Hamas + Fatah to make Unity government. Finally some good news...

[rachamim18]

Nino: It is factual and if there problems with the facts presented you should point them out point by point. It is exceedingly easy to make statements such as yours but actually learning what really happening and then presenting it takes a bit more effort.


Grandma Death: I already adressed you in one other thread. Please desist in your expletive laden ad hom attacks and try focusing. I know it is difficult but I promise you that this forum will be better for it. Thanks in advance.

Panda: Funny, but in most other threads where the preceeding "character" has reared its head, you have immediately followed saying the same nonsense. I will again ask, please provide such an example [other than the 3 points that screenname is whining about]. I do believe I have asked you over and over but the best I have ever received is that you are not going to do my work for me so some sort of similar nonsense. Please provide the example or play another record.

Moono: You know, since you were outed as a racist [Jewboy and shyster] I would be very careful about trying to attack a persons character. As for being a coward. To wit, I am the only person here posting under their actual name. I have also provided my home adress, employment adress [although both are not currently valid], and many other paticulars that would easily disqualify that remark. I have done so for the express purpose of cutting through remarks like yours and getting to honest intellectual conversation/debate.

It is a shame that you and others only see fit to spread hate [and not talking about your choice of words]. You and others continually choose to use blanket attacks on Israel, its Jewish citizens, its supporters, and anyone generally disagreeing with your very narrow and immature view of the world. I tend to think that you and others would get much more from this forum if you would debate issues and not personality traits, or in your case, perceived traits.

 

[moono]

Academic dishonesty, rachamim. Remember your promise to Granny. Run.

 

[Grandma Death]

Grandma Death: I already adressed you in one other thread. Please desist in your expletive laden ad hom attacks and try focusing. I know it is difficult but I promise you that this forum will be better for it. Thanks in advance.

No you have NOT addressed the point you lying toad. Again.....for the umpteenth time answer the fucking questions you dishonest maggot:

Provide me with proof that the ISM leadership admitted to doctoring photos of rachel corrie.

Evidence please that Captain "R" sucessfully sued Uvda-and the trial is over.

The producers of Uvda in that same court case admitted their show on Captain "R" was 'pure fantasy'

 

[ViolentPanda]

Panda: Funny, but in most other threads where the preceeding "character" has reared its head, you have immediately followed saying the same nonsense. I will again ask, please provide such an example [other than the 3 points that screenname is whining about]. I do believe I have asked you over and over but the best I have ever received is that you are not going to do my work for me so some sort of similar nonsense. Please provide the example or play another record.

Tell you what, I'll provide proof of your lying once you've provided Grandma Death with his long-awaited proof of your claims.

Deal, or will you try to weasel or otherwise chickenshit yourself out of this situation as is your wont?

 

[Grandma Death]

People are waiting......


It's your move toad rachamim.

 

[moono]

Run.

 

[ViolentPanda]

People are waiting......


It's your move toad rachamim.

No need to disrespect the toads, Grandma!

 

[Grandma Death]

No need to disrespect the toads, Grandma!

Apologies to toads and all pond life, they clearly occupy the moral high ground compared to the lying turd

 

[mears]

It's a useful front to try to expose the financial terrorism of the US and the EU for what it is- Islamophobic.

At worst it may bring the three idiot demands of the Quartet into the spotlight, ie;

Recognise your oppressors and their right to your country

Adhere to illegal past agreements as interpreted by your oppressors

Cease to defend yourselves.

The American/Zionists have got to try to sell these to the world whilst continuing to be observed as they collectively punish Palestine.

Oh boy hear we go. When you say "recognise your oppressors" do you mean the Palestinain coalition should recognize Israel? Or this is unacceptable?. A future Palestinian state should not recognize Isael. Thats is just advocating permanent war with your neighbor. And its going to be somewhat difficult to improve the livelihood of your citizens in permanent war.

very sad

 

[moono]

Mears, how many States don't recognise Israel now ?

How's this for hypocrisy- Pakistan doesn't recognise Israel yet Pakistan is an American ally. Simultaneously, America wants Palestine to recognise Israel, 'or else'.

You're also jumping to conclusions. Not 'recognising' Israel doesn't have to be bloody.

 

[mears]

Mears, how many States don't recognise Israel now ?

How's this for hypocrisy- Pakistan doesn't recognise Israel yet Pakistan is an American ally. Simultaneously, America wants Palestine to recognise Israel, 'or else'.

You're also jumping to conclusions. Not 'recognising' Israel doesn't have to be bloody.

They all are hypocrites, the Muslims countries who don't even treat Palestinian regugees with respect are the biggest hypocrites.

Pakistan is not on the boder of Israel. A future Palerstinian will be. They will have tons of issues to deal with like all border countries.

That is why you must recognize your neighbors, its just common sense. Not recognizing them means conflict full throttle. Its really just common sense.

 

[FruitandNut]

Ah, the trouble is that 'common sense' ain't that common.

 

[moono]

Mears, you're assumimg a 'two -State' solution. That's not the opposition's intent.

 

[TAE]

Pakistan is not on the boder of Israel.

Pakistan has nukes.

 

[ViolentPanda]

They all are hypocrites, the Muslims countries who don't even treat Palestinian regugees with respect are the biggest hypocrites.

Do you know why those countries have been historically unwilling to take Palestinian refugees (I suggest you igore the habits of a lifetime and actually do a bit of research before replying).

Pakistan is not on the boder of Israel.

Wow, this man is a geographical genius!!

A future Palerstinian will be. They will have tons of issues to deal with like all border countries.

That is why you must recognize your neighbors, its just common sense. Not recognizing them means conflict full throttle. Its really just common sense.

Since when has "common sense" had anything to do with diplomacy or governance?

 

[nino_savatte]

Nino: It is factual and if there problems with the facts presented you should point them out point by point. It is exceedingly easy to make statements such as yours but actually learning what really happening and then presenting it takes a bit more effort.

You're still having a tough time getting to grips with wee things called "facts". I simply pointed out to you that you were in the process of mythologising. I made my point, you didn't like it. Tough.

 

[mears]

Mears, you're assumimg a 'two -State' solution. That's not the opposition's intent.

What other solution is there?

But you do see the logic since you didn't comment on it. The disaster that meets Israelis and Palestinians if they don't recognize each other. Their linkage of geography,Arabs and Jews in motion crossing borders, issues of water and security.

Israel, nor any state, can bargain with an entity or country that doesn't recognize its right to exist. It a non-starter in any interactions among states.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out.

 

[mears]

Do you know why those countries have been historically unwilling to take Palestinian refugees (I suggest you igore the habits of a lifetime and actually do a bit of research before replying).

Wow, this man is a geographical genius!!


Since when has "common sense" had anything to do with diplomacy or governance?

There are Palerstinians in countries such as Lebanon and Egypt who face severe hardship. Here I will do some research for you:

"Discrimination against Palestinian refugee children is one aspect of the long-standing discrimination and abuses of fundamental economic and social rights of Palestinian refugees in Lebanon. In relation to employment, Palestinian refugees have restricted access to work opportunities and diminished protection of their rights at work. A law regulating property ownership is formulated in such a way as to ban Palestinian refugees specifically from owning property. Furthermore, the Lebanese authorities prohibit the entry of any building or maintenance material to camps in the south of Lebanon. The CRC stated that “it continues to be deeply concerned about the harsh social and economic living conditions of Palestinian refugee children in refugee camps, their limited access to public services, including social and health services and education, and exposure to violence at home, in schools and in the wider community.”
http://web.amnesty.org/library/index/ENGMDE180052006

And yet no word from the Muslim world about the plight of Palestinians in Lebanon.

Fucking hypocrites

 

[ViolentPanda]

There are Palerstinians in countries such as Lebanon and Egypt who face severe hardship. Here I will do some research for you:

There's no "r" in Palestinians.

BTW, I asked whether you knew WHY many other MENA states refuse to take in Palestinians. I already know, but doubted you did. Your "research" proves that you're ignorant of those reasons and that you haven't taken notice of a couple of simple points that have been made to you several times.

They avoided taking in large amounts of Palestinians and/or giving them citizenship because the Palestinians were far more secular and politicised than in most other MENA states, and would have destabilised those oil-producing countries that your great nation, in partnership with the power elites of those countries have been happily shovelling Islamic fundamentalism at for the last 50 years.

What was that you were saying about "fucking hypocrites"?

 

[mears]

There's no "r" in Palestinians.

BTW, I asked whether you knew WHY many other MENA states refuse to take in Palestinians. I already know, but doubted you did. Your "research" proves that you're ignorant of those reasons and that you haven't taken notice of a couple of simple points that have been made to you several times.

They avoided taking in large amounts of Palestinians and/or giving them citizenship because the Palestinians were far more secular and politicised than in most other MENA states, and would have destabilised those oil-producing countries that your great nation, in partnership with the power elites of those countries have been happily shovelling Islamic fundamentalism at for the last 50 years.

What was that you were saying about "fucking hypocrites"?

This is not the blame game. Finding a path that leads to American blame doesn't solve the problem. But yes, why would the hereditary dictatorships and theocracies running the ME want those people "secular" or "politicized" in their countries? Helping out some fellow Arabs might be nice but not at the price of losing power don't you know.

The Middle East is at a crossroads like Europe in 1914. They even borrowed some of the worst aspects of European governence, hereditary autucracies like the Austro Hungarian empire or Czarist Russia. Really countries like Syria and Saudi Arabia are a current extension of these systems. Countries in the Middle East need to come up with a new game plan. Something to release the potential of its people. Hopefully they will do a better job than Europe in the 20th century.

 

[moono]

Let's leave them alone to get on with it then.

All colonists and colonial powers please vacate by tea-time.

Quote:Originally Posted by moono
Mears, you're assumimg a 'two -State' solution. That's not the opposition's intent.


What other solution is there?

But you do see the logic since you didn't comment on it. The disaster that meets Israelis and Palestinians if they don't recognize each other. Their linkage of geography,Arabs and Jews in motion crossing borders, issues of water and security.

Israel, nor any state, can bargain with an entity or country that doesn't recognize its right to exist. It a non-starter in any interactions among states.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out.

Don't you read any alternatives to 'two-States' ?

They've lived together for thousands of years and there is nothing we can teach them about how to do it.


And I wouldn't trust a rocket scientist to feed my cat.

 

[nino_savatte]

This is not the blame game. Finding a path that leads to American blame doesn't solve the problem. But yes, why would the hereditary dictatorships and theocracies running the ME want those people "secular" or "politicized" in their countries? Helping out some fellow Arabs might be nice but not at the price of losing power don't you know.

The Middle East is at a crossroads like Europe in 1914. They even borrowed some of the worst aspects of European governence, hereditary autucracies like the Austro Hungarian empire or Czarist Russia. Really countries like Syria and Saudi Arabia are a current extension of these systems. Countries in the Middle East need to come up with a new game plan. Something to release the potential of its people. Hopefully they will do a better job than Europe in the 20th century.

Your historical knowledge of the Middle East, here, is another narrative. This is why you don't like engaging me: because I can find loads of holes in your weak arguments and I can puncture your cherished narratives.

They even borrowed some of the worst aspects of European governence, hereditary autucracies

In case you didn't know: the Hashemites were placed on the thrones of Syria and Trans-Jordan by the British and French colonialists. In Iraq they were given the throne against the wishes of the people following a rigged referendum. "They" borrowed nothing.

Finding a path that leads to American blame doesn't solve the problem

It is abundantly evident that you're too thick to understand the role that the US has played in the Middle East and you can only view this in reductive terms of 'hatred'. But that word, like so many others, is widely employed by the US right wing press to dismiss any concerns that their ideological enemies have by reducing the entire argument to the status of an emotional outburst.

You have absolutely no right to impose anything on other countries. You are always the first to shout "All America all the time" but fail to understand (or would prefer to deny) exactly how the US interferes with other countries. When you are cornered you will say "We have done some bad things"...well, duh! The US still continues to interfere.

"My country, right or wrong" be thy motto. You're blind and you're ignorant.

 

[ViolentPanda]

This is not the blame game. Finding a path that leads to American blame doesn't solve the problem. But yes, why would the hereditary dictatorships and theocracies running the ME want those people "secular" or "politicized" in their countries? Helping out some fellow Arabs might be nice but not at the price of losing power don't you know.

I don't need to "find a path that leads to American blame, you addle-pate. It's a very simple fact of history that after WW2 the US took over the British empire's role as bolster to the "stability" of middle eastern regimes, often that meant funding all comers, and more often than not that meant your pols putting money in the Muslim Brotherhood's accounts. That has meant supressing internal democratic movements in many cases, and giving the power elites of those states ample reason not to want secularised and politicised refugees from other states in their own countries.

The Middle East is at a crossroads like Europe in 1914. They even borrowed some of the worst aspects of European governence, hereditary autucracies like the Austro Hungarian empire or Czarist Russia. Really countries like Syria and Saudi Arabia are a current extension of these systems. Countries in the Middle East need to come up with a new game plan. Something to release the potential of its people. Hopefully they will do a better job than Europe in the 20th century.

What a simplistic misbegotten pile of steaming bullshit. Which no-mark conservative commentator did you crib that dungheap of a "thesis" from? Whoever it is he/she should be shot for being a simpleton.
The Habsburg and Romanov empires were the products of ancient lines, and, while autocratic by modern standards, still operated alongside (in an on again, off again manner in Russia's case) democratic institutions. Those middle eastern nations with hereditary rulers (secular or monarchical) were, for the most part, put in place by western interests, to serve those interests. Criticise Jordan, for example, and you criticise your own nation's choice of henchman. Those few nations, like Syria, who have had father folloing son without the west's influence have generally done so as to provide a "figurehead" behind which influence can be assembled, hence Bashar Assad.

 

[rachamim18]

Accept for Mears, the lot has succumbed to the usual personality nonsense...Sad.

 

[moono]

Granny is coming, Rachamaim. Run.

 

[rachamim18]

Moono: Why do you monopolosie each and every thread with the same exact nonsense? We know you are a teen and take that into account but don't you yourself ever get tired of being so childish? the subject is not me.

 

[moono]

I'm interested in ensuring that the academically dishonest are not free to roam unrecognised. Think of it as having a carbon footprint on your arse, Rachamaim.

 

[Grandma Death]

Moono: Why do you monopolosie each and every thread with the same exact nonsense? We know you are a teen and take that into account but don't you yourself ever get tired of being so childish? .

Stop fucking lying and I'm pretty sure moono will stop going on about it. It isnt too difficult to understand

 

[rachamim18]

Sigh, if anything epitomises how low this forum has actually sunk, one need merely look to the two preceeding posts. What a waste.

 

[Grandma Death]

Sigh, if anything epitomises how low this forum has actually sunk, one need merely look to the two preceeding posts. What a waste.

It sunk the minute you joined and started polluting the air with your one sided lying bullshit excuses.