone applied in you company with a non-english name, but had the skillset required you would interview them. The type of tosser who'd look at the name before the suitability is likely to change their mind when they found out.

 

[Badgers]

So, as an employer(?) what would you think of someone who initially applied under a different surname?

Could not have cared less.

This was not a corporate or council though.

 

[nogojones]

Go the full hog and give them a bullshit NI no. as well.

The helpful answer... as long as you can somehow justify the name change, I can't see it being a big problem. It might raise an eyebrow if there's DBS checks involved though

 

[Badgers]

I had an application a Daniel from Nigeria.

His real name was Tololupe.

At the interview he said everyone here calls me Daniel as it is easier when speaking with customers and colleagues.

No harm in that.

Worth noting he was useless and only lasted a few weeks

 

[Pickman's model]

Worth noting he was useless and only lasted a few weeks

so useless his name has stuck in your mind as the epitome of uselessness for the past however many years

 

[trabuquera]

Tenner says your family name's De'Ath which is dead posh (Norman ancestors innit) but does give pause - and getting rid of the apostrophe doesn't help.

Because of the really strong association between French names and posh ancestors in the UK I seriously doubt that a French surname is going to be prejudicing job applications. (Not saying there isn't clear evidence of racial/national discrimination against "non English" names, just that in this case it's probably not a factor IMHO.)

 

[Helen Back]

Tenner says your family name's De'Ath which is dead posh (Norman ancestors innit) but does give pause - and getting rid of the apostrophe doesn't help.

Because of the really strong association between French names and posh ancestors in the UK I seriously doubt that a French surname is going to be prejudicing job applications. (Not saying there isn't clear evidence of racial/national discrimination against "non English" names, just that in this case it's probably not a factor IMHO.)

Good guess, and a REALLY cool-sounding name - I wish it was that! But non. I mean, no. I don't know, maybe we could change it to that. What was that about deed polls?

But seriously, our name has caused website-joining problems before because of that damn apostrophe so maybe changing it to Smith would help in more ways than one.