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December Photo Competition: "Weather"

thedyslexic1 said:
I did think this was an Photo competition not a Photoshop competition!

So it ok to retouch Images, Levels n so on. Other then change to 72 dpi

Was the hole point photo competitionof to gain more skills in photography and not have software fix errors?

I'm not a big fan of super photoshopped images, I like as little manipulation as possible, but obviously that's a personal preference - and I tend not to vote for images I feel look overdone... Still, that shouldn't stop people from entering whatever they like, as long as the manipulations used are noted.

Having said that, snadge's photo was quite amazing... I can also only admire people who can Photoshop. I only have access to PaintShopPro, but even then I mainly use the One step photo fix/clarify sparingly... as well as cropping. I'd definetely like to learn Photoshop!
 
Seeing the Jeff Wall exibition at the Tate Modern completely revised the way I think about using photoshop in photography. Now I see it as another tool to use alongside my camera. Pictures are always manipulated in some way or another.
 
Skim said:
Mastery of Photoshop is a photography skill, imo. Snadge has been been upfront about what he did to the original photo, and he's done a really good job with it – why shouldn't he win the competition?

This isn't turning into some kind of Photoshop competition. Most people haven't Photoshopped their images that much – as far as I can see, heavily manipulated photos aren't the norm in this competition, so I don't see what there is to worry about.

Couldn't agree more. I have no problem with Snadges image because the reason why it was an amazing photo was because it was a superb bit of photography...nothing to do with photoshop, photoshop can't turn a bad photo into a good one IMO.

Edited to add congratulations Snage, certainly was a superb photo.
 
thedyslexic1 said:
I did think this was an Photo competition not a Photoshop competition!

So it ok to retouch Images, Levels n so on. Other then change to 72 dpi

Was the hole point photo competitionof to gain more skills in photography and not have software fix errors?

I do agree with Dyslexic1
How much Photoshoppery is O.K?
Removing noise, resizing and croping and maybe adjusting RGB settings should be the set limits... no?

No offence or disrespect to Snadge for his great photo, and his photshop work, but where does this end... vectors?
 
Addy said:
I do agree with Dyslexic1
How much Photoshoppery is O.K?
Removing noise, resizing and croping and maybe adjusting RGB settings should be the set limits... no?

No offence or disrespect to Snadge for his great photo, and his photshop work, but where does this end... vectors?

The limits are set by how people vote. I do actually agree that Snadge's image, though impressive, is overly manipulated -- so I didn't vote for it. But the voting majority disagreed, and are clearly happy with it, so be it.
 
well, never thought that picture would cause as much discussion.

here's my take on it, what do people think of Ansell Adams' photos?

he was darkroom manipulator


the way I look at the issue, especially with my winning image is that even though the picture is exposed correctly it looked bland and washed out , this was nothing to do with my technique but the type of day in question, yes I could have waited for a day that would bring the colours out but I wouldn't of had the storm would I, so you take your chance and end up with the picture that you planned for. I knew I would have to do something to make it "special".

I usually never photoshop my pictures and here we come to another little thing, I use raw so have to use a raw converter, with raw the camera will pass up it's sharprning and saturation alogorithms to give the photographer manual control over these.

So with a raw image all I usually do when converting is sharpen and saturate a little, just as the camera would do if I used jpeg.;

do people think that would be too much?


I look upon photoshop and the Ilk as my digital darkroom just as Ansell looked at a scene with how he would manipulate it in his darkroom....


But I will always say what I have done so people know, then they make their choice
 
thedyslexic1 said:
I did think this was an Photo competition not a Photoshop competition!

So it ok to retouch Images, Levels n so on. Other then change to 72 dpi

Was the hole point photo competitionof to gain more skills in photography and not have software fix errors?

there was no error in the original? just a terrible day, :p
 
alef said:
The limits are set by how people vote. I do actually agree that Snadge's image, though impressive, is overly manipulated -- so I didn't vote for it. But the voting majority disagreed, and are clearly happy with it, so be it.


Thats why I didn't vote for it. It is a nice image though. It would almost certainly be rejected in a real photography competition in my view.
 
Well done snadge, Great image even though I didnt vote for it.

As for the photo shop debate, surely it is ok to adjust levels and improve thing slightly. The rules state you have to say what you did to it and if it turns out someone did a lot of photoshoppery then voters should see the original as snadge showed us. Then it is up to the voters to decide whether the photoshopping completed an already brilliant photo or whether it created an entirely new photo and was more about IT skills than photography skills.
 
exosculate said:
Thats why I didn't vote for it. It is a nice image though. It would almost certainly be rejected in a real photography competition in my view.

What the fuck is a "real" photography competition? Do you need a prize? For it to be run by a third party rather than the peple that take part?

Like alef said, if people don't like a picture, for whatever the reason, they don't have to vote for it. The majority did like it. The people have spoken. I have no problem with that. I still have free choice to vote as I like.

I'd much rather take part in a competition where any rules were formed by general consensus, rather than arbitrarily imposed.
 
hiccup said:
What the fuck is a "real" photography competition? Do you need a prize? For it to be run by a third party rather than the peple that take part?

Like alef said, if people don't like a picture, for whatever the reason, they don't have to vote for it. The majority did like it. The people have spoken. I have no problem with that. I still have free choice to vote as I like.

I'd much rather take part in a competition where any rules were formed by general consensus, rather than arbitrarily imposed.

spot on.
 
Perhaps black and white photographs shouldn't be allowed in 'real' photography competitions since the scene has clearly been manipulated to drain it of colour. Come to think of it, polarizers are certainly out. I'm pretty sure that ultra-wide angle lenses are questionable as well, due to the severe persepective distortion they can introduce.
 
I agree that the best snadge won because the vast majority of the people voted for him, photoshop or no photoshop.

I can't help but feel that bashing exosculate is missing the point a bit though. There are probably quite a few "competitions" that would have rejected the entry because it wasn't "real".

More the fool them for being shortsighted. It's probably why we're all here showing each other our stuff, whether we've pissed around with it in PS or not. So good on us for being mint.
 
hiccup said:
What the fuck is a "real" photography competition? Do you need a prize? For it to be run by a third party rather than the peple that take part?

Like alef said, if people don't like a picture, for whatever the reason, they don't have to vote for it. The majority did like it. The people have spoken. I have no problem with that. I still have free choice to vote as I like.

I'd much rather take part in a competition where any rules were formed by general consensus, rather than arbitrarily imposed.


I think what I said was very clear. A magazine competition is likely to reject highly photoshopped work.

What has what people voted for got to do with me expressing an opinion? Very strange.
 
Robster970 said:
I can't help but feel that bashing exosculate is missing the point a bit though. There are probably quite a few "competitions" that would have rejected the entry because it wasn't "real".


Thanks Robster - thats all I was saying.
 
i didn't particularly like snadge's pic because of the photoshopping and the shot itself (yet another shot of a big wave hittin' ground).

but if the majority liked it, with all the photohsopping and all, then therefore merits to be the winner. in this context my own opinion is of less value than that of the collective - which is fair enough, given the nature of this competion and community too.

what would be an alternative way to choose the winner? perhaps have an expert come in a choose for us? that would suck. i actually enjoy the voting. it's more fun than elections! an possibly as controversial ;)

i think the rules work fine just as the are.
 
I'm happy with the rules as they are, I mentioned the processes that I had done and took my chance ;)


I'm glad that the picture provoked as much debate, it's one of the reasons I let hiccup change an entry when he offered.

I ask one question though, if I shot on 35mm film and had entered that picture, would the divide still exist, I say this because everything that was done to that picture could have been done in a darkroom as well. ;)

food for thought.

BTW I will always state what I have done with photoshop, then other people can take that into account.

I'ts the first pic I've entered that's photoshopped ( apart from the one it replaced) :p
 
I'm glad you won with that pic, Snadge, since it generated some healthy debate. Even though Photoshop tricks can be done in the darkroom, the issue is really about to what extent should we manipulate -- and with Photoshop it's so much easier and slicker that if feels easier to cross the line, although I'm never sure where that line is...


Masonic Mystery said:
This community has a good method for their competitions, all entries are anonymous until after the results and voting is done by a rating system, so you rate each pic.

That's an interesting idea. I'd like to say that I vote on just the picture, but I have at times avoiding voting for previous winners. Focusing solely on the pics and having a rating system would be good. But, that would be a bit tricky to implement, and we already have a system that works and everyone is used to.
 
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