Drinking ban applies to the bus and DLR as well as the tube

[George & Bill]

That makes no sense whatsoever and is totally illogical.

You have said that you object to drinking on PT in principle, but the only glimpse you've given us into your reasoning relies on the fact that alcohol, when consumed in large quantities, can make people throw up. I would like to ask if you object to people who drink on PT but are otherwise polite and do not throw up or disrupt your journey, and if so, why.

Maybe I should write a sequel to Peter and Jane

 

[George & Bill]

I'm not arguing with you anymore, you are an idiot and I can't be bothered to waste my time.

I know you are

 

[Homeless Mal]

You have said that you object to drinking on PT in principle, but the only glimpse you've given us into your reasoning relies on the fact that alcohol, when consumed in large quantities, can make people throw up. I would like to ask if you object to people who drink on PT but are otherwise polite and do not throw up or disrupt your journey, and if so, why.

Maybe I should write a sequel to Peter and Jane

I'm with Geri. Tarah!

 

[George & Bill]

I'm with Geri. Tarah!

Well thanks for your cogent and well-considered arguments

 

[Maggot]

I cannot understand the selfish mentality where poeple think they can just crack open a can wherever they choose. It shows such a basic lack of respect for themselves and others. It's really poor form.

Drinking, however, is different. In general a can of Coke doesn't change one's behaviour and make them throw up. I dare say folk on the boards may site examples where this did happen, but I'm going for commonsense here.

a can of beer generally doesn't significantly change someone's behaviour and make them throw up.

My that is splitting hairs and trying to get things to fit and suit your argument.

No it's not. You mentioned a can of beer in the first place. We are still talking about that same can of beer.

 

[miss giggles]

If you find people drinking scary in itself then I would have to suggest, with due respect, that this is something you need to deal with.

I would suggest, with due respect, drunk people need to stop leering at me on the bus, starting inane "conversations" with people who want to be left alone, and kicking the shit out of each other.

Face it, drunk people are a pain. Annoying and unpredictable, and they fucking stink. If your planning a bit of responsible, social drinking, why do you need to do it on a bus? Those of us who have to use the nightbus to get to and from work have to dodge their unwanted attention all the time.

BTW, I used to run a pub, I know exactly what drink does to people, that's why drunk people scare me.

 

[scifisam]

No, how on earth did you get that from my post? I suggest you read it again.

Drinking isn't allowed on Bristol buses and it seems to work fine. The only realy trouble is on the night buses so they have security on those.

You talked about people calling the police. That's what I got it from.

Allowing people to drink on PT in London has always worked fine too, except for a tiny minority who cause problems due to already being drunk when they get on said public transport, usually at night, like you say happens in Bristol.

I'd be all for extra security policing those who were behaving inappropriately - in fact, the money that's gone to put in this new ban would have been well spent providing extra transport police to do so - but it seems that some people think that 'drinking a can of beer' is behaving inappropriately in itself, whereas I'm more concerned about what they actually do than what drink they're holding in their hands at the time.

I would suggest, with due respect, drunk people need to stop leering at me on the bus, starting inane "conversations" with people who want to be left alone, and kicking the shit out of each other.

Face it, drunk people are a pain. Annoying and unpredictable, and they fucking stink. If your planning a bit of responsible, social drinking, why do you need to do it on a bus? Those of us who have to use the nightbus to get to and from work have to dodge their unwanted attention all the time.

BTW, I used to run a pub, I know exactly what drink does to people, that's why drunk people scare me.

Agreed.

But that really is not going to dtop by banning drinking on the the tube and buses.

You must know, that, surely? You seem like an intelligent person. You must know that, when people are drunk and lairy on PT, it's because they got that way and then got on PT?

It's odd, in a way; I can quite easily manage without a drink on the tube. I do drink, but it's not the be-all-and-end-all. I rarely drink on the way to gigs, or on the way back.

My main objection to this is the funds used for it and the mentality behind it; the main reason I've been involved in discussions on this is because I find it so strange how easily people have been taken in by this 'look at me, aren't I tough' campaign which makes no difference.

No matter how many posters you see saying that this is making everyone's journeys better, it won't. It will just cost money and create an extra 'crime' where none has been committed. Do we really need more laws?

 

[Geri]

You talked about people calling the police. That's what I got it from.

I said that unlike trains, bus drivers (here anyway) do not have additional back up and if there is trouble they are unlikely to be able to deal with it themselves and will have to wait for the police to arrive.

I didn't suggest they should call the police each and every time someone was drinking on a bus. That would be ludicrous and a waste of police resources.

In actual fact I've never seen anyone drinking on a bus in Bristol. It's just accepted that you don't do it - so no extra resources need to "police" this ban at all.

I am a drinker myself but if I'm going out for the evening, I can manage the bus journey without the need to crack open a can. To be honest, if you can't then I think you should start to wonder whether you have a problem.

 

[Termite Man]

I am a drinker myself but if I'm going out for the evening, I can manage the bus journey without the need to crack open a can. To be honest, if you can't then I think you should start to wonder whether you have a problem.

But why should people who drink responsibly not be allowed to do so on a bus , when I do drink on PT it's 1 can on the way to a gig , it doesn't make me violent or disruptive and I'm no different from other passengers . IMO the anti-social aspect of drinking on PT is coming from the perception that the same people who may drink on PT will be the ones who vomit everywhere and I have seen no evidence to back that up .

 

[tarannau]

Yep, but everyone things they're the decent ones. I like beer, but the smell of stale beery breath behind you in the sardined seats ain't pleasant really, and does have some negative connotations. I feel much the same about takeaway food for what it's worth - show a little consideration and hold till you get off the transport.

If you can't restrain yourself from swalllowing a tinny in transit, then there's a problem somewhere. Why not wait?

 

[Termite Man]

Why not wait?

because I don't really want to pay the prices that get charged at gigs for a beer .

but the smell of stale beery breath behind you in the sardined seats

I have never smelt stale beery breath on someone while they are drinking a beer , even on a packed tube when I've stood next to someone with a beer I couldn't smell beer breath , your asking that people show you consideration but why can't that go both ways ?

I agree about take away though that definatly smells , so why has eating on PT not been banned ?

 

[tarannau]

Well, why not arrive a bit earlier and swig outside till content?

On balance of things I'm just about in favour of a ban - every rule's a bit prescriptive by nature, but the positives outweigh the negatives in ths instance imo.

Surprised you can't smell beer really - spillages and rattling cans on floors are all too common around me.

As for consideration both ways, is it really necessary for the average joe, perhaps travelling home after work, to need to show consideration to someone who can't hold their desire for a beer until they get off the bus?

Takeways have been banned on some PT routes from what I understand. But drafting a rule to ban food is a little trickier - are boiled sweets with their rustling wrappers ok, are cold liver sausage sarnies any worse than a hot sausage roll in aroma terms and so on. For the sake of simplicity a no alcohol rule works just about ok in comparison - stopping myself from downing a tin on the tube/bus journey ain't that much of a hardship imo.

 

[editor]

As for consideration both ways, is it really necessary for the average joe, perhaps travelling home after work, to need to show consideration to someone who can't hold their desire for a beer until they get off the bus?

So what about people who have been on the sauce the night before and absolutely stink of beer?

Do you want them banned off the buses because they're going to smell a damn sight more than someone enjoying their first can.

This discrimination on the ground s of smell is a bit of a can of worms is you ask me. Who's next? Smelly workmen?

 

[editor]

Face it, drunk people are a pain. Annoying and unpredictable, and they fucking stink.

Agree. But the presence of a can in their hand has precious little to do with their behaviour, because by the time they get on the bus they're already pissed.

There are already laws dealing with drunk and disorderly conduct on buses, so why do you want new laws discriminating against those who are drinking responsibly and causing you no bother at all?

 

[tarannau]

So what about people who have been on the sauce the night before and absolutely stink of beer?

Do you want them banned off the buses because they're going to smell a damn sight more than someone enjoying their first can.

This discrimination on the ground s of smell is a bit of a can of worms is you ask me. Who's next? Smelly workmen?

Nope, but there's only so much you can attempt to legislate on, at least without sounding divisive or downright snobby. We may as well stick up signs with a trampy lookalike in a red crossed circle, or use a deodorant required logo in prominent positions

It's not perfect by any means - hell we've all had a tin in transit once - but on the balance of things I'm largely in favour. In a perfect world a simple 'show consideration to others' guideline would be enough, but there are too many piss taking cunts in the world who think that doesn't apply to them.

 

[editor]

It's not perfect by any means - hell we've all had a tin in transit once - but on the balance of things I'm largely in favour.

But why?

There's already laws against drunk and disorderly behaviour so are you for the ban on aesthetic grounds?

 

[Poi E]

Yep, but everyone things they're the decent ones. I like beer, but the smell of stale beery breath behind you in the sardined seats ain't pleasant really, a

That's how half of London smell on a Friday or Monday morning when they have hangovers. I don't like smokers breath, but I accept that it is part and parcel of public transport. Just like seeing people wearing offensive religious imagery like crosses, crescents and the like that remind of the worst sort of brutality imaginable.

 

[tarannau]

But why?

There's already laws against drunk and disorderly behaviour so are you for the ban on aesthetic grounds?

Because I don't care enough about the 'right' to drink booze on a short PT transport journey across London? It can be divisive and offputting to others, making some feel uncomfortable, and to be honest I can wait until I get to the other side. It's a somewhat arbitrary means to help prevent things getting towards the D&D stage perhaps, necesitating police call outs and delays for all, but so what. It stops responsible people enjoying a quiet can unfortunately, but it also provides clear guidance to drivers (who ain't paid to be bouncers assessing drunkeness and trouble causing potential) that helps them to curb problematic drunks and excitable, noisy groups swigging on their way to a party.

It's an attention grabbing line in the sand, primarily for PR win purposes perhaps. But it ain't that bad in the wider scheme of things to me.

 

[editor]

Because I don't care enough about the 'right' to drink booze on a short PT transport journey across London? It can be divisive and offputting to others, making some feel uncomfortable, and to be honest I can wait until I get to the other side.

Slippery slope, my friend.

I'd imagine a lot more people find kids in hoodies more intimidating on the buses. Do you want them banned too? How about smelly workmen? Kids being a bit too loud? Smelly blokes with hangovers? Football fans? Religious types? Where do you want to stop with this because there's always someone who'll find something objectionable.

And your argument about drunks is full of fail anyway: almost all the problems come from people who are already drunk so Boris's new aesthetic law won't make the slightest fucking shred of difference to the problem (apart from put drivers and possibly passengers in the firing line).

People should be free to quietly enjoy a drink on the bus if they choose so long as they bother no one. And it's got nothing to do with you.

 

[miss giggles]

Agree. But the presence of a can in their hand has precious little to do with their behaviour, because by the time they get on the bus they're already pissed.

There are already laws dealing with drunk and disorderly conduct on buses, so why do you want new laws discriminating against those who are drinking responsibly and causing you no bother at all?

True, but seeing people drinking is intimidating. As has already been said, why can't they wait? Are they that out of control they can't go a few stops without a can? Personally, I swerve people drinking in the street (unless I know them. ) too. Why does everybody here seem to think it's cool to drink as much as possible as fast as they can?

Actually, I agree with Tarranau. I think it's a populist tactic. I don't care much for banning things but I'm struuggling to disagree with this one. The smoking ban was much more outragous.

 

[tarannau]

Ach, it's a slippery slope to what? Stopping people having a swig on booze on the way somewhere and that's it. I can't get that worked up about it - it's a line in the sand that applies to all equally, not just to 13-19 year olds wearing certain apparel.

If they bring in a no teenagers on buses with hoodies then I'll be the first to vigorously complain.

 

[girasol]

Seeing people drinking isn't intimidating, come on!

Are people seriously intimidated by seeing someone quietly drinking a can of beer?

Drunken, agressive behaviour is intimidating, but people don't even have to be drinking anymore to behave agressively and drunkenly!

 

[miss giggles]

Seeing people drinking isn't intimidating, come on!

Are people seriously intimidated by seeing someone quietly drinking a can of beer?

2am on a nightbus, and a man climbs on with a can of beer in his hand. Yes, I am wary...

 

[Poi E]

Why does everybody here seem to think it's cool to drink as much as possible as fast as they can? .

No-one has suggested that as far as I know. Nor would they. I think the people who would like a drop on the tube are not going to be real problem drinkers. A good few of the people who rail against it have had issues with it, I bet.

 

[tarannau]

Yeah, nice slur. Can't beat the juvenile implication nor the plucked out of the arsey air generalisation that 'I think the people who would like a drop on the tube are not going to be real problem drinkers' bollocks.

For the record I do not, nor have any problem with alcohol. Apart from that time I puked on my dead nan's shoes at 13 that is.

 

[Poi E]

Yeah, nice slur. Can't beat the juvenile implication nor the plucked out of the arsey air generalisation that 'I think the people who would like a drop on the tube are not going to be real problem drinkers' bollocks.

For the record I do not, nor have any problem with alcohol. Apart from that time I puked on my dead nan's shoes at 13 that is.

So you have a problem with people's breath? Or you've been able to identify the stats pointing to the problem with people arriving on the tube and getting drunk and causing problems? C'mon then, show us the problem.

 

[tarannau]

Here comes the reductive nonsense then - I've just said on balance that I don't have a real problem with the ban. It's a minor inconvenience at best.

Surely it's incumbent on you to provide the stats seeing as though you're the one making assertions about 'problem drinkers' and the like? I can only speak for personal experience - bearing in mind that I live in not so genteel Brixton - but I've witnessed more than a few drunken incidents on PT, most of those causing the problems still swigging. That's not proof in any sense either way, but it provides some reason why some feel uncomfortable around those unable to restrain their drinking habit until getting home. All blanket bans have some losers, but this rule is more understandable and less worthy of getting het up about than most.

 

[Poi E]

Here comes the reductive nonsense then - I've just said on balance that I don't have a real problem with the ban. It's a minor inconvenience at best.

Surely it's incumbent on you to provide the stats seeing as though you're the one making assertions about 'problem drinkers' and the like? I can only speak for personal experience - bearing in mind that I live in not so genteel Brixton - but I've witnessed more than a few drunken incidents on PT, most of those causing the problems still swigging. That's not proof in any sense either way, but it provides some reason why some feel uncomfortable around those unable to restrain their drinking habit until getting home. All blanket bans have some losers, but this rule is more understandable and less worthy of getting het up about than most.

So you can't see a good reason for it, then?

 

[tarannau]

Do you have reading comprehension difficulties, or is being deliberately obtuse your only means of response?

 

[Poi E]

That's not proof in any sense either way,.

Erm, did I miss something, you pompous arse?