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Is America burning? (Black Lives Matter protests, civil unrest and riots 2020)

This man was recently charged with killing a BLM protester in Omaha. He was found dead from suicide a couple of days ago:

A white Omaha, Neb., bar owner who was recently indicted for his role in the fatal shooting of a young Black man in May during racial justice protests has died by suicide, according to the man's attorneys.

A grand jury returned an indictment last week against Jake Gardner, 38, more than three months after he shot and killed James Scurlock, 22. The shooting took place during a chaotic night of protests in Omaha following the police killing of George Floyd in Minneapolis a few days prior.

Lawyers for Gardner said their client, an Iraq War veteran, had received death threats, had hired a bodyguard and had been living in California since the shooting.

The attorneys told reporters that he had recently driven to Oregon because of the wildfires and was scheduled to return to Omaha to turn himself in Sunday to face criminal charges.

An alert by the Hillsboro, Ore., police department on Sunday said officers were responding to reports that a body was found outside a medical clinic around 12:20 p.m. local time.
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NPR Cookie Consent and Choices

www.npr.org
 
Honestly I don't know if anyone has brought more people around to seeing anarchism as a positive thing than Donald Trump for quite some time. It's the kind of claim he could make and not be completely wrong, but he won't. Just imagine it! "Nobody has done more for anarchism in America than me. And I did it by myself!"
 
Jeremiah18.17 said:
“Anarchist jurisdictions?”
www.theguardian.com

DoJ labels New York, Portland and Seattle 'anarchist jurisdictions'

Department seeks to withdraw federal funds from three cities as New York governor says Trump ‘is not a king – he cannot defund NYC’
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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Portland is an "anarchist jurisdiction" (for lack of a better term) unfortunately. I hate to agree with Barr on anything but I have seen who trashed the city I live in. It wasn't right wing gangs, it wasn't cops, it wasn't capitalist elites. It was left wing extremists and wimp liberal politicians who stood idly by and let it happen.
 
TomUS said:
Portland is an "anarchist jurisdiction" (for lack of a better term) unfortunately. I hate to agree with Barr on anything but I have seen who trashed the city I live in. It wasn't right wing gangs, it wasn't cops, it wasn't capitalist elites. It was left wing extremists and wimp liberal politicians who stood idly by and let it happen.
Click to expand...

Oh no, so sad. Horrible left wing extremists. Just trashing the place! And the lib scum politicians... Just letting them!!! Terrible. Terrible. For no reason either. Just for the good old lefty fun of smashing up law abiding lives. Tragic. I mean, what's even the difference between them and the flag-loving patriots? Really? Aren't they just two sides of the same coin? The bad guys... And the good guys? The same thing really. Just so sad that the anarchists have been allowed to destroy capitalism by the complicit Democrats. Unbelievable. How could trump let this happen on his watch?
 
TomUS said:
Portland is an "anarchist jurisdiction" (for lack of a better term) unfortunately. I hate to agree with Barr on anything but I have seen who trashed the city I live in. It wasn't right wing gangs, it wasn't cops, it wasn't capitalist elites. It was left wing extremists and wimp liberal politicians who stood idly by and let it happen.
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FTR; 1) the area that was affected was about 3 blocks - a tiny, tiny part of what constitutes the total mass of the city of Portland
2) Just about every single politician and public official connected with portland and Oregan, when asked, has said that the wildly disproportionate intervention of federal forces was the major causal factor in the e=calation of conflict, and they all called for the immediate removal of those forces
3) Even the local police accepted that about 95% of the protests were nonviolent

Right now, you are basically trump's stooge. His 'useful idiot'. When pus comes to shove, you could barely get a cigarette paper between his stance and yours. If that doesn't give you pause - it should do.

Riots are what happen when you piss on people enough that they start fighting back. That's what happened.
 
TomUS said:
Portland is an "anarchist jurisdiction" (for lack of a better term) unfortunately. I hate to agree with Barr on anything but I have seen who trashed the city I live in. It wasn't right wing gangs, it wasn't cops, it wasn't capitalist elites. It was left wing extremists and wimp liberal politicians who stood idly by and let it happen.
Click to expand...

Both yourself and Marty1 use this (bolded) term.

Could you explain what it means?
 
Streathamite said:
FTR; 1) the area that was affected was about 3 blocks - a tiny, tiny part of what constitutes the total mass of the city of Portland
2) Just about every single politician and public official connected with portland and Oregan, when asked, has said that the wildly disproportionate intervention of federal forces was the major causal factor in the e=calation of conflict, and they all called for the immediate removal of those forces
3) Even the local police accepted that about 95% of the protests were nonviolent

Right now, you are basically trump's stooge. His 'useful idiot'. When pus comes to shove, you could barely get a cigarette paper between his stance and yours. If that doesn't give you pause - it should do.

Riots are what happen when you piss on people enough that they start fighting back. That's what happened.
Click to expand...
No, what happened is that leftist gangs hijacked peaceful BLM protests and vandalized and looted a large portion of downtown. This vandalism happened long before Trump sent in his forces. In this case, riots happened because leftist rioters simply enjoyed rioting. It is the rioters that gave Trump the "law and order" issue.
 
TomUS said:
No, what happened is that leftist gangs hijacked peaceful BLM protests and vandalized and looted a large portion of downtown.
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I'm trying to see if there is any difference between your intepretation of what happened - and that of every right wing nutjob and racist in America. And there simply isn't. Scratch a liberal - find a conservative lurking underneath.
Btw, you know who flatly disagrees with you on this? Just about every BLM aactivist in Portland, and everywhere else for that matter. Your reading has come about as a type of confirmation bias - it fits with your centrist prejudices and preconceptions. it's driven by them, in fact.
I'll go with the BLM comrades, thanks
 
krtek a houby said:
Both yourself and Marty1 use this (bolded) term.

Could you explain what it means?
Click to expand...
I don't know what else to call them. Perhaps I should say violent left wing extremists, or anarchists, or just rioters. As I've said, I've observed them attaching themselves to legitimate protests for years and smashing things up and fighting with the cops. They love it.
 
Streathamite said:
I'm trying to see if there is any difference between your intepretation of what happened - and that of every right wing nutjob and racist in America. And there simply isn't. Scratch a liberal - find a conservative lurking underneath.
Btw, you know who flatly disagrees with you on this? Just about every BLM aactivist in Portland, and everywhere else for that matter. Your reading has come about as a type of confirmation bias - it fits with your centrist prejudices and preconceptions. it's driven by them, in fact.
I'll go with the BLM comrades, thanks
Click to expand...
The BLM actavists in Portland are a disgrace. Very few denounced the rioters.
 
TomUS said:
I don't know what else to call them. Perhaps I should say violent left wing extremists, or anarchists, or just rioters. As I've said, I've observed them attaching themselves to legitimate protests for years and smashing things up and fighting with the cops. They love it.
Click to expand...

How do you think a rising should be conducted, Tom?

Perhaps you could take a closer look at the injustices that have been allowed proliferate for generations in the US. At how the country has historically fucked over the marginalized or those perceived as "other". At how any form of protest is painted as violent, unpatriotic, seditious, terrorist and (the latest twist, from the far right when addressing concerns of BLM) - racist!

You may just want to join the protests.

This is history now, tearing down the status quo and laying the foundations for a just and equal country.

It's always going to be messy. Sure isn't it the very nature of change?
 
krtek a houby said:
How do you think a rising should be conducted, Tom?

Perhaps you could take a closer look at the injustices that have been allowed proliferate for generations in the US. At how the country has historically fucked over the marginalized or those perceived as "other". At how any form of protest is painted as violent, unpatriotic, seditious, terrorist and (the latest twist, from the far right when addressing concerns of BLM) - racist!

You may just want to join the protests.

This is history now, tearing down the status quo and laying the foundations for a just and equal country.

It's always going to be messy. Sure isn't it the very nature of change?
Click to expand...
The violence that happened in Portland had nothing to do with injustice or the marginalized. I don't think the foundations for a just and equal country are being laid at all. I've said it before.....Animal Farm. Who/what takes over if the status quo is torn down (but, of course this will not happen anyway)? We don't know. The rioters don't say. I think that's because they will fight whatever system exists, right, left or anything else. They appear to be against all government. That's anarchism isn't it? So, by it's very nature it cannot work. And, no I will not join this protest.
 
spring-peeper said:
Is the gang from Portland?
Do they come in every night?
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The gang is from Portland. Due to the bad air quality from the wildfires the rioting has abated somewhat. Before the fires the rioting was happening just about every night. The only gangs that come from outside Portland are the right wing gangs AFAIK. They come in from the suburbs.
 
TomUS said:
No, what happened is that leftist gangs hijacked peaceful BLM protests and vandalized and looted a large portion of downtown. This vandalism happened long before Trump sent in his forces. In this case, riots happened because leftist rioters simply enjoyed rioting. It is the rioters that gave Trump the "law and order" issue.
Click to expand...

There were bad people on both sides. Some very very violent people.


TomUS said:
The violence that happened in Portland had nothing to do with injustice or the marginalized.
Click to expand...

Proper marginalised people behave in a civilised manner. They cry out against injustice in an orderly fashion.
 
TomUS said:
The gang is from Portland. Due to the bad air quality from the wildfires the rioting has abated somewhat. Before the fires the rioting was happening just about every night. The only gangs that come from outside Portland are the right wing gangs AFAIK. They come in from the suburbs.
Click to expand...


If you know they are from Portland, so should the police.
Why have the police not arrested them, put them under a curfew, or used other methods of stopping them from joining the protests?
Why have the citizens of your city not stood up and demand the gang is stopped?

So, the right wing gangs come from suburbs not from Portland.
Are you sure that the right wing gangs are not also rioting, setting fires, and all that?

How can you tell a rioter from the suburbs from the gang from Portland?
 
TomUS said:
The violence that happened in Portland had nothing to do with injustice or the marginalized. I don't think the foundations for a just and equal country are being laid at all. I've said it before.....Animal Farm. Who/what takes over if the status quo is torn down (but, of course this will not happen anyway)? We don't know. The rioters don't say. I think that's because they will fight whatever system exists, right, left or anything else. They appear to be against all government. That's anarchism isn't it? So, by it's very nature it cannot work. And, no I will not join this protest.
Click to expand...

One point about this that I agreed with on a fairly right wing podcast today was just about the way that it's been framed. The cities where it has gone to bits are 'Democrat cities' as if it's not a national problem.
I mean, that isn't what anarchism is, but the point is more that America is in deep deep trouble and the anarchist movements are not the cause of that. I have never gone that deep into Antifa but from my limited knowledge they don't seem to have any power at all, maybe I'm mistaken and there is a risk of them seizing power in the US, but they definitely did not create the conditions
 
TomUS said:
The violence that happened in Portland had nothing to do with injustice or the marginalized. I don't think the foundations for a just and equal country are being laid at all. I've said it before.....Animal Farm. Who/what takes over if the status quo is torn down (but, of course this will not happen anyway)? We don't know. The rioters don't say. I think that's because they will fight whatever system exists, right, left or anything else. They appear to be against all government. That's anarchism isn't it? So, by it's very nature it cannot work. And, no I will not join this protest.
Click to expand...
total, absolute centrist BS. Wouldn't be out of place in a Fox & friends broadcast.
You judge people by the company they keep
 
spring-peeper said:
If you know they are from Portland, so should the police.
Why have the police not arrested them, put them under a curfew, or used other methods of stopping them from joining the protests?
Why have the citizens of your city not stood up and demand the gang is stopped?

So, the right wing gangs come from suburbs not from Portland.
Are you sure that the right wing gangs are not also rioting, setting fires, and all that?

How can you tell a rioter from the suburbs from the gang from Portland?
Click to expand...
The county prosecutor will not prosecute any but the most serious offenses. This is a problem. State troopers were brought in several weeks ago to protect federal buildings. They left because of this. The right wing gangs come in to fight the left wing gangs. I can't explain the attitude of other Portland citizens.
Oregon State Police on Thursday pulled out the approximately 100 troopers helping both federal officers and Portland police in responding to nightly protests in the city that have often ended in confrontations with demonstrators and arrests......State police committed to two weeks “and that two weeks ended today,” said spokesman Capt. Timothy R. Fox......“We’re in a county that’s not going to prosecute this criminal behavior,” Fox added. The troopers will return to their regular assignments elsewhere in the Willamette Valley, along the coast, and in southern and eastern Oregon, where police staffing already is limited, Fox said.......“The Oregon State Police is continually reassessing our resources and the needs of our partner agencies and at this time we are inclined to move those resources back to counties where prosecution of criminal conduct is still a priority,” he said.
Click to expand...
www.oregonlive.com

State police pull troopers out of Portland protest coverage, return them to regular assignments

Oregon State Police on Thursday pulled its approximately 100 troopers from Portland, where they assisted federal law enforcement and Portland police in responding to nightly protests.
www.oregonlive.com www.oregonlive.com
 
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